SACD Players: Models with DSD Processor (used and new) (not dsd converted to pcm)

Marantz, Yamaha, I have never heard their CD or SACD players.

I bought a nice Denon with dual processors, but didn't like it, too sharp, a bit bright, I found one I really like, Onkyo Integra CDC-3.4 Mark II,  but it does not play SACD, thus this search

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"Oh Happy Day,

Integra CDC-3.4 6 disc changer arrived, like new, perfect, and, despite my ’doubtful’ expectation bias:

FINALLY one that sounds preferable to my Sony. I highly recommend the sound of this with it’s dual Wolfson processors and all of Onkyo/Integra’s tricks applied.

How to describe the difference: Like my AT33PTG/II cartridge, compared to any cartridge with less tight channel balance, EVERYTHING is a speck more distinct. Not bright, not sharp, a very thin veil removed allowing refined clarity. Imaging is the same width, but within that, main vocal, backup singers, specific musicians, simultaneously more precise.

A small improvement to EVERYTHING, is a LOT!!!"

I posted this in 'better cd sound' because it matches my experience listening to SACD's 

SACD: Quieter Noise Floor is about it

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"Comparison with CD

In September 2007, the Audio Engineering Society published the results of a year-long trial, in which a range of subjects including professional recording engineers were asked to discern the difference between high-resolution audio sources (including SACD and DVD-Audio) and a compact disc audio (44.1 kHz/16 bit) conversion of the same source material under double-blind test conditions. Out of 554 trials, there were 276 correct answers, a 49.8% success rate corresponding almost exactly to the 50% that would have been expected by chance guessing alone.^[38] When the level of the signal was elevated by 14 dB or more, the test subjects were able to detect the higher noise floor of the CD-quality loop easily."

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This thread is because I finally learned, I have never heard SACD without internal conversion to PCM. Thus for me the difference is lower, seemingly bottomless noise floor, (actually can be un-naturally quiet). 

Gives me better understanding why so many stream DSD. If I buy s SACD player with SACD/DSD out, it will probably also be a streamer, but I still doubt I will ever stream in the main system.

Anyway, looking for which units pass DSD out without conversion to PCM, probably used to keep cost down.

anwar,

thanks so much, I gather the older Marantz DV8400 is not MMM version.

Elliot,

Marantz USA website lists 3 models, but elsewhere there are 4 SACD players using MMM, with SA-12SE being the latest model:

• Marantz SA-10 (with balanced XLR output)
• Marantz SA-KI Ruby
• Marantz SA-12SE
• Marantz SACD 30n

anwar,

thanks, please tell me the other specific model #s. Also, do you know if they have single or dual processors?

I am looking at lightly used ones, but it’s so hard to get clarity. Found a nearly new Marantz DV8400, Is that one SACD DSD out without conversion to PCM?

Elliott

There are 3 Marantz SACD player models (SA-10 at the top) which use Marantz Musical Mastering (MMM).  No D/A chip inside these players.  All signals up-sampled to DSD 4x using FPGA and converted directly to analog with filters.  These players are great with SACD discs and also DSD digital albums (can play using USB drive input behind).  Pick one within your budget.

It's about playing existing SACD discs directly into the system, getting the DSD off the sacd and out the player's rca's without converting to PCM's limitation within the player.

Or rip the dsf's with a $30 Sony and play them with a DSD DAC.

The newer Oppos do not convert DSD to PCM.

Marantz and Esoteric do not convert DSD to PCM. I know that Luxman players do - read that on their site somewhere. You need to be similarly aware about DACs. Many DACs can play DSD withour converting. Some do not have the ability to play DSD, which some convert DSD to PCM for playback and there is nothing you can do about that.

The Yamaha CD-S2100 and S3000 claim "native" DSD playback. You'd have to do some digging to confirm.