This last couple of months more of you have been getting ahold of me, it's cool don't stop. I enjoy working on your systems and especially enjoy some listening together. Something though is coming up often and it's making me wonder if somewhere along the way someone has dropped the ball when it comes to comparing components. In talking with a few of you I've learned that a lot of you are dropping components into your systems and comparing without dialing your system into the new set of conditions. Back in the early days of referencing, before plug & play, when we made changes to a system we treated the system as if everything was starting from scratch. We knew that if making a component swap took place that we were going to need to make the rest of the audio chain suitable to accommodate the new signal path. "make a change anywhere in the flow and you've made a new flow"
When the plug & play audio clubs started popping up my friends looked at me as if these folks were off their rockers. I just figured they were doing something interesting but weren't really serious about club night, more than a chance to mingle. It's kind of the same thought as a trade show. You don't really take them serious, but it gives a chance to meet and greet. Saying this, I'm starting to think possibly I was wrong and plug & play has become the norm over actually referencing systems. My mind tells me this is nuts, right, but I'm hearing more and more that HEA folks are actually simply dropping components in mid chain and that's it. So I have to ask.
You do realize plug & play is different from referencing a system change don't you?
Reading elizabeth’s posts above, and not going into theory and practice of loosening electrical connections, one has to conclude major differences between people who prefer "referencing" (as described by elizabeth) and those who prefer plug-and-play.
Those who do not mind "referencing" have much more free time, or less of other interests.
"Plug-and-play" crowd is less dedicated to the hobby of hunting what might have been.
In other threads, people talk how "audiophilia" is an aging hobby. How wouldn’t it be? If it would require such measures as working on your outlets or changing something for each record/CD/file played, who would have time? Young people rarely have time to play with that, unless their job is to sell whatever is needed for "referencing". This is a "hobby" for retirees. Nothing wrong with that, but it surely is time-consuming when done any other way but plug-and-play.
I wouldn't say our hearing is a fairly limited sense.
"The problems of deafness are deeper and more complex, if not more important, than those of blindness.Deafness is a much worse misfortune. For it means the loss of the most vital stimulus--the sound of the voice that brings language, sets thoughts astir and keeps us in the intellectual company of man. "…after a lifetime in silence and darkness thatto be deaf is a greater affliction than to be blind... Hearing is the soul of knowledge and information of a high order. To be cut off from hearing is to be isolated indeed."
Blindness cuts you off from things. But deafness cuts you off from people.
I just wrote you a manual on screw adjusting and then my computer rebooted. LOL isn't that the way it goes. Maybe I will get a chance to do it again tomorrow. Also when you get into this a little, consider starting a thread on TuneLand. Some of this is easier to do when we use pictures, drawings and words. Plus on TuneLand you will have others Tuning with you "referencing". Or yet another option is I can do a thread there and link to it if I do an illustration.
Oh wow this so cool discussing on tuning those outlet screws. Its great that Elizabeth tried it, I did mine 3 years ago just a tad and it opened up the sound along with a bigger sound stage and bass extensions was more too. I had to turn down the volume on my pre, its like i gained some extra dB. But one must becareful not to over do it there is a sweet spot getting them tuned in perfectly.
Maybe once you get the hang of it then can work on your equipments side. Turning those screws doesn't take long at all but getting them tuned in and reap those benefits can take a while at the beginning. But once you get the hang of it then it will be pretty fast to work on them. Tapping on the equipment chasis and hearing that resonance gives a good clue on how would they sound.
I would be remiss if I didn’t mention that mechanical stress and strain are not good for the sound. Without getting too far afield you can test this theory by using ordinary plastic spring loaded clothes hangers, attaching them to interconnects and hearing how it hurts the sound. One of the benefits of Cryogenically treating audio related things, e.g., CDs, LPs, cables, tonearms, even musical instruments such as trumpets, flutes, etc. is the reduction of mechanical stress and strain 🥵 Coincidence? You decide. So, you could say there’s a fine line between adjusting pressure on audio things like speakers and components, trying to reduce vibration, and producing mechanical stress and strain that hurts the sound - either directly or indirectly.
If tapping on a component or shelf hurts the sound don’t tap on them while the music is playing. So I disagree that tapping gives you much of a clue about what’s going on. For example, the ringing or clunking sound produced by tapping a large thick slab of granite with a small hammer 🔨 cannot be reproduced by acoustic waves or seismic vibrations in the room. They aren’t energetic enough. Thick granite slabs are not very vibratory. Obviously, it depends on the material, mass (inertia) and size especially thickness.
If tapping on a component or shelf hurts the sound don’t tap on them while the music is playing. So I disagree that tapping gives you much of a clue about what’s going on.
I never said tap the chasis while the system is playing and nothing about shelves (this is another story) thats what Geoff is thinking which is way off then what im saying.
Its about tapping the chasis "without any music on" and hearing that resonance from the chasis itself. When you tap that resonance tells a story, what i will do is start to unscrew some of them just by a tad the idea is to get them to resonate at the same level or should i say hear that sound when you tap and get them sounding more or less the same. That will relieve the stress on certain areas of that chasis from your equipment.
In other threads, people talk how "audiophilia" is an aging hobby. How wouldn’t it be? If it would require such measures as working on your outlets or changing something for each record/CD/file played, who would have time? Young people rarely have time to play with that, unless their job is to sell whatever is needed for "referencing". This is a "hobby" for retirees. Nothing wrong with that, but it surely is time-consuming when done any other way but plug-and-play.
>>>>>Oh, no he didn’t!!
Youth is wasted on the young.” - Old audiophile axiom
My Tru Tone Duplex Covers are actually ceramic acoustic resonators. Now the thing with resonators is they must be free to resonate. If they’re constrained they aren’t effective. Like a tuning fork. So, when I recommend loosening the two screws holding the ceramic Duplex Cover to the wall it’s to allow the Duplex Cover to dissipate the wall vibratory energy more efficiently. You want the ceramic plate free to vibrate in order to reduce the effects of vibration on the sound. Contradictory, ain’t it?
If tapping on a component or shelf hurts the sound don’t tap on them while the music is playing. So I disagree that tapping gives you much of a clue about what’s going on.
I never said tap the chasis while the system is playing and nothing about shelves (this is another story) thats what Geoff is thinking which is way off then what im saying.
>>>>I’m afraid you misinterpreted my comments. What I’m saying is people oft times overreact to the tapping test. The kinetic energy involved in tapping doesn’t exist in the room under normal conditions. I was partly joking about tapping the chassis whilst music is playing. Lighten up!
Loosening electrical outlet screws may be to someone's liking, but what is the point talking about it without first establishing what material they are made of?
Not to go to deep into explaining it to you, but material an item is made of does influence its properties regarding vibration. I could not quantify it, but I would guess it is more influential than loosening the screw (unless you go to inconvenient extremes elizabeth referenced above).
Don't you wish you could come up with more than one variable to take care of? You do it so well but it’s such a narrow range.
What’s this, glubson - your new Beavis and Butthead routine?
Not to make a big rumpus out of it, but has your auto spell checker crashed? Remember, it’s not too late to go back to school. You’re cute when you get mad. On the positive side it’s heart warming to see Lizzie found a soul mate.
I do not employ a spell checker. Not even a spelling-checker.
I do not know what Beavis and Butthead routine is. I will check it, but first have to get to checking that Tar Baby.
As far as school goes, you are right, it’s not too late to go back to school so feel free to attend. You can even ask questions and I will guide you to answers.
I spent all day spinning & voicing Type4 "white". That is after I got back from the curing house. Spring has sprung and so people have been coming out to greet the nice weather. My first year here at Tam was interesting. After the first person got a system from me you could see the folks peeking in to see what was happening. No real talk about tuning, more that audio guy down in #205. After the second system a little more interest. The next and then next, the folks around here all talk music now. Not just talk music but you see them visiting each other. I’m told by the landlord this sense of community started when I moved in. Before then they kept to themselves.
When I can I like doing wire voicing myself, or any voicing. From one end of the outside walkway to the other is about 70’-80’. Now it is a common sight to see me out there early in the morning running the wire. By the end of the day you will see me doing the final de-stressing of the cable for that day. The destressing part I will do as many days as it takes. There’s a lot more to it but I bring this up because we were talking about the screws. Anything that spins it’s not a matter of tightening and loosening, but more developing a pattern of flow and making that flow adjustable, like opening and closing a gate for the vibratory interactions.
back to today
So here I am in the beginning of the day running wire. The last suite at the end of the walkway you have two guys (now tunees) talking off and on all day. They weren’t paying much attention I’m sure in the beginning but I would walk from one end of the walkway to the other and back, voicing the wire as I went. After the spin when you let go of the cable the stress would make the cable fly all over the place. The cable looks very unruly (wiggly). At that time cable companies usually make a master roll, which forces the wire into cable form, I don’t. What I use is a technique that allows the wires to relax on their own.
I'm not going to get into the process obviously, but the whole thing last about 6 months start to finish, with different things done to the wire to prep it (natural cure baking is one of them). So here I am making trips up and down the walk way and about my next to last trip one of the guys says to me "that can't be the same cable". Yep it's the same run I started with. It took him a while to believe that this unruly wire was now this perfectly relaxed cable that ran the whole length now totally in a straight line and relaxed, with no slight wiggles at all.
"On the other hand I am not really interested in this stuff. After spending a good part of a year fooling around adjusting and breaking in stuff I am ready to take a tweak vacation. No more tweaking.."
LOL, tweaking vacation. You make it sound like work :)
Plug & Play now that's work, tweaking that's work, but Tuning in the variables now that's just plain fun.
Hi Michael its great to hear you are working on the Whites I will definately need more of them especially on my equipment side :).
On to the screwing topic lol, its a real treat to tune them I guess most people here do understand what is it all about. In my experience working on those equipment chassis and outlets has truly brought out a different level of tuning experience. The effect is big and best part its tottaly free to work on all you need is an appropriate screwdriver size that's all.
Now on to Elizabeth's infection, I had that upgraditis and it was a big one lol!! but once Michael introduced me to his tuning world all I can think now is where is my next tuning challenge ;).
I'm excited to hear this! If you want can you give me a break down of your system. The more I can see into your setup and sound the easier it will be to make suggestions.
As I've said before you can always have your own thread on TuneLand as well if you would like me and the other Tunees to look at the system. Main thing is finding that comfort level and pace of doing things that make the most sense to you. I have listeners who take their time and other folks that after a couple moves go all in.
Also keep in mind, I don't care whether you ever buy any of my products or not, so hopefully you don't feel weird talking to a person who is in the audio business. As people post about Tuning here I get plenty of inquires about the methods and products and that is my promotional end game. For the sake of Agon I'm more about promoting the variables of audio and showing listeners that there are adjustable solutions to their sonic adventures. I'm in touch with the Audiogon team so that they know what I'm up to and also if they ever add to the forum "designer direct" forums we as a company are interested in that. For me it's all about you doing the variables and sharing them with others. Once the main HEA listeners get comfortable in referencing and adjustability they will see how the system becomes an easy to use tool.
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