Unfortunately Bob knows more about Reynaud speakers than anyone in North America and other than he and maybe a couple of dealers it is unlikely that anyone has listened to both speakers side by side. I have owned Reynaud speakers since 2002 and am currently on my fifth and six pair which are Bliss Jubilee’s and Abscisse Jubilee’s. The Bliss Jubilee is a great speaker and my favorite all time small monitor and I have owned a bunch of them including two previous Reynaud’s from the same family tree as the Bliss Jubilee. There is obviously no doubt just from looking at the two of them that the Cantabile is the superior speaker on several fronts. The larger cabinet and extra driver will give close to another octave of bass information just like my Abscisse’s do over the Bliss. Also the separated tweeter module is an improvement over the baffle mounted one and may in fact may be an upgraded driver. While Bob may in fact may be a dealer I have always found him to be honest and not try to upsell over what is appropriate with your system and room. I had a friend talk to him several months ago and he in fact attempted to talk him down a model due to his room, gear and stated preferences. Give him a call and see what he has to say. You can’t go wrong with either model but if you want or need the extra bass information you may find you need a pair of subs with the Bliss Jubilee though they need not be big expensive ones. I found a great pairing with the Bliss Jubilee’s and a pair of RSL Speedwoofers.
Reynaud Bliss Jubile vs Cantabile Jubile
Has anyone here heard the latest iterations of these two soeakers and can describe the differences. I've read Bob Neill's write-up of these two on his website, but the descriptions are a bit hard for me to grasp, perhaps not specific enough for me. They're also written by someone who is trying to sell them. I'd like to hear from those who might not have as much of stake in the game. Bob does think the Cantabile is the better speaker, but is it a small improvement or a significant one?
It's also hard to find reviews on these. There are a couple out the, but not comparing to each other.
Thanks for any insights here.
Showing 14 responses by jackd
Other than the obvious difference in bass from the multiple drivers and longer transmission line the AMT tweeter in the Abscisse is definitely more detailed and extended but whether or not that is a good thing is personal. In my experience and to my preference amps for the Abscisse need to be on the warm side of neutral. The Bliss on the other hand is a more "forgiving" speaker that just gets out of the way and makes music so that you forget about the gear. I owned four earlier Reynaud's designed by the current owners father and they were a different voicing than the son, who is a recording engineer, tends to use. According to Bob and what I hear in the Bliss it and the Cantabile beckon back to the earlier days of Jean Marie Reynaud. If you told me I could only keep one it would surprisingly to most people be the Bliss Jubilee. If the Cantabile is more of the same you can't go wrong either way and the Cantabile appears that it would actually take up less room than the Bliss' and the Magic stands. In a room that size the Bliss Jubilee might be the appropriate starting point but this is where a phone conversation with Bob could come in handy. |
The Eden's are a stand mount speaker with the tweeter below the bass driver and the Cantabile is a floor stander with the tweeter at the top of the cabinet. How have you set up the Reynaud's in relation to the set up of the Eden's in relation to positioning in the room and to your listening position? Also you need to take into account your seating height difference for the two speakers as it will be vastly different. You may need to adjust the rake angle of the Reyanud's either forward or backwards to get you in line with the driver positioning difference. If you have an adjustable height office chair somewhere in the house try it to determine the correct seating height.
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More break-in could certainly help but I have never noticed this with any Reynaud speaker utilizing their dome tweeters. Simple thing to try it to raise the spikes on the fronts and then the backs of the speaker and see if a slight tilt up or down might eliminate what you're hearing as a "shouty" quality. You are used to having the tweeter below your ears so in effect tilting the speaker so that they are either below or above might help and worth a try. Other obvious thing is to try sitting on a pillow and see what effect that has by raising you up. Don't know how far you had the Eden's from the back wall but with the Cantabile's front port you could try backing them up a little at a time and see what effect changing the angle this way has. |
Depending on the vintage the Sylvania 6 volt tubes can be pretty forward and could have much more affect than changing out speaker cables. Mullard's would of course tone it down but expensive. An alternative to them are Matsushita for less. Andy at Vintage Tube Services has them in stock. One speaker cable that will help tone the top end down for not a lot of money is the Dueland 12 gauge dual cable from Parts Connexion. Add the connectors of your choice or as they recommend use bare wire. It's what I use with the Abscisse Jubile after trying four others. Glad you found out that tilting them worked.
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Based on my experiences with six pairs of Reynaud speakers, currently Bliss Jubilee and Abscisse Jubilee, Reynaud's don't do "chubbier" bass at any level. They will do more with the Abscisse, Voce Grande and the two Orfeo versions but it it still won't be "chubbier." Those models will certainly go deeper than your Cantabile but the "character" of the bass won't be different. What you will lose though as you go up the line from your speaker is the character from the silk dome tweeter as it's replaced by the AMT of the higher models. From my experience those models require a bit more careful planning in terms of what's in front of them. And though still front ported they require a bit more breathing room. |
@jc51373 I wouldn't characterize the AMT tweeters in the models above the Cantabile as bright per se like I would the Be tweeters. They are very extended but without the hint of natural warmth the silk domes impart. This just requires careful matching with the front end gear and careful placement in the room with particular attention paid to rake angle and distance from seating position to speaker. If you can get them at least a couple of feet off of the wall behind them(more is better) and around 8' apart center to center then that is a good starting point I think they work best without a doubt with tubes in the amplification chain somewhere and Bob generally ran all of his various models with the hybrid Blue Circle gear or on occasion with Audio Note tube gear. When in the main system I had the best luck with a Supratek preamp and the Kinki Studio EX-B7 or Odyssey Kismet Reference amps. Some times during the Winter months I would swap the SS amps for an EL-34 based tube amps which would warm them up a bit more. As my main system was always in a dedicated room I was able to play around with both the speaker and seating position until I found the sweet spot but if you situation is different and your seating position is locked in the you will have to play with the speaker positioning to lock them in. A big part of this with the AMT tweeter more so than with the silk dome even is getting the rake angle right based on your seating height. As a long time Vandersteen owner over the years this was a critical part of their set up procedure so not something novel to me in setting up the Abscisse's. In the end if you pay attention to the gear, speaker positioning and seating placement you can make them sound spectacular and they will have plenty of bass compared to the Cantabile. They will not however even at their best have that same "soul factor" as either the Cantabile or the Bliss as the Abscisse is the sole creation of Jean Claude Reynaud while the other two were Jean Marie's original creations. While Jean Claude's designs have in some ways started to lean more towards the voicings of his fathers designs you still have the differences that exist between the ear of a trained pianist versus the ear of a recording engineer. If you are happy with the overall "feel" of the Cantabile have you given any thought to maybe just adding a pair of small sealed subs or will that not work in your setting? Feel free to reach out if I can help you any further.
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That seating distance should certainly work as it’s just a little under what using Jim Smith’s formula would get you and the 8’ will also be fine and depending on your room a little closer could turn out better or worse. The current equipment certainly sounds like a good mix for the Abscisse if you decide to give it a try. It is certainly going to seem more transparent right away especially if you can do the side by side comparison with the Cantabile’s before your friend takes them away. And like you said unfortunately dealers are limited as are supplies especially for the higher level models. I have a friend that waited almost four months for his pair of Voce Grandes so he had to suffer with the Abscisse’s while he waited. I had hoped that when Bob finally decided to give up the distributorship that it would have gone to someone more aggressive and promotional than a guy who has only dealt with TT’s and cartridges historically. Also doesn’t seem like JC really wants to make that big a push into the US now with the costs of shipping. Don’t think you can go wrong either way. What part of the country are you in? |
jc51373If I remember correctly what he told me when he made the direct comparison late last year, he felt the tweeter integration was superior to the Abscisse and the bass was slightly less but not dramatically so. Perfectly understandable with the smaller cabinet and less driver surface. He’s a member here so let me reach out to him and see if I can get him to respond to you directly. Also might see if you can get Bob to respond to a phone call or maybe the guys at Don Better Audio. |