New DAC or New Streamer?

Or all in one streamer + dac + pre + tube...😎

Don’t know if you have followed this thread. The OP has a separate Denafrips  DAC and VAC preamplifier that he’s happy with.

Charles 

@fthompson251 Thank you, but I have already made an agreement to buy and Aurender N200 from a Forum Member.

Hi and congratulations!

Please let us know your listening impressions.

Charles

@l3uzz 

Appreciate your listening impressions of two highly regarded audio streaming components. Audio Troy mentions this comparison pretty regularly. Nice to hear from someone who was present during this encounter.

Charles 

@lalitk 

Thanks for the link.

Charles 

@lalitk 

Thank you very much for your input and recommendations. Yes, I’m going to get the new DAC into my system and develop a degree of familiarity. Once achieved I’ll tackle the server /streamer component. More than likely I will just get a high quality LAN cable initially. I’m looking forward to this new listening venture. 

Charles 

@thyname 

Thanks, I have certainly gathered that there are a number of ways to approach audio streaming. I’ve heard from people who are on polar ends of this spectrum.

Charles 

@lalitk ,

Thanks, I’ve been advised that modem directly connected to streamer unit could introduce noise issue, quality mesh is potentially a better alternative. Learning the ends and outs of audio streaming.

Charles

@lalitk

Thanks, I have a two-story home and also a finished basement where my audio system resides. My cable modem is currently in a first floor library. I was going to use a mesh router in my listening room with close proximity to the streamer connected by a LAN cable. I hadn’t thought about modem in listening room LAN connection to the streamer. It seems that either would work fine. Mesh router near streamer appealed to me.

Charles 

@sns ​​​​@lalitk 

You both are experienced audio streamers. What cable modem and router do you use? I have gotten suggestions from a very  trusted source and I’m just trying to further extend my database. As I tend to do.

Charles 

@jerryg123 

I haven’t began my audio streaming yet.

I’ll defer to @sns ​​​​@lalitk and others with hands on experience.

Charles

@oddiofyl 

Those streams sound good on the Vault but the Aurender is noticeably better in every metric

l know that there are many happy owners of the Blue Sound streamer components.  I could begin here but reading comments like yours,sns, Lalit and other experienced streamers I may as well go a step (Or two) beyond. One thing I’ve vowed to do is avoid multiple boxes and cables.😊

Charles

@sns

Well stated and I appreciate your insight and perspective. My domain has been CD media which I enjoy immensely and will continue to do so. I am going to take my first step into audio streaming and am  really looking forward to it. I’ll take shipment of a new DAC soon. Once that settles into the system, next will be the streaming.

Regardless if discussing CD transport or server/ network player, both are digital sources that matter significantly. There’s a definite hierarchy of quality amongst CD transports and common sense dictates the same for digital streaming components.

I have read many posts from experienced listeners who stream and overwhelmingly they cite the quality of the streamer as crucially important. They have heard substantial sound quality differences within this genre. This comes as no surprise.
For those who insist that it’s all about the DAC, okay do what works for you. I see digital source and DAC as equally important. They function as a paired unit. This will be my approach.

Charles

It’s clear that purely subjective personal preferences rule

Sure, how else can it be? It’s audio so you judge and decide based upon listening. You’re going to live with the product as it reproduces recorded music. If one doesn’t enjoy what they hear why bother with it? Absolutely and rightly so, subjective by default.

Charles

@sns 

Thank you. A serious mission you’ve embarked on that is reaping high level sonic reward.

Charles 

@sns 

Congratulations on achieving such a high level of sound quality utilizing Roon. Purely out of curiosity, how many boxes/cables etc does this require?

Charles

@sns

I observe individuals claiming great sound quality with virtually all music player software out there, until an objective comparison directly comparing these music players with a variety of streamers is undertaken I’ll assume all can supply fine sound quality

I don’t know who would arrange or conduct such an objective comparison undertaking. It appears that the individual brands have developed successful proprietary apps and good quality sound. People are very happy with their “Sense”,”Conductor “etc. It seems if listeners are very satisfied with the sound quality and user interface of their respective music servers/network players then mission has been accomplished.

Roon no doubt is a very good comprehensive product but not everyone wants or needs it. There are multiple pathways to streaming contentment.

Charles

@grannyring I do know the Sense program is far less demanding and with each update sounds better and better. Innuos keeps adding features while improving sound quality

Bill, those are encouraging developments. Has the Sense sound quality upgrade been implemented within the past year? I wonder if there is further improvement with the new Pulse series network players.

Charles

@lalitk 

Thanks and Happy holidays to you and your family. I’m looking forward to what this different DAC design brings to the table.I’ve had my current DAC for over 12 years and still enjoy it very much.

Charles

Charles, I am eager to hear your comments on the new dac

Bill I hope to have it within the next couple of weeks. It’s shipping from Ukraine so hopefully no custom snags.

Charles

@grannyring

Hi Bill, I appreciate your insight and observations very much. I getting my feet wet with regard to audio streaming. Plenty for me to learn and process. I’m determined to get it right with this venture. My new DAC will be shipped from the Ukraine very soon as construction is completed.

I have a splendid CD transport waiting for its arrival. I’d like to also pair it with a high quality streamer/server. So I’ll take my time.😊

Charles

@fthompson251 

Just to be clear I haven't heard the Innuos or the Aurender yet but they're on the radar. I have been receiving from a few folks feedback that's been quite favorable toward Aurender units. I need to explore more.

Charles

@lalitk 

Much appreciated.

Charles

@lollipopguild 

Roon is more fully featured, but Sense is simpler and more than enough for me. At least Sense is free, and enabling the Roon trial is also easy. Give it a few months for it all to settle before trying it though. 

Thanks, I’m not in a hurry and will sort this out.

Charles

@lollipopguild 

Thanks for your reply. I like things that are straightforward and simple. Does this apply to the Innuos Sense app/OS or is there a considerable learning curve involved? They do seem to seriously address power supply quality and that’s important to me. I use a very high quality AC balanced isolation transformer that has served my audio system well.

Charles

@lollipopguild 

My point is that everything between the ethernet port of your router/switch and the input of your DAC matters a hell of a lot.  To state it's only 1s and 0s is to frame it in too binary a statement.  You need to understand the digital signal is actually an analogue representation of a digital signal, along with noise and jitter issues.

Well stated .

You own the Zenith music server and I’m contemplating buying an Innuos Pulse network player. What is your opinion of Innuos “Sense “ sound quality and user interface compared with the Roon alternative? I’m just seeking online streaming usage (Internet radio/Tidal/Qobuz). I’d appreciate any feedback.

Charles

I believe both Innuos and Aurender are well-established high-quality products. Aurender is a complete music server component. Innuos  "ZEN" series are complete music servers. Innuos "Pulse" series are streamer/network players. If one does not need or want full music server then a network player is fine and generally speaking less expensive. Both companies have their happy and loyal supporters.

Charles

@blisshifi

I was in a similar dilemma as you when I had the NAD M50.2 hooked up to a PS Audio DirectStream DAC. Both were good components, but I was missing something, so I went on a DAC hunt. I moved through a number of DACs, including a Lampizator Baltic 3 with over $1K of tubes, but ended up returning it. When I decided down the other path and added an Aurender to the chain, it made a much bigger difference than continuing to upgrade

A clear example of a lower quality streamer mitigating the performance of a good quality DAC. This is why placing over emphasis on the DAC and relegating the streamer/source component to 2nd class status is a bad idea. A compelling case could be presented that in a good/high resolving audio system the source and DAC have equal sonic influence. Lower resolution systems will very likely obscure the impact. 

Charles

There is a lot more to be gained in a DAC. Until you have a flagship dac of your dreams, you can get by on a $300 streamer.

In other words the differnce between a $1000 and a $10000 dac is huge but the differnce between a $300 and a $5000 streamer is much less.

Jerry

I understand everyone has their own opinions and perspectives. I have to say that I patently disagree with this take. The quality of the digital source is very crucial to the overall sound quality of a digital front end. Yes, without question the DAC is an important component but it does not over ride the source component either.
 

A mediocre source will impede a good DAC. The “bits is bits” attitude is trite and superficial. A better quality streamer/music server will clearly make its contribution very apparent. In the OP’s scenario I recommend upgrading the streamer source  first. I believe that the current DAC is of higher quality than the current streamer/server in use.

Charles

@fthompson251

Could you clarify ? Do you need a full function “music server “ or a streamer “network player” ? Obviously the Aurender N200 is the former. If all you need is a network player consider the new Pluse series of network players from Innuos. There are 3 different models/price points.Excellent streaming capability for less money than the music servers.

Charles