@dronepunk thanks for your data. I've moved on to two main systems with dunlavy SM-1 with SC-SI passive sub and SM-I with SC-SII passive sub. I've upgraded the internal wire due to excessive oxidation of the copper showing high resistivity. Twisted dual mil spec PTFE silver tinned 18awg has yielded such beautiful results. I would not think to touch any other component of a Dunlavy x over.... Every new source, amp, or preamp upgrade reveals the insane brilliance of JD. Only Dunlavy owners know... Peace
Review: Dunlavy Audio Labs Dunlavy IVa crossover modification
Category: Speakers
Dunlavy crossover modifications starring Duelund Coherent Audio
This review has been a long time coming, and delayed because my speakers have been going through extensive modifications not originally planned. I’m writing this with great detail (which makes the review long) because I wanted anyone who is considering this project will have full insight into what is required. I apologies in advance for the length, but I strongly feel it is important to know what to expect.
This is written specifically about Dunlavy IVa speakers, but could be pertinent to other Dunlavy speakers. This project I have been considering for many years after hearing others claiming great improvement in their speaker’s performance. I finally got to the point where this project was NEEDED because of the incredible clarity I was receiving from my gold DIY interconnects. For the first time I became aware of the faults in my speakers, I was hearing the “graininess” often discussed with Dunlavy, and so I began researching.
For those of you who have read my writings, I often research every aspect I can before I delve into a project. Modifying my speakers scared the %$@& out of me, so I needed a lot of input before I could get comfortable with the idea of taking a hot soldering iron to my crossover. I read everything I could find about Dunlavy speaker modifications at many different Internet forums. I searched in vane for schematics that could help direct me, but I was told by many that no such thing was available, and in fact if it was, it would not have values listed because Dunlavy designed each crossover circuit to match the drivers it was associated with.
This meant the only way to determine the resistor, inductor and capacitor values was to actually pull out the crossover. (The crossover is easily accessed by removing the speaker cables and then the eight screws from the metal plate on the back of the speaker where the speaker cables attach. Then gently pull on the plate which is attached to circuit board. The circuit board slides in a set of groves that are used to support the board. This entire process is very simple, just be careful.) Once the board is pulled out you will find the values written on the components. Turns out this is not quite so simple, the resistors and capacitors were often bundles in groups of two or more running in “parallel” and glued together using silicon glue. In order to find the values of the components hidden by the ones on top I would need to de-solder the pieces and pull them apart. I was no where near comfortable enough with the project to do this yet, so I simply wrote down the manufacturer (Solen) the values I could see and pushed the crossover back into the speaker.
My next task was to research replacement capacitors, resistors and inductors. I wrote all my “friends” in the industry including Audiogon members, retailers, modifiers and some manufacturers to get input from those who know far more than me. One company was consistently recommended for capacitors. Mundorf MCaps, specifically MCap Supreme and MCap Supreme Silver/Oil were on the top of everyone’s list. This led me to research Mundorf’s capacitors as well as resistors and inductors.
Searching through Google for retailers that carried Mundorf I found myself at [url=http://www.partsconnexion.com/]Parts Connexion[/url], and consequently stumbled upon the best read I have seen in a very long time. THIS IS A MUST READ!!! [url=http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html]Humble Homemade hifi[/url] which is a capacitor shootout performed by Tony Gee who has posted a number of DIY projects (mostly speakers) as well as other great information. The capacitor test is an ongoing process as Tony continues to evaluate high end capacitors for both speakers and electronics. Tony found the Mundorf to be excellent products, but in April of 2006 he discovered what he now uses as his reference capacitor.
Tony’s new reference capacitors are made by [url=http://www.duelundaudio.com/]Duelund Coherent Audio[/url], and it turns out they also make resistors and inductors, but as is true with the capacitors these are not like anything I had seen before. Duelund Coherent Audio manufacturers components designed by Mr. Steen Duelund. (Sadly Mr. Duelund unexpectedly died last year, but his legacy and company are being carried on by the new owner Frederik Carøe.) These products are the result of Mr. Duelund’s lifetime's dedication to the design of audio components. His design philosophy includes an emphasis on phase coherence and the exclusive use of diamagnetic materials wherever possible.
This link is to an excellent review regarding crossover modifications done by [url=http://www.tnt-audio.com/accessories/duelund_xover_e.html]TNT-Audio[/url]. This next link is to a forum where the man posting, the owner of [url=www.bd-design.nl]BD-Design[/url] did a [url=http://www.bd-design.nl/forum/forum_entry.php?id=10753]comparison[/url] of a number of the Duelund capacitors.
Similarly to how I handled the information gathering process with my other short listed capacitors, including Mundorf, Amp Ohm, Clarity Cap, Audyn Cap, Sonic Craft, Multi-cap and Jensen capacitors, I wrote the manufacturer directly about my needs. Because Duelund had not yet established a dealership in the US, I was lucky enough to speak directly with the Duelund owner and consequently developed a good relationship with him. At the time Duelund’s products they were only handled in North America by Parts Connexion, Canada. The line has subsequently been picked up by [url=http://www.e-speakers.com/products/duelund.htm]E-Speaker[/url] and [url=www.electrumaudio.com]Electrum Audio[/url].
After a number of conversations with Duelund’s owner, I learned a great deal about his company and more importantly I gained perspective on their incredible dedication to building the best products possible. These guys were special, and I became sold on working with them to re-build my crossover network.
The first issue of business was to determine what exact components and values my crossover had. This required me to de-solder a number of the cheap Solen sand wire wound resistors and the Solen capacitors to see what were underneath the top components. While trying to separate the sand resistors I cracked the sand casing down to the element on two of the resistors. Because the actual element was not damaged, I was told I could still use it, so I soldered them back in and emailed the values to Duelund.
I was not able to see a value posted on the existing inductors, so I needed de-solder them and measure the values myself. I emailed them to Duelund so they could know the required values on the midrange inductor (foil type) and the bass (toroid type) to replace the Solen wire coil inductors. Within a day I received an email with an attached schematic that was their interpretation of what I sent them. I then verified the information, and re-drew a schematic for them with the verified information along with some missing information regarding the bass design.
From this sketch, the Duelund engineers were able to determine the “critical” components that needed to be upgraded. The remaining components were of less importance, and because of my budget constraints we decided to only replace the critical capacitors, resistors and inductors.
It turned out the one (and only) capacitor and resistor on the positive circuit of the tweeter were to be replaced. The midrange required one capacitor, one resistor and one small inductor be replaced. Finally the inductor on the bass circuit was also identified to be upgraded. The price quote for two capacitors 826.00 Euro, or $1090.00, one pair 5.6 µF (tweeter) copper and one pair 10.0 µF (midrange) copper. The resistors at 1.65 ohm and 0.62 ohm were 60 Euro, or $79.20 and the two inductors, 4.42 mH (166), 0.082 mH (68) were 234 Euro, or $308.88.
The total of 1166 Euro, or $1539.12, including shipping is certainly not cheap, and might be considered insane for a speaker that can be bought for under $3000 at Audiogon. To further drive home the price disparity consider the Vifa tweeter used in the IVa sells for $25 each.
As I awaited the fabrication and delivery (within two weeks) I ordered Mundorf MOX (metal oxide) resistors from E-speaker for $3.50 each to replace the remaining wire wound sand resistors. When the package arrived from E-speaker I de-soldered the crossover board from the internal speaker wire. As I was doing this, I noticed the exposed copper from the internal wires were seriously corroded and actually bright green. I tried to determine how much of the wire was corroded by removing more of the wire jacket and found it was no more than a couple inches; but that is a good indication of the quality wire used in the Dunlavy speakers. It is clear the wire will require replacement too. This is a big project in itself, so I ignored the wire for now and proceeded to remove the crossover entirely from the speaker so I could work on it.
The installation of the Mundorf MOX resistors was quite simple; they ended up being just the same length as the original sand wire wound. I then reinstalled the crossover for a listen. Much cleaner, no change in tonality or pace, I just had an easier time seeing the instruments. Many people have recommended this affordable and easy modification, and I fully concur. At a very minimum, change the resistors. It will not affect any of the attributes that you love in your Dunlavy speakers; it will just make them cleaner and clearer.
Once the Duelund components arrived I again removed the crossovers. I then removed the tweeter and primary midrange capacitors and resistors but was asked by Duelund to wait with the inductors so I could see what each component was doing. The step of installing these new components was a bit trickier than the MOX resistors. The Duelund capacitors are rectangular, almost square in shape and look rather like an English cigarette pack or possibly a fancy dark chocolate bar. In fact my wife bit in to one, damn her, and of course I had to bury her after that. Oh what a waste.
Due to space limitations on the existing crossover board, the capacitors required installation on edge. I mounted them in a silicon glue and strapped them down using cable ties. In the perfect world an external crossover would be used with the components mounted flat where vibration would have less affect. The side mount is less than ideal, and inside the speaker means the capacitor must vibrate, but I have no idea how much this affects the sound. I was able to place one of the leads out of the capacitor directly into an existing hole on the circuit board. The other lead required a small piece of wire to connect it to the other hole.
The resistors are quite a bit longer than the original, but they come with long enough leads to run them along the outside of the resistor body and into the original mounting holes. I again mounted these in silicon glue. Once these components were mounted I reinstalled the crossover into the speaker and took a listen.
Oh my God, this was very clean and very clear. I likened it to a computer monitor where the resolution had been set at 800 x 600 dpi and it was increased to a stunning 1600 x 1200 dpi. Everything had such incredible refinement. Not more detailed or etched, it just was so much clearer in focus. This was a new experience for me in audio. The new components did not make any more information appear, everything I was used to hearing remained, but so much more refined. This alone would be worth the effort, but the most striking thing was how smooth the treble sounded. It was literally silky smooth, liquid and effortlessly flowing. I was mighty impressed, and feel this was a major step forward in performance of my system. The problem I encountered however was with the clarity of my interconnects added to the modified speaker I sensed I was very much hearing the flaws of a $25 tweeter.
This led me on another search, this time ending at [url=www.madisound.com]Madisound Speaker Components, Inc[/url] for a premium tweeter. They were able to spec a very closely matched tweeter made by Seas, a Norwegian speaker manufacturer. I ordered two at about $200 each and while I was waiting, I installed the inductors. This however was not quite that simple. The toroid bass inductor was smaller than the original wire coil type. Originally there was a small .22µF capacitor installed in the center donut of the wire coil inductor. In order to mount the tighter smaller toroid inductor I needed to relocate the small cap. It turned out there were unused holes in the circuit board that were usable to install the small capacitor off to the side of the new inductor.
Once the inductors were installed the bass seemed tighter and better defined. The soundstage was definitely deeper with much stronger imaging. But there was a real issue, the treble was glaring, edgy and way to up front. In that the inductors had nothing to do with the tweeter, and I still had the original tweeter installed, I figured the issue was at the crossover point of the midrange. Perhaps it was cutting off the midrange at a higher frequency than originally designed, thus accentuation the highs??? I wrote Duelund and within an hour I had a reply. (Now remember they are seven or so hours different than me, and it was clearly after hours. This type of service was consistently what I received. Duelund quite possibly has the best service and communication of anyone in the industry, at least in this case.) I was told to re-install the existing inductors and verify what I heard. Before I did so, I measured both the existing and the new inductors once again. I then returned the original inductors to the crossover. I was now very aware of the added grain in the original inductors. I had not been aware of this graininess prior to swapping inductors, but it was quite noticeable now.
As I said, before I installed the original inductors back into the crossover, I measured the value once again. The original inductors measurements did not match the new inductors; in fact they did not match the value that they were built to. The only explanation is the hand held meter I was using was out of calibration, and by a sizable amount of about 0.008 mH at the lowest value parameters, or in the case of the midrange inductor this is about ten percent. The crossover design accepts 5%, this clearly put the smaller inductor out of design parameters.
For the bass inductor this was within 2%, so we concluded it should be acceptable and within the design limits. Duelund wanted to verify that we had the right value before they build another pair of inductors for the midrange, so they put together a few wire wound inductors in different values. They sent them to me within a week and had me solder them in. We finally settled on a value, and they built a new set of foil type inductors. I soldered them in, and the treble settled down for the most part.
Now if you have been paying attention, and you’re not sound asleep yet, you may recall I ordered new tweeters. Before I tested the various wire coil inductors I installed the new tweeters. This was not so easy however, I was requires to cut a notch at the hole where the tweeter slid in. This was not a huge deal, but certainly outside the expected project parameters. I used a small Xacto saw that I use for building ship models. This turned out to be a perfect saw. Once the new tweeter was mounted I sat back and listened. This was a very significant improvement. The first most startling thing is if I put my ear right next to the tweeter it is crystal clear. The existing tweeter (and midrange) has a sharp, even painful noise at that distance. As a result even more graininess was gone. The highs sparkle in a very smooth and silky fashion. Now the extreme highs were effortless, and so much more open and transparent.
It has been a couple months now, and any burn in needed is over. I looked into replacing the midrange drivers but it is tough to find a match. Besides given the fact that still today I am not sure I quite have the tweeter sounding as balanced as the original design, so altering the midrange drives might be a huge mistake. Yes the speakers sound much clearer, cleaner, more liquid, soooooo smoooooth and the resolution is incredible. But clearly just replacing speakers does not quite resolve everything. Changing midrange drivers without a better understanding of how to tune a crossover would be too dangerous. The woofers it turns out were upgraded to premium cones when the speaker went from the model IV to the IVa, so there is nothing to gain in replacing them.
Next step for my project was to use a couple of smaller Mundorf silver in oil capacitors to bypass a big 82 µF Capacitor in the midrange. It is not feasible to replace this big capacitor with something vastly better. Mundorf does make an 82 µF capacitor, but it would not necessarily be any better than the Solen. I added a .56 µF and a .01 µF bypass capacitors, these seem to tame the treble just a bit further. These also seem to clean the midrange slightly, maybe a bit smoother.
So if I was to conclude the entire experience thus far, I would say that there is a great deal to be gained by modifying these speakers. Simply replacing all the resistors will have a significant impact on the sound. Replacing the capacitors made a significant improvement, so much so that I felt I was hearing the flaws of the cheap tweeter used in the IVa. This was not acceptable, and I could hardly go back, so I needed to replace the tweeter. Replacing the tweeter probably changed the value I should use for the capacitor and resistor. This is an assumption on my part, and something way beyond my knowledge and ability. Changing speaker cones is in affect re-designing the speaker and should not have been done by me without some better understanding of how crossovers work. The inductors proved to me I should have taken them to a technician to do the measurements just to avoid the problems I had, but once I found the right value, the inductors made a huge difference. The soundstage is real, deep and defined in a very three dimensional fashion.
Would I do this again? Yes, and I would probably make the same mistakes. If I knew more about speaker design and the way crossovers work I might have had a better result in the treble, but even now I refuse to take the time to read and learn. I am not big on reading technical dry papers. I would rather jump in way over my head and hope I can swim.
I should state that I am not quite complete. I intend to replace the remaining capacitors with Mundorf MCap Supremes. I will also be bypassing all the capacitors with Vishay Roederstein MKP 1837 as recommended in the Humble Homemade HiFi capacitor shootout. I also expect to replace the internal wiring, but that is not as easy as it sounds because I must remove all the drivers. I have just received Eichmann binding posts to get rid of the poor sounding brass posts that are standard on the speakers. I will post the results of these projects as they unfold.
jd
I want to add one final word on Duelund Coherent Audio. I have had the opportunity through my reviews to get to know a number of manufacturers in this hobby. I have further developed relationships with all sorts of “professionals” in audio, and I can easily say Duelund, and specifically the owner, Frederik Carøe is as enjoyable a person to work with as I have found. Beyond that, his personal attention and service was beyond reproach.
Add to the great service the wonderful sounding components and I have a hard time imagining using any other company for a project of this type with a health budget. I am most pleased. Below I have pasted a description of there components as described at the suppliers web sites.
Frederik Carøe
Owner
Duelund Coherent Audio
Tel. +45 28 27 52 40
www.duelundaudio.com
info@duelundaudio.com
Copenhagen
Denmark
The Duelund Coherent Audio Virtual Stack Foil Capacitor
A capacitor made specially for loudspeaker crossovers.
This new capacitor is the realization of a lifelong ambition. It consists either of pure aluminum foil, pure copper foil or pure silver foil and high-density paper, soaked in pure mineral wax, treated with special lacquers made from natural materials and wrapped in natural paper.
Unlike all other audio capacitors available no form of unnatural sound degrading materials are used. No metallization and plastics such as polypropylene are employed in the construction of these capacitors as the ensuing negative influence on the signal is unacceptable.
The stack-foil design ensures very low inductance, forming a solid block resulting in a form free of internal resonances. While the technical background may sound humdrum, the sonic splendor these capacitors make possible is anything but. The capacitors are made by hand in order to ensure the strictest tolerances possible.
Resistors
Designed by DUELUND Coherent Audio of Denmark for Loudspeaker Cross-Over these 10 to 15 watt non-inductive (they are purely resistive, since they are a solid element and have no electrical characteristics of a coil) resistors utilizing graphite as the resistive element, and pure silver wire for the lead out material. A phenolic cylinder is used to protect the resistive element itself.
The special characteristic about this resistor is that it displays a negative temperature coefficient. For example, when the voice coil of a speaker heats up, its impedance rises. The DUELUND Graphite Resistor counteracts this by means of a decreasing impedance. The results are greatly improved dynamics from the driver.
TOROID INDUCTORS
With a core made from special materials our aim has been to target hysteresis and saturation in ways that has not been done before. These coils will transform your speakers if used in conjunction with your speakers' midrange- or bass drivers.
Furthermore, the inductors can be placed adjacent to each other without degrading their performance.
Associated gear
Sony SCD-1 with all avalible modifications by Richard Kern, run off a Shunyata Research original Hydra. Aesthetix Calypso pre-amp, Plinius SA-102. Jade Audio 99.99% pure solid gold interconnects, Kubala-Sosna Emotion speaker cables and power cords, many tweaks.
Dunlavy crossover modifications starring Duelund Coherent Audio
This review has been a long time coming, and delayed because my speakers have been going through extensive modifications not originally planned. I’m writing this with great detail (which makes the review long) because I wanted anyone who is considering this project will have full insight into what is required. I apologies in advance for the length, but I strongly feel it is important to know what to expect.
This is written specifically about Dunlavy IVa speakers, but could be pertinent to other Dunlavy speakers. This project I have been considering for many years after hearing others claiming great improvement in their speaker’s performance. I finally got to the point where this project was NEEDED because of the incredible clarity I was receiving from my gold DIY interconnects. For the first time I became aware of the faults in my speakers, I was hearing the “graininess” often discussed with Dunlavy, and so I began researching.
For those of you who have read my writings, I often research every aspect I can before I delve into a project. Modifying my speakers scared the %$@& out of me, so I needed a lot of input before I could get comfortable with the idea of taking a hot soldering iron to my crossover. I read everything I could find about Dunlavy speaker modifications at many different Internet forums. I searched in vane for schematics that could help direct me, but I was told by many that no such thing was available, and in fact if it was, it would not have values listed because Dunlavy designed each crossover circuit to match the drivers it was associated with.
This meant the only way to determine the resistor, inductor and capacitor values was to actually pull out the crossover. (The crossover is easily accessed by removing the speaker cables and then the eight screws from the metal plate on the back of the speaker where the speaker cables attach. Then gently pull on the plate which is attached to circuit board. The circuit board slides in a set of groves that are used to support the board. This entire process is very simple, just be careful.) Once the board is pulled out you will find the values written on the components. Turns out this is not quite so simple, the resistors and capacitors were often bundles in groups of two or more running in “parallel” and glued together using silicon glue. In order to find the values of the components hidden by the ones on top I would need to de-solder the pieces and pull them apart. I was no where near comfortable enough with the project to do this yet, so I simply wrote down the manufacturer (Solen) the values I could see and pushed the crossover back into the speaker.
My next task was to research replacement capacitors, resistors and inductors. I wrote all my “friends” in the industry including Audiogon members, retailers, modifiers and some manufacturers to get input from those who know far more than me. One company was consistently recommended for capacitors. Mundorf MCaps, specifically MCap Supreme and MCap Supreme Silver/Oil were on the top of everyone’s list. This led me to research Mundorf’s capacitors as well as resistors and inductors.
Searching through Google for retailers that carried Mundorf I found myself at [url=http://www.partsconnexion.com/]Parts Connexion[/url], and consequently stumbled upon the best read I have seen in a very long time. THIS IS A MUST READ!!! [url=http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html]Humble Homemade hifi[/url] which is a capacitor shootout performed by Tony Gee who has posted a number of DIY projects (mostly speakers) as well as other great information. The capacitor test is an ongoing process as Tony continues to evaluate high end capacitors for both speakers and electronics. Tony found the Mundorf to be excellent products, but in April of 2006 he discovered what he now uses as his reference capacitor.
Tony’s new reference capacitors are made by [url=http://www.duelundaudio.com/]Duelund Coherent Audio[/url], and it turns out they also make resistors and inductors, but as is true with the capacitors these are not like anything I had seen before. Duelund Coherent Audio manufacturers components designed by Mr. Steen Duelund. (Sadly Mr. Duelund unexpectedly died last year, but his legacy and company are being carried on by the new owner Frederik Carøe.) These products are the result of Mr. Duelund’s lifetime's dedication to the design of audio components. His design philosophy includes an emphasis on phase coherence and the exclusive use of diamagnetic materials wherever possible.
This link is to an excellent review regarding crossover modifications done by [url=http://www.tnt-audio.com/accessories/duelund_xover_e.html]TNT-Audio[/url]. This next link is to a forum where the man posting, the owner of [url=www.bd-design.nl]BD-Design[/url] did a [url=http://www.bd-design.nl/forum/forum_entry.php?id=10753]comparison[/url] of a number of the Duelund capacitors.
Similarly to how I handled the information gathering process with my other short listed capacitors, including Mundorf, Amp Ohm, Clarity Cap, Audyn Cap, Sonic Craft, Multi-cap and Jensen capacitors, I wrote the manufacturer directly about my needs. Because Duelund had not yet established a dealership in the US, I was lucky enough to speak directly with the Duelund owner and consequently developed a good relationship with him. At the time Duelund’s products they were only handled in North America by Parts Connexion, Canada. The line has subsequently been picked up by [url=http://www.e-speakers.com/products/duelund.htm]E-Speaker[/url] and [url=www.electrumaudio.com]Electrum Audio[/url].
After a number of conversations with Duelund’s owner, I learned a great deal about his company and more importantly I gained perspective on their incredible dedication to building the best products possible. These guys were special, and I became sold on working with them to re-build my crossover network.
The first issue of business was to determine what exact components and values my crossover had. This required me to de-solder a number of the cheap Solen sand wire wound resistors and the Solen capacitors to see what were underneath the top components. While trying to separate the sand resistors I cracked the sand casing down to the element on two of the resistors. Because the actual element was not damaged, I was told I could still use it, so I soldered them back in and emailed the values to Duelund.
I was not able to see a value posted on the existing inductors, so I needed de-solder them and measure the values myself. I emailed them to Duelund so they could know the required values on the midrange inductor (foil type) and the bass (toroid type) to replace the Solen wire coil inductors. Within a day I received an email with an attached schematic that was their interpretation of what I sent them. I then verified the information, and re-drew a schematic for them with the verified information along with some missing information regarding the bass design.
From this sketch, the Duelund engineers were able to determine the “critical” components that needed to be upgraded. The remaining components were of less importance, and because of my budget constraints we decided to only replace the critical capacitors, resistors and inductors.
It turned out the one (and only) capacitor and resistor on the positive circuit of the tweeter were to be replaced. The midrange required one capacitor, one resistor and one small inductor be replaced. Finally the inductor on the bass circuit was also identified to be upgraded. The price quote for two capacitors 826.00 Euro, or $1090.00, one pair 5.6 µF (tweeter) copper and one pair 10.0 µF (midrange) copper. The resistors at 1.65 ohm and 0.62 ohm were 60 Euro, or $79.20 and the two inductors, 4.42 mH (166), 0.082 mH (68) were 234 Euro, or $308.88.
The total of 1166 Euro, or $1539.12, including shipping is certainly not cheap, and might be considered insane for a speaker that can be bought for under $3000 at Audiogon. To further drive home the price disparity consider the Vifa tweeter used in the IVa sells for $25 each.
As I awaited the fabrication and delivery (within two weeks) I ordered Mundorf MOX (metal oxide) resistors from E-speaker for $3.50 each to replace the remaining wire wound sand resistors. When the package arrived from E-speaker I de-soldered the crossover board from the internal speaker wire. As I was doing this, I noticed the exposed copper from the internal wires were seriously corroded and actually bright green. I tried to determine how much of the wire was corroded by removing more of the wire jacket and found it was no more than a couple inches; but that is a good indication of the quality wire used in the Dunlavy speakers. It is clear the wire will require replacement too. This is a big project in itself, so I ignored the wire for now and proceeded to remove the crossover entirely from the speaker so I could work on it.
The installation of the Mundorf MOX resistors was quite simple; they ended up being just the same length as the original sand wire wound. I then reinstalled the crossover for a listen. Much cleaner, no change in tonality or pace, I just had an easier time seeing the instruments. Many people have recommended this affordable and easy modification, and I fully concur. At a very minimum, change the resistors. It will not affect any of the attributes that you love in your Dunlavy speakers; it will just make them cleaner and clearer.
Once the Duelund components arrived I again removed the crossovers. I then removed the tweeter and primary midrange capacitors and resistors but was asked by Duelund to wait with the inductors so I could see what each component was doing. The step of installing these new components was a bit trickier than the MOX resistors. The Duelund capacitors are rectangular, almost square in shape and look rather like an English cigarette pack or possibly a fancy dark chocolate bar. In fact my wife bit in to one, damn her, and of course I had to bury her after that. Oh what a waste.
Due to space limitations on the existing crossover board, the capacitors required installation on edge. I mounted them in a silicon glue and strapped them down using cable ties. In the perfect world an external crossover would be used with the components mounted flat where vibration would have less affect. The side mount is less than ideal, and inside the speaker means the capacitor must vibrate, but I have no idea how much this affects the sound. I was able to place one of the leads out of the capacitor directly into an existing hole on the circuit board. The other lead required a small piece of wire to connect it to the other hole.
The resistors are quite a bit longer than the original, but they come with long enough leads to run them along the outside of the resistor body and into the original mounting holes. I again mounted these in silicon glue. Once these components were mounted I reinstalled the crossover into the speaker and took a listen.
Oh my God, this was very clean and very clear. I likened it to a computer monitor where the resolution had been set at 800 x 600 dpi and it was increased to a stunning 1600 x 1200 dpi. Everything had such incredible refinement. Not more detailed or etched, it just was so much clearer in focus. This was a new experience for me in audio. The new components did not make any more information appear, everything I was used to hearing remained, but so much more refined. This alone would be worth the effort, but the most striking thing was how smooth the treble sounded. It was literally silky smooth, liquid and effortlessly flowing. I was mighty impressed, and feel this was a major step forward in performance of my system. The problem I encountered however was with the clarity of my interconnects added to the modified speaker I sensed I was very much hearing the flaws of a $25 tweeter.
This led me on another search, this time ending at [url=www.madisound.com]Madisound Speaker Components, Inc[/url] for a premium tweeter. They were able to spec a very closely matched tweeter made by Seas, a Norwegian speaker manufacturer. I ordered two at about $200 each and while I was waiting, I installed the inductors. This however was not quite that simple. The toroid bass inductor was smaller than the original wire coil type. Originally there was a small .22µF capacitor installed in the center donut of the wire coil inductor. In order to mount the tighter smaller toroid inductor I needed to relocate the small cap. It turned out there were unused holes in the circuit board that were usable to install the small capacitor off to the side of the new inductor.
Once the inductors were installed the bass seemed tighter and better defined. The soundstage was definitely deeper with much stronger imaging. But there was a real issue, the treble was glaring, edgy and way to up front. In that the inductors had nothing to do with the tweeter, and I still had the original tweeter installed, I figured the issue was at the crossover point of the midrange. Perhaps it was cutting off the midrange at a higher frequency than originally designed, thus accentuation the highs??? I wrote Duelund and within an hour I had a reply. (Now remember they are seven or so hours different than me, and it was clearly after hours. This type of service was consistently what I received. Duelund quite possibly has the best service and communication of anyone in the industry, at least in this case.) I was told to re-install the existing inductors and verify what I heard. Before I did so, I measured both the existing and the new inductors once again. I then returned the original inductors to the crossover. I was now very aware of the added grain in the original inductors. I had not been aware of this graininess prior to swapping inductors, but it was quite noticeable now.
As I said, before I installed the original inductors back into the crossover, I measured the value once again. The original inductors measurements did not match the new inductors; in fact they did not match the value that they were built to. The only explanation is the hand held meter I was using was out of calibration, and by a sizable amount of about 0.008 mH at the lowest value parameters, or in the case of the midrange inductor this is about ten percent. The crossover design accepts 5%, this clearly put the smaller inductor out of design parameters.
For the bass inductor this was within 2%, so we concluded it should be acceptable and within the design limits. Duelund wanted to verify that we had the right value before they build another pair of inductors for the midrange, so they put together a few wire wound inductors in different values. They sent them to me within a week and had me solder them in. We finally settled on a value, and they built a new set of foil type inductors. I soldered them in, and the treble settled down for the most part.
Now if you have been paying attention, and you’re not sound asleep yet, you may recall I ordered new tweeters. Before I tested the various wire coil inductors I installed the new tweeters. This was not so easy however, I was requires to cut a notch at the hole where the tweeter slid in. This was not a huge deal, but certainly outside the expected project parameters. I used a small Xacto saw that I use for building ship models. This turned out to be a perfect saw. Once the new tweeter was mounted I sat back and listened. This was a very significant improvement. The first most startling thing is if I put my ear right next to the tweeter it is crystal clear. The existing tweeter (and midrange) has a sharp, even painful noise at that distance. As a result even more graininess was gone. The highs sparkle in a very smooth and silky fashion. Now the extreme highs were effortless, and so much more open and transparent.
It has been a couple months now, and any burn in needed is over. I looked into replacing the midrange drivers but it is tough to find a match. Besides given the fact that still today I am not sure I quite have the tweeter sounding as balanced as the original design, so altering the midrange drives might be a huge mistake. Yes the speakers sound much clearer, cleaner, more liquid, soooooo smoooooth and the resolution is incredible. But clearly just replacing speakers does not quite resolve everything. Changing midrange drivers without a better understanding of how to tune a crossover would be too dangerous. The woofers it turns out were upgraded to premium cones when the speaker went from the model IV to the IVa, so there is nothing to gain in replacing them.
Next step for my project was to use a couple of smaller Mundorf silver in oil capacitors to bypass a big 82 µF Capacitor in the midrange. It is not feasible to replace this big capacitor with something vastly better. Mundorf does make an 82 µF capacitor, but it would not necessarily be any better than the Solen. I added a .56 µF and a .01 µF bypass capacitors, these seem to tame the treble just a bit further. These also seem to clean the midrange slightly, maybe a bit smoother.
So if I was to conclude the entire experience thus far, I would say that there is a great deal to be gained by modifying these speakers. Simply replacing all the resistors will have a significant impact on the sound. Replacing the capacitors made a significant improvement, so much so that I felt I was hearing the flaws of the cheap tweeter used in the IVa. This was not acceptable, and I could hardly go back, so I needed to replace the tweeter. Replacing the tweeter probably changed the value I should use for the capacitor and resistor. This is an assumption on my part, and something way beyond my knowledge and ability. Changing speaker cones is in affect re-designing the speaker and should not have been done by me without some better understanding of how crossovers work. The inductors proved to me I should have taken them to a technician to do the measurements just to avoid the problems I had, but once I found the right value, the inductors made a huge difference. The soundstage is real, deep and defined in a very three dimensional fashion.
Would I do this again? Yes, and I would probably make the same mistakes. If I knew more about speaker design and the way crossovers work I might have had a better result in the treble, but even now I refuse to take the time to read and learn. I am not big on reading technical dry papers. I would rather jump in way over my head and hope I can swim.
I should state that I am not quite complete. I intend to replace the remaining capacitors with Mundorf MCap Supremes. I will also be bypassing all the capacitors with Vishay Roederstein MKP 1837 as recommended in the Humble Homemade HiFi capacitor shootout. I also expect to replace the internal wiring, but that is not as easy as it sounds because I must remove all the drivers. I have just received Eichmann binding posts to get rid of the poor sounding brass posts that are standard on the speakers. I will post the results of these projects as they unfold.
jd
I want to add one final word on Duelund Coherent Audio. I have had the opportunity through my reviews to get to know a number of manufacturers in this hobby. I have further developed relationships with all sorts of “professionals” in audio, and I can easily say Duelund, and specifically the owner, Frederik Carøe is as enjoyable a person to work with as I have found. Beyond that, his personal attention and service was beyond reproach.
Add to the great service the wonderful sounding components and I have a hard time imagining using any other company for a project of this type with a health budget. I am most pleased. Below I have pasted a description of there components as described at the suppliers web sites.
Frederik Carøe
Owner
Duelund Coherent Audio
Tel. +45 28 27 52 40
www.duelundaudio.com
info@duelundaudio.com
Copenhagen
Denmark
The Duelund Coherent Audio Virtual Stack Foil Capacitor
A capacitor made specially for loudspeaker crossovers.
This new capacitor is the realization of a lifelong ambition. It consists either of pure aluminum foil, pure copper foil or pure silver foil and high-density paper, soaked in pure mineral wax, treated with special lacquers made from natural materials and wrapped in natural paper.
Unlike all other audio capacitors available no form of unnatural sound degrading materials are used. No metallization and plastics such as polypropylene are employed in the construction of these capacitors as the ensuing negative influence on the signal is unacceptable.
The stack-foil design ensures very low inductance, forming a solid block resulting in a form free of internal resonances. While the technical background may sound humdrum, the sonic splendor these capacitors make possible is anything but. The capacitors are made by hand in order to ensure the strictest tolerances possible.
Resistors
Designed by DUELUND Coherent Audio of Denmark for Loudspeaker Cross-Over these 10 to 15 watt non-inductive (they are purely resistive, since they are a solid element and have no electrical characteristics of a coil) resistors utilizing graphite as the resistive element, and pure silver wire for the lead out material. A phenolic cylinder is used to protect the resistive element itself.
The special characteristic about this resistor is that it displays a negative temperature coefficient. For example, when the voice coil of a speaker heats up, its impedance rises. The DUELUND Graphite Resistor counteracts this by means of a decreasing impedance. The results are greatly improved dynamics from the driver.
TOROID INDUCTORS
With a core made from special materials our aim has been to target hysteresis and saturation in ways that has not been done before. These coils will transform your speakers if used in conjunction with your speakers' midrange- or bass drivers.
Furthermore, the inductors can be placed adjacent to each other without degrading their performance.
Associated gear
Sony SCD-1 with all avalible modifications by Richard Kern, run off a Shunyata Research original Hydra. Aesthetix Calypso pre-amp, Plinius SA-102. Jade Audio 99.99% pure solid gold interconnects, Kubala-Sosna Emotion speaker cables and power cords, many tweaks.
25 responses Add your response
@vn101606 yes, thank you. I have a Dunlavy HR-CC that is similar to the IVa and it uses 2mH for the 10”’s . I imagine as it’s recommended to use close to floor. Does anyone here have Dunlavy SC-IIIA’s? or, Aletha, Athena or Corinthian’s? I really need the inductor size for the downfiring SS25w woofer. Or any components in the bass XO. thanks again |
JD, Thanks for sharing you experience! Lots of good info. I am curious about the inductor values you posted of 4.42 mH and .082 mH. Were these the Duelund Engineers tested values ? and were they the final values used? also could you share the measured DCR values? A schematic I found on another forum indicated inductor values as follows: 0.16mH-0.16 Ohm, 8.2mH- 0.8 Ohm. Pretty different. I will measure the DCR values on mine when I remove, however I don't have the equipment to precisely measure inductance. If anyone else has any data in SC-IVA crossover inductors it would be most appreciated. Cheers! |
Dear JD, My congrats for the excellent work that you have done. I bougt in 1997 the Dunlavy SC-IV and I still have them. I like this speakers but sometimes I would like smoother highs. Could you kindly tell us which is exactly the model of Seas Crescendo tweeter that you have installed? Many thanks in advance. Carlo |
Hello JD, Following you footsteps I changed the tweeters of my Dunlavy SC-VI to top Seas Crescendo and it was a great upgrade, very similar specifications, sound much better. I also vastly upgraded the crossover with Duelund. My other components keep getting changed, but not the speakers, which sound amazing. https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/795 Cheers, VPN |
Hello Owen, Do you think I'm a complete idiot? Step back and read, YES SIR, THE SPECS DO INDEED MATCH IDENTICALLY!!! Why the h&^$ would I post anything about the tweeter if not for teaching. I posted my experience so people could learn that despite an exact match in specifications, the sonic qualities are different. Yes, the Dunlavy speaker is built to an exact specification, many tests and ... ...TO A PRICE POINT. If there was not budget constraints (keeping the Dunlavy IV below the V) then I'm sure John would have considered better quality parts. That was never John's goal with his speakers. He strives to make a speaker at an affordable price point that would compete with more costly speakers. He succeeded many times over, but that is not to say the quality of the components are not suspect. Of course the tweeter was a bold change. I'm not stupid! The tweeter also made a significant difference in clarity, grain and openness. It also appears (to the ear) as having a increased treble energy.) I reported this as a fact, that to my ear, so that others might learn. I thought I was quite clear about the risks involved with this modification, as well as all the others. If the purpose of writing a post was to be perfect, than I could never write a word for I am very far from perfect. If the purpose of writing is to share experiences (as the novice you so eloquently pointed out, NOT) then I believe I did a great job, and you need to calm down. Perhaps a bit less coffee... It certainly was nice hearing from you. jd |
Owen not everyone who responded to this Dunlavy thread or other posts about these same speakers changed out any of the five drivers. Most all posters including myself made changes in crossover quality, wire and cabinet coupling only. Much of this has been written,posted and added here over a five year time span. Tom |
After reading everything above it has become apparent that nobody on this thread has much technical knowledge. I'm not trying to rain on the parade here, but there are some serious issues with the approach taken by JD. Robert hints at the problem above, but doesn't quiet make it clear. Trying to "mod" your speakers by replacing the original tweeter with a more costly unit would be the same as trying to upgrade your Dodge Neon by jamming a Formula 1 engine under the hood - it just doesn't work like that. The reason the Dunlavy speakers sound good is because they're properly designed using proper testing equipment, years of experience, and a whole lot of trial and error. By replacing the tweeter with one that "looks physically the same" you've gone and ruined the entire design process. Did you check to make sure the TS parameters were identical? Does the efficiency match? Is the frequency response, resonance, and impedance identical? If the answer to any of the above is no, then you have to re-design the entire crossover to accomodate the new tweeter. Upgrading a few capacitors is not a re-design. A tweeter isn't like a capacitor. If you replace a cap with one of equal value and voltage rating, you don't alter the fundamental design. The tweeter on the other hand, is an electro-mechanical device, and unless it exactly matches the other unit, you're changing the fundamental design of the speaker so much that there's no way to tell what you'll end up with. If you're going to head down that road then you may as well start from scratch and design a proper speaker with top quality parts and top quality crossover components using proper technique and measurement equipment. Trust me, it'll be cheaper than spending $3000 on a pair of finished speakers, and then rebuilding them with another $2000 worth of "modding" parts. Stick to simple cap / resistor / inductor upgrades, and whatever cabinet tricks you feel like. Leave the woofer, tweeter and midrange the way they are. Speaker design is not a trivial task, nor is it black magic. You don't just mix and match various expensive parts of arbitrary value to make a good speaker. Almost all tweeters look very similar, but trust me, they aren't the same. Anyhow, the rest of your work looks pretty good, and congrats on the crossover upgrades, hopefully those caps sound as good as they look! Regards, Owen |
HI JD6 :-) C-37 is another good idea,but i never tried it on cone.i have a touch with it only throught website rewiew.shellac is acoustically very friendly material but very expensive in terms of hand made coating. i am using it as wood finish with significant improvement to velvet(vacuum tube-like) and definition(focus in image,air,being "there") of the Sound. next i want to describe,is yout tweeter replacing . size (basket dimensions) is not the most important.. matching of the parameters is general task. resonance frequency ,impedance curve and sensitivity plays a game.original tweeter was made to Dunlavy specs by OEM department of Vifa.finding a match is like a win in lottery.so you miss a life chance to win money :-))) .. more questions?.contact me via mail,please. |
Robert, Thank you for your excellent thoughts. Given the language translation, you did a great job getting your ideas across, and gave very good descriptions of sonic expectations. The time phase is an issue, but the premium tweeter I replaced the existing tweeter with is physically exactly the same size. The only difference physically was where they have the wire connectors. This was why I needed to modify the cabinet by adding a small notch to allow for this. I have given a great deal of thought to using C-37 violin shellac for the mid-range which should give a large improvement and then I can avoid the problems of substituting a premium mid-range driver. Your magnet thoughts are very interesting, I will give that one some thought. I agree that the next two biggest improvements will be in internal wiring and an external point to point crossover. At any rate, it's fun to see us trying to improve these wonderful speakers rather than trying to find a replacement. Given how good they are, and how those who like the sound of Dunlavy will need to spend a lot of money to match the quality of these speakers, modifying them seems to make a lot of sense. It's also terrific having an international discussion. I love Audiogon for that. jd |
ROBERT-VOXARAUDIO,SLOVAKIA hi guys .. first i must send a pray to heaven to Mr.Dunlavy for things he did for our ears. after reading this thread some ideas to share appear in my head. sc 4 is time (phase) coherent design so every changes in 3-d geometry must change time domain arrival of acoustic pressure .changing of bass units must by considered according to membrane geometry and i think its much better give a try to better existing woofers(decribed by mr.Dunlavy like a technologicaly not on top in cca 1996)..so try this.. increse BL figure by adding aditional magnet ring to existing magnet( from burned-out car woof bass unit.be maximally carefull with handling and attaching them to place.immediate increase of force is dangerous to your fingers and ring will be dammaged too )..increase will add "live" to bottom end and lift-up deepest octave.it brings a increase in sensitivity too,which is not needed.. attenuation of this phenomena of adding extra ring I use to "abuse" to cone damping with special coating (4-5 layers LTS 50 from VISATON solution 1:1 or 1.5 with water painted on old turntable in concentic circles continually from edge to center with paint brush.DO NOT FORCE DRYING WITH HEAT GUN,LEAVE NATURALY DRY OUT IN ROOM APROXIMATELLY 30 MINUTES )resulting in smoother midrange and better look . try this with midrange with 3 layers too.. next idea is to replace MOX resistors with Caddock mps resistors on alu cooler (take original insulation washers too)from old computer switching supply.. it will result in highest possible tranparency without residual harsh(caused by thermally generated noise in transients in carbon layer).. next tip is internal wiring replacement with ultimate Cardas wire in proper size bought like OEM for internal speaker wiring in meterware.contact Cardas distributor near you.try teamwork with order.this decision to use Cardas wire lift your previously invested money somewhere you can hardly imagine.. i using Cardas in my top construction with Duelund caps and Mundorf supreme and matching of sound characters is magic(allow burn-in for month).. try remake your existing printed board to point-to point wiring .. next increase of air and sharper bodies of instruments is on the way.. |
JD well written and composed. Here are some of the additional mods I performed on my Dunlavys several years ago. All brass non ferrous hardware used thru out not steel of any sort. Paint internal surface with V=Bloc from Cascade Audio . V-Bloc is not a damping agent but a water based sealer that fills the pores of the wood, dries like concrete not rubber. V-bloc vibrational transfer agent made the biggest difference of all the mods I did to my SC4's and was also the most labor intensive. Mods were all applied in single stages ..replacement of inductors resistors and all caps. Crossover was outboard hard mounted on 1/4in. 2024 aircraft aluminum plate and then placed on Sistrum Sp1 coupling platform. Wiring harness consisted of 10 identical lengths of Sonoran Plateau speaker cable soldered directly to each speakers individual terminal.Speaker itself set atop Sistrum 101 coupling platform. Sounded speactacular, as big as they were they were gone, nothing but a wall of sound side to side and floor to ceiling..There is no reason why any speaker would not perform better with any of the mods JD described. The pain in the butt part is also the cool part. Perform each mod individually this adds to your learning curve and memory bank of knowledge as the mod progresses. Be patient all these parts need to breakin as individual components and then meld together as a group. Jd you offered much and you succeeded. Tom |
Robbyg, Did you replace the internal wiring? What gauges did you use? I removed the bases many many years ago. My speakers have no base and are supported with three Aurios Pro's with Black Diamond Racing pucks against the speaker and Tungsten balls between the Aurios/BDR pucks. This isolation technique is posted on my virtual system isolation page. With the Aurios, the vibration issue is completely gone. I also use one 1/2" Walker disk and one 1" walker disk on the top of the cabinet. At any rate, you are very correct that the stock bases MUST be removed and replaced with something better. Thanks for your comments, jd |
A great effort on your part, but it is all electrical. I had the SC-IV's and also made some mechanical modifications that I thought helped improve the the speaker dramatically. Change the bases to one's made by Sound Anchor in Florida. These are spiked and steady the speaker. On your new Eichman speaker terminals, be sure to solder them in. One major improvement that I made was to solder the wires directly to each driver. You should consider this when changing your wire. And last but not least is to install on the back of each speaker Tekna Sonic C-10's (4) & C-5 (1) vibration absorbers. Now the box will truly disappear. |
