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Ring fly wheel stabilizer vs none.

As a potential serious problem can arise with the use of such a device,I thought I'd throw this out to some of you.

I have a dear friend who is upgrading(?)his VPI TNT-5/Air Tangent to the new 12.6 arm/TNT-6 Hotrod.It comes with the external ring/flywheel clamp,a fairly heavy affair.

To me,there is a REAL danger in using a device like this.Once again,WHY AM I NOT SURPRISED that the audio press has not uttered concerns about usage here!!I can't believe there are not others who sense a problem here.

As I understand it,this is placed on the platter with every play,and comes off to change records, using BOTH hands.In theory,I really like the idea.A flywheel effect and flattening out of records seems great.

The BIG problem,though,is that if you have the SLIGHTEST SLIP you stand a real chance of "Taking Out",not only the record in play(I have some irreplaceable,and valuable lp's),but an arm and cartridge as well!!I,years ago,was eating a slice of pizza,in my kitchen,and saw my new RS-1 Mid panel keel over and smash into my amp.Man did I hate that feeling,as well as my shag carpeting.Choked on my pepperoni too.Could you imagine your precious ZYX Universe without a cantilever?Or your six thousand dollar Shroder Reference,taking a karate chop from a multi-pound weight.Pampers are generally sold in isle #5!

Think about it.How many records do you handle in a year.DO THE MATH!!One slip up and "you are not a happy puppy"!A regular clamp is usually light,and can be applied with one hand,so the potential for danger is not really present,but you don't get the flywheel/flattening effect.BIG DEAL!The vacuum crowd,probably loves this one.

This is, ergonomically, a HORRIBLE idea,though I'm sure it helps the sound.

BEWARE!You won't get this kind of caution from your "PALS" in the mainstream press!They would likely lose precious privledges,like permanent loaners!!

I realize that this item is in use on only a few products,VPI and Clearaudio.Most of you probably don't own this Rung/Ring either,but it SUCKS to market something that is a REAL potential danger.

Now let's all read the latest"Analog Column" for a look at all the wonderful stuff coming our way!!
sirspeedy70680e509
12 responses Add your response
onhwy61's avatar
onhwy61
5,220 posts
 
So if you're an uncoordinated spazz the product is dangerous. Thanks for the update.
swampwalker's avatar
swampwalker
5,138 posts
 
Sirspeedy- Forgive me for being dense, but wouldn't you just turn the platter off while changing LPs?
sirspeedy70680e509 OP
1,064 posts
 
Swampwalker,that was what I meant.No platter movement,and you can still have a slip-up.Forget about any Merlot or Chardonnay,while playing records.Although one may feel that their coordination never sways from perfect.

Also,I only wanted to put this out.I don't mean to get into any kind of debates.I simply would never get something like this for myself.I have NO agenda,here,and love some of the products that the mfgrs,who make this type of product,sell.Anyone confident enough to go for it,I say fine for you.
bbenn
32 posts
 
As someone who has machined over 100 Outsider record weights for audiophiles all over the world, I have yet to have anyone of them comment that a) its a problem installing or removing the outside record weight, or b) that they ever experienced damage or any other related problem in removing and replacing the record weight.

Along with my 100 plus users, reveiwers from both Stereophile and The Absolute Sound clearly identified the sonic benefits from the Outside record weight. And in the case of my Outsider's, both reviewers bought the record weight.

Is the an outsider record weight right for every turntable owner and every tonearm / turntable combination? Maybe not. But I would suggest that each turntable owner make his or her own mind up, rather than accept the premise that "it SUCKS to market something that is a REAL potential danger".

the_smokester
174 posts
 
sirspeedy,
Implicit in your message is that the risk of using these rings outweighs the benefits of using them. Obviously this is a value judgement which not everyone will share.

You also assume that using a "regular clamp" has less risk associated with it. Although I have not screwed up yet, as a user of such a (heavy)clamp I do not feel that its use is risk free and remain unconvinced that it is less risky than a ring.

You also assume that if you use it once you must use it always. However, if you feel that the risk/benefit ratio is unacceptably high for certain high-value records you might forego the ring for those special cases.

Finally, handling vinyl records inherently assumes risk. The most certain thing to do is to keep your records locked in a vault and never, ever touch them let alone play them.
jeff_jones
418 posts
 
After about 9 beers I'm strictly a cd listener. Up to that point I've pretty thoroughly field tested the ring and have no worries (after about a six pack I think holding on to it actually helps stabilize you and gets you focused for the real tedious tonearm touching stuff). Happy listening!
kehut's avatar
kehut
668 posts
 
Well Sirspeedy 70680 I will agree with you.I think as long as your moving your hands and arms around the TT/arm/cart. there is always a risk of taking out your fragile cart.stylus with one false move.This can of course happen with a center clamp as well..as you could drop that too.or just being careless and not paying attention to what your hands( or wooley sweater covered forarms/elbows!) are doing. Not a good time for a brain cramp or to zone out and let the world go by.. Certainly that big ring clamp is adds to the excitement and potential danger as described.

For me though..it was purely about the sonics( or lack of) when using the ring clamp. It did nothing for my analog world to have it on. While It did flatten,press,couple,added weight, and look cool... ect...it also just plain didn't do much else for me and made it downright inconvienient to play records one after the other.I much prefer a vacuum system that I once used (AKA SOTA.) The only "upgrade" that was about equal to it's non performance capabilities was the SDI, which I also found to be useless sonically. :)Hey..I love VPI and use their products...but this is is my opinion having used this stuff!:)
kehut's avatar
kehut
668 posts
 
Thats SDS... not SDI...see, I hardly remember it. :)
onhwy61's avatar
onhwy61
5,220 posts
 
sirspeedy, sorry for the rude tone of my early post. Nothing you said deserved that level of hostility.
kehut's avatar
kehut
668 posts
 
George,

Of course I cant speak for Sirspeedy, but it was indeed honorable and gracious of you to offer your apology. I have followed some of your threads over the years and know you are a great guy and terrific member. :)
sirspeedy70680e509 OP
1,064 posts
 
Onhwy61,I did not take any offense.Thanks,though.My sole intent was to get the few vinyl lovers left in the hobby to think,a bit.That's all.Obviously any who own,or manufacture such a product will be defensive,and there are those who will never have a problem.You don't have to be a spazz to have a slip up with a clamp.I have a friend who already has!!He has been in the hobby for over 40 years.A good track record,but ONE odious event DID occu

I won't speak to this matter any longer.Just sharing thoughts,and understand the responses.Good luck,to all!
onhwy61's avatar
onhwy61
5,220 posts
 
Making music by dragging a rock at the end of a stick through a glob of semi-hard petroleum byproducts is fraught with danger. But isn't that part of the attraction? There's something special about playing a disc and knowing that the very act of playing it slightly destroys the discs. What's the real useful life of a record? 50 plays? Like live music, vinyl is not permanent. Me, I welcome the danger aspect. I don't even wear a condom when listening to vinyl.
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