Question for Atma-sphere, will expensive power cables improve your amplifiers?
The reason I am asking is I feel manufacturers of high quality components include all that is ever needed, power cable wise. Sure, some people buy power cables because they need special lengths or have some out of the ordinary "noise" issues that need extra insulation. Some even like the visual aspect of the aftermarket cables. I’m just curious why many spend thousands of dollars on such when the manufacturer has taken the power cable into account when producing the product. I cannot see a High-quality audiophile component maker (especially some that sell volume) pass on a few dollars for a better sounding power cable if indeed the cable improved their product. I cannot see a person buying that $7000 amp is not going to balk if the product was introduced at $7100 (with the better cable).
I wonder if Luxman, Accuphase, McIntosh, Gryphon...you name it "dressed" their power cables up to look like expensive aftermarket cables, owners would be so quick to "upgrade"?
I’d be curious to hear Ralph’s opinion on the subject
Showing 16 responses by jea48
@aberyclark I doubt atmasphere reads through new threads/posts daily on Agon. Chances are he would miss this thread of yours. There is a way you might get his attention and he might respond to your thread. Might... JMHO, you come off with a negative bias right out of the gate. Anyway, this should let him know you mentioned him and his company. @atmasphere, "Question for Atma-sphere, will expensive power cables improve your amplifiers?" . |
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Different strokes for different folks. Not everyone’s taste is the same. If a manufacturer included a $500.00 + power cord for a piece of high end audio equipment that would increase the price of the equipment by $500.00, or higher, for what ever the price of the power cord is. I can already hear the customer say to the dealer, "I don’t want that power cord. I use this brand." Read page 8 ... The power cord can have audible effects! A good cable is recommended. . |
@oberoniaomnia, aren't both cables in the photos above DC power from the power supply to the receiving equipment. Wouldn't that be comparing apples to oranges. .
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The rectified DC is filtered through electrolytic caps to smooth out the full wave DC ripples and then in many cases is run through DC regulators. The AC power cord plugs into a wall outlet. Hard tell what its about to receive. The good, the bad, and the ugly... . |
True for the majority of OEM mass produced power cords. For power amplifiers they may sound fine. For digital equipment not so much. Most audiophile power cords are not built using three stranded wire conductors. Solid vs stranded conductors will make a difference. Very few audiophile cables made today use stranded wire. Method of conductor and cable geometry used can change the sound heard from an audio system. Shielding can make a difference. Sometimes for the worse in sound. Depends on how it’s implemented. Type of the wire used, therein the Hot and neutral current carrying conductors, can make a difference. Agree the connectors used, male plug and female IEC connectors, can make a difference.
For OEM power probably. Depends on the wire gauge used. For an audiophile power cord not really. 5ft - 6ft seems to be pretty common.
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Yes, a single solid core #14awg or a single solid core #12awg wire, or a #10awg solid core wire would not meet electrical safety code for a power cord. Several smaller gauge solid core wires individually insulated grouped in parallel together for the Hot and neural conductors, for use in a power cord, will/does meet NRTL safety testing. AudioQuest was making power cords back in the 1980s paralleling multiple small gauge solid core insulated wires together to make a combined equivalent single gauge conductor for the Hot and neutral conductors. I sill have a couple of non shielded AudioQuest AC-12 power cords. It’s equal to a 12awg X 3 cable using four separate solid core 18awg cu OFHC insulated wires conductors for the Hot conductor and four for the neutral conductor. A 12awg stranded green insulated wire is used for the EGC, Equipment Grounding Conductor. The conductors were assembled together in what AQ called a "Hyperlitz design". The individually insulated eight #18awg solid core wire conductors were placed surrounding the #12awg stranded insulated EGC. That design had to be the EE in Bill Lowe. It cancels out the EM fields from the hot and neutral current carrying conductors from inducing a voltage onto the EGC. Fast forward to today high end audiophile power cords manufacturers are still using AQ’s use of using individually insulated solid core wire conductors. Though the wire gauge size of insulated solid wire varies in the design. I’ve read where some will have a mix of 18awg and smaller solid core individually insulated wires, and some add Lintz (insulation) wire in the mix. The geometry construction of the power cord has greatly changed as well since the 1980s. And most of the building of the cable is done by had, from my understanding. . |
@devinplombier said: 03-25-2025 at 10:56pm
. In reference to: @mclinnguy post: on 03-25-2025 at 09:38pm
LOL I think this should also be used in trying to understand what is being said. @mclinnguy Said: 03-25-2025 at 09:38pm
Several years ago, on Audio Asylum forum a guy built a DIY power cord using CAT5 twisted 4 pair data cable. WOW!. 120Vac. Available short circuit fault current at the wall outlet for a 20 amp circuit could easily be in the hundreds of amps before the breaker will trip. I have read on audio forums where DIY power cables where built using Speaker cable. I wouldn’t be surprised if some audiophile out there has built a DIY power cable using coaxial cable to build a power cord. Years ago I used to post a photo of a power cord sold by an audiophile internet company showing 3 single insulated conductors twisted together with only a loosely protective covering of a cellophane plastic. WOW. Going from memory the wires were 16AWG. FYI, unless the circuit breakers in your electrical panel are AFCI (Arc Faualt Circuit Interrupter) type breakers they will not trip in the event of an arcing fault. Therein Hot to neutral, or Hot to Ground or all the above. Burn baby burn until sparks fly causing a fire. Even then the breaker may not trip. Continuous current in the faulted circuit over the handle rating is required for the breaker to trip open. . |
@immatthewj Said:
Not really. It would merely be an extension of the in wall branch circuit wiring. Example of a solid core wire power cord. Pangea Audio AC 9SE MKII Signature Power Cable 2 Meter Click on left side #7 image.
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No, that could create another problem. No power disconnecting means at the hard wired piece of equipment. A plug and receptacle is an approved disconnecting means. Also, imo, the hard wired Romex in no way could be considered as a power cord. .
Probably one of the most miss understood grounds by audiophiles. . |
@immatthewj said:
. In response to my post:
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That’s definitely important for feeding a power amplifier. Not really an issue feeding a solid state DAC though. But with that said in 1998-1999 I bought a new Arcam alpha 9 CDP that Stereophile gave, as I recall, a B+ review rating. It would have been A- except for,... which I can’t remember. I swear the power cord at best was 16awg wire. A flimsy looking cheap power cord. Ya, plenty big for a unit that says on the rear panel by the IEC inlet 20VA max. (20 watts max). For the heck of it I had an unused OEM 14/3 power cord that came with an ARC amp. I hooked it up to the Apha 9. The CDP sounded better to me. Why? Beats the heck out of me. Don’t knock it, until you try it! .
Like I said, i don’t think of the power cord as an extension of the branch circuit wiring. It is said the power cord is not an extension of the in wall branch circuit wiring, but rather an extension of the audio equipment AC power wiring. Some say it’s the last 5ft to 6ft of the power wiring feeding the equipment. What ever an aftermarket power cord does, at least from my personal, and umpteen other audiophiles listening experiences, they do hear differences from aftermarket power cords. Some power cords for the better, and others for the worse. I think it has a lot to do with the equipment it is connected to. I get kick out of posts where a guy says there can’t possibly be a difference in power cords. If the wire gauge is big enough for the connected load of the equipment that’s all that matters. But then they say, they tried a so called audiophile power cord and their OEM power cord sounded better. What??? A power cord can’t possibly make a difference but the audiophile power could did not sound as good as the OEM cord that came with the equipment. Can’t have it both ways. . |
What was wrong with the OEM power cord that came with the equipment you installed the audiophile power cord on? https://www.audiogon.com/systems/11950 . |
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