NAGRA PL-L owner Question S

For me, the new 845M (which was several years in development and only started shipping 2 months ago) is good enough, and much much much much better to the oroginal Shuguang 845's that used to be stock for VPA's - really a major improvement.... so I bet the perfromance gap is now quite a bit less than when your friend used the 'chinese 845.'

A close friend of mine, who also uses VPAs, already expirienced a KR tube failure. Fortunately for him, the failure caused no damage to the speakers. The tube was replaced by Nagra (togeter with the other working tube from that pair) under warranty.

Before KR tubes, he used the chineese ones. He told me that KRs are far more refined sounding.

no I have not, but have heard they're pretty nice. My main reason for not is expense (they are waaaay expensive), and secondly, others' horror stories about sparks within them causing shorts in their VPA's, which would not be an issue for yours which came with KR's from the factory.

Artg - have you tried the KR 845 tubes ?

Im diggin the new SuperTNT 845M, overall my favrote Chinese made 845 (and i tried the base Shuguang 845, the SuperTNT 845B,and the original 845M (aka 845C), they each had some virtue (except for the base Shuguand 845 which didn't excell in anytihng), but overall, I like the new 845M, it ads nice dynamicandbase (vs say the 845B), yet is well balanced across the freq. spectrum and overall smother than the original 845M (which was snappy but just a tad bright).

Internally, I havent done as much rolling, mostly b/c its a major PITA to open each VPA and roll. I did notice a very nice improvement with super low noise, nicely matched 1950's vintage RCA 12AX7 (from andy at vintgetubeservices), but plan on trying some others (smooth plate teles, maybe the Tesla ECC803s repro, and a few others), but its such a pain... FOr the 7119, I have Amperex, which is the top dog there (lso from Andy).

As always, microphonics, noise and matching/testing is as (or more) important than the 'vintage' tube you use (though perhapsless critical on an amp vs a preamp), and I will give the Nagra people credit for providing quiet, non-microphonic tubes, even if they are a bit sterile compred to the older stuff....

Elberoth, ever roll ine internal VPA tubes? I recommend it highly! each takes two 12ax7's and one 7119/E182CC. The stock tubes are quiet, but nothing special, so i say go for it.

hello Artg, what tubes are you using internally on the Vpa, how are you getting on with your new 845m tubes.

Artg -> you are 100% right - I thought you were talking about the battery powered PL-P.

My VPAs have KR845 tubes installed from the factory.

Elberoth, the PL-L is NOT battery powered the way the PL-P is, it has a separate pwoer supply that gets its juice from the wall. No battery involved....

On the VPA's, do they have stock tubes in them (I would imagine so). There are significant imporvements to be had by rolling bot htthe internal (one 7119 and two 12ax7 per amp), and the 845 tubes......

Artg -> how can a power cord influence a battery powered amp ?

BTW - I have VPAs at home right now on dealer loan.

Kal is correct on both counts. Here are a few other thoughts based on my experience with my PLL:

It can be optimized in several regards: First: roll the tubes. The stock tubes are quiet, but otherwise really nothing special. I am using a single Cryoed 50's vintage Phillips Miniwatt 12AT7 (purchased from tubeworld) and (2) Mullard 10M Gold Pin 12AX7's. I know others have had very nice results using Mullard long plate 12AX7's, telefunken ECC803S and smooth plate tele 12ax7's and older vintage RCA 12AX7's as well. I tried Bugle Boy 12AX7's, but they had waaay too much upper midrange presence for this preamp. I also tried the telefunken ECC801S at the 12AT7 position, and it was nice, but a bit more analytical than the Cryo'd Phillips Miniwatt. You should plan on experimenting some to optimize it to your tastes, and this takes time but the rewards are well worth it....

As for PC's. I am currently using the Kubala-Sosna Emotion and recommend it highly. I have also used the Electraglide epiphany (a bit too 'clean,' but whoa all that detail comes through) and Isoclean (smooth and warm tonal balance, lost some detail). I feel the K-S is a nice in-between point for them. I also plug it in to an Isoclean 80A3 power conditioner, which also smoothes things out a bit.

I personally found the PLL to be exceedingly neutral, almost to a fault. Even though its tubed, it does not add any euphonics, forgive poor recordings or problems elsewhere in the signal chain, especially any brightness (read digital source). Its not as inherently smooth as some other preamps out there, but properly tweaked and matched, it provides peerless transparency, neutrality and just a hint of warmth (properly tweaked, that it).

Hope that helps.
Art

Meter reading is OK. Rarely, do you ever get to an 11V output with domestic electronics.

I believe the fuse is protected by a plastic enclosure so that, if it blows, the debris is contained.

Kal