My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!
Luxman pre and pass pre: hard comparison. The pass xp30 is outstanding. It comes down to what amplifiers you are using and what do you listen to. Luxman c900u preamp has a larger soundstage, tube like highs, excellent mids. It’s truly a musical preamp. The pass labs has lots of detail, slam, dynamics but it can get edgy at times if not using the proper electronics. |
Mcintosh 2301 are indeed at the bottom. That’s the least appealing amp for me after hearing the audio research gs150, it killed my 2301s. Not even close and the 2301s have sloppy bass which the gs150 does not. Rowland 925s are great but it’s a chore to break them in. Some say 1,000 to 2,000 hours to break them in and well for me that’s a lifetime. I heard those with the Rowland preamp and it sounded good but not worth all the money they are asking for. I think their preamps are decent but nothing like your audio research 10. The best preamps I’ve heard are the audio research reference 6, Luxman 900u and then pass labs xp30. To me, these are the best preamps without having to spend crazy money. |
True enough, Whitecamaross, ROwland M925 took about 1500 hours to break in completely. THis has been the longest break-in that I have experienced on an amp. Most amplifiers that have been in my system took about 1000 hours to reach their full performance. The only amp that I recall taking only 600 hours has been the Merrill Teranis. G. |
The no585 sounds amazing when you consider the money you are spending. Is it better than the luxman combo or hegel/arc 6 combo? no it is not, but you can't expect it to be when you consider the prices of each. That said, it is the best all in one box i have ever owned. I feel like it gives me about 80-85% of what the luxman or hegel combo gives me. That is A HELL OF A LOT of return on your money. The only reason why i can hear that it is 80%-85% is because of my MASSIVE ELECTROSTATIC PANELS that allow me to clearly hear the differences. That said, if you had more "normal" speakers then it makes no sense to spend the kind of money that separate components are when the you probably won't hear a big difference if your speakers are not of this caliber. Yes, i totally feel like the 585 would the the integrated that someone can own for the next 5 years and be perfectly happy with it. |
My wife and i did some listening between the 900u amp and hegel h30 a few nights ago. On one night, she had the luxman as the better amp and i had the hegel h30 so then we decided to try again another night and she chose the hegel the next night and said something very interesting to me which was that she felt like the luxman sounded amazing with certain songs and the hegel with others. I find this comment very true and i can really understand where she is coming from. The one thing i love about the hegel is that it runs cool as cucumber and it is very powerful. The luxman runs warm after extended listening sessions and it sounds best when left on all the time. |
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Wonderful thread, whitecamaross! Thanks for sharing your vast experience with us. In the reviews of the Luxman M-900u and Hegel H30 at Soundstage.com Doug Schneider compares the M-900u with the H30. While he thinks the H30 is very good, he finds the depth of soundstage to be lacking a bit with the H30. Is that your experience as well? I received the Luxman 900u combo a few days ago, and I must say that both the sound and build quality are amazing. I use them with Merging NADAC and Vivid Giya G2. I find the M-900u to run a bit hot, though, and there is a bit of a hiss coming from the tweeters that can only be heard when putting the ear close to them, With my Bryston 14B3 the speakers are dead quiet. |
Thanks for your input, robd2. (Sorry whitecamaross, I have no intention to hijack your thread). It's the M900 that produces the hiss, because it's there even if it's disconnected completely from the preamp. Maybe the noise floor is not as low as with the Bryston. I noticed this hiss with an M-700u and my two M-200, but luckily it seems to be less with the M-900u .There is a faint hiss from the Bryston as well, but it's almost inaudible even with my ear very very close to the tweeter. The Luxman 900u combo is still incredible, though. |
Hi, it is tough for me to hear any hiss because i own electrostatics. i might try a pair of small dynaudio bookshelf speakers and report back to you. Yes the amp runs hot, but so does pass labs, plinius, etc and any other exceptional amp i have owned. i wouldnt worry about it. I still love the luxman combo and will report back once my speakers are 100%. The hegel is no slouch though and sounds amazing with the audio research reference 6. Incredible sonics to say the least. |
@whitecamaross Without a doubt Pass Labs is a winner and thats whats gonna be my next amp, most likely a X350.5. Didnt go through the entire thread/your entire post but read that IYO, you lose details in a 5 channel ( rephrased) amp that you get in a dedicated two channel. I’d agree that it is true in most cases and to the same logic can be applied to two channel vs mono blocks. Having said that, did you give the Anthem P5 a try? My knowledge may be limited but I havent found a more work horse type 5 channel that weighs over 140 lbs and has not one but two power chords not to mention 325 watts RMS. I am running my ML Theos and plan to by amp them making better use of multiple channels. The other interesting choice could be Classe CA 5300. |
yes, i have owned anthem p5. Excellent workhorse and very heavy. It is up there in terms of quality, but nothing close to the plinius odeon. Please note, i will be giving a shot to the simaudio mc8 in the near future. I just need to figure out how i am going to do it since this is a 220v unit. They never built it 110v. |
Nebob, you should not hear any hiss while luxman m900u and c900 is on and no music is played. I own the combo and love the craftmenship and the sound that comes through makes me not think of upgrades on that front in the foreseeable future. If I were you check your interconnects I bet you picking hiss somewhere along that path. |
Ottablue, thanks for sharing your experiences with the 900u combo. The pair produces a truly amazing sound that is so full of texture in a great 3D soundstage. In an attempt to solve the hissing problem, I bought an Isotek Corvus power filter this week to which the whole system was connected. There was no change to the level of hiss running the M-900u in balanced mode. In single ended mode and with the C-900u set to “external pre” (I also use the combo with an Anthem processor in an Atmos setup), the speakers emanated a continuous buzz. It seems that the Isotek and both the Luxmans are a bad combination! I then connected the M-900u to another power strip that I use for a router and a laptop power supply, and to my big surprise, most of the hiss was gone! The hiss is still there but it’s very faint and almost on the level with the Bryston. The Brystons are even more quiet, though. I can conclude that the Luxmans are quite sensitive to less than optimal power conditions. My dealer is going to let me try some power cords from Transparent, but I’m not too happy with having to spend time on experimenting with those, because I find cables so extremely boring, especially power cords. But I acknowledge that power cords can affect the system in a bad way, if they are not properly magnetically shielded. In EU the 900u are sold with a cheap generic cord, probably due to a missing CE Marking on their cords. Which power cords do you use? Interconnects are from Luxmans ultimate series. |
Just got done listening to the Luxman combo with Dynaudio c1s and it’s outstanding . a level of clarity that is almost unreal. That said, this wasn’t the case when i had the clx panels. I felt the arc ref6 hegel h30 had the edge in terms of slam. However, I’m about 2 days away from just buying another 900u amp and run them in mono mode... this has never been done by any reviewer or anyone at all. i am just also looking at the massive amount of money involved and that I could be tapping into xa200.8 territory in terms of dollars spent and i highly doubt that the Luxman 900us in mono mode could best the xa200.8s. For right now, the Luxman and Dynaudio c1 is one hell of a combination. We will see once my clx speakers return in about 2 weeks. These monsters seemed to benefit from the massive power of the Hegel which is why i thought the 900u In mono mode would be ideal. |
So I did a bit of listening last night with the C1 Dynaudios and the Luxman pieces along with the Hegel H30 and audio research ref 6. First up: Luxman combo, amazing detail and great midrange. Highs are world class along with a level of depth that I simply haven’t heard before. Layer of detail upon layer of detail. I can honestly say I could live extremely happy with this combination for a very long time. No real weakness in my opinion and by the way I LOVE LOOOOOOOVE the loudness button on the Preamp. It just makes things come to life when listening at low volume levels. I’m really digging tone controls on preamps. Yes I’m clear that it’s not for those of you that are purists. That said, I think the awesome thing is that you can change speakers and other things and make the adjustments on the Preamp. HUGE SOUNDSTAGE. JUST BEYOND BELIEF. This is an excellent combo for those of you wanting to hear female vocals with a level of a reslism that’s hard to believe. Adele, Sam Smith, Diana krall etc all sound as if they are in your living room. Second: hegel h30/ Luxman 900u: great slam and dynamics. I still enjoy the big soundstage although it’s less than the Luxman amp. If you want bottom end, this will fix all your issues. End of story. This combo has just about everything that the Luxman combo has but it loses on the last ounce of detail and soundstage but we are splitting hairs here. For the money the Hegel H30 will kill many other amps out There. I find this combo better with music that has lots of swings and slam. It’s edcellent at that. Coming up next: Luxman 900u with audio research ref 6 preamp. |
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Nebob- Try connecting your amp directly to an outlet preferably with no other things used by that outlet. Ditch the power strip. I use for the amp power cord that came with the amp. On the pre amp and interconnects Wire World. I did upgrade power cords with my speakers, to Wire World, I used with Martin Logans and there was audiable difference for the better clearer sound. |
luxman 900u/ ARC 6: Excellent combination. I love everything about it and i really can't stop listening. That said, this combination sounds good really good on just about anything type of music, BUT there are times when the 900u amp/preamp combo hits one out the park with certain songs that leaves the arc 6/900u combo in the dust. So far, i can’t stress enough how important system synergy is. I loved the hegel with the CLX panels and the luxman not so much, but now that i have dynaudio c1 platinums, things have just turned around and now i find the luxman combo much more cohesive and "tuned" for these speakers. In short, the amp you have today MAY NOT be the best amp for your next set of speakers. No amp/preamp combo works for every speaker out there. This is why i let go of my 350.8. I felt it didnt have much synergy with my sonus faber cremonese. It is actually almost a rule of thumb to simply own 2 different amplifers at all times if you are changing speakers every 2 years or so. If the deal goes through tomorrow without any hiccups, i will be posting about my new speakers, but if it falls through then the CLX speakers will make their way back to me. One last thing, i have been listening to the luxman combo with the c1s for the past 3 hours straight at approximately 90-92 dbs and i have zero fatigue. i can sit there until dawn and i have zero desire to lower the volume. Incredible. |
whitecamaross, What a fantastic thread. So much info to chew on! Have you listened to an Audible Illussion preamp? I haven't tried many preamps but this is a stellar unit. If so, how would you compare it to the ARC REF6? thanks mike |
Update: last night I took delivery of the Dynaudio evidence temptation. These are in better than new condition. Impeccable to say the least. anyhow, my initial impressions are: 1. Huge speakers that immediately dwarf room. Extremely heavy and hard to position 2. I threw them in the room more or less where the clx were just to hear them and get immediate impressions so they probably aren’t where they need to be. They sounded just ok. Not the same level of high frequency detail from the clx or Dynaudio c1 platinum. Could it be that these use Esotar 1 tweeters and not Esotar 2 as the platinum? 3. Huge soundstage. Speakers disappear from the room the moment they turn on. 4. Far larger width and depth in terms of musicality when compared to my former c4 platinums. 5. Speakers fall flat on their face when turning down the volume. They appear to need to be cranked up to come to life. Again this was supposedly the reason why the new tweeter was designed. 6. Crappy recordings will sound like trash. My clx panels sounded awesome with just about anything i played. Think of these Dynaudio speakers as what an OLED 4K tv would display if you were to play a movie from the 80s on vhs..no detail or crispness. Very blurry 7. Crappy amps need not apply here. These will make most amps sound as if they have no balls or juice. Those with emotiva, Parasound, Rotel, b&k, etc need to just forget about it. I believe this speaker needs amps like Mcintosh 1.2 kws, boulder 2060, Krell 900e, etc. Heavy hitters with massive twin turbos in them. This could be the reason why I feel they fall apart when turned down. Maybe my luxman 900u and Hegel H30 aren’t enough. 8. These will also expose your room issues. I’m currently dealing with one speaker feeling as if it has a little more mids and highs. This could be because this speaker is the speaker that is not in the corner but rather in the open space of my room. I have a feeling the speaker in the corner is getting “cornered “ and not allowed to spread the sound as it should. Luckily my preamps have the “balance “ feature so I can even out the sound. with all that said, I’m just starting and haven’t had more than 2 hours to play with these. I still need to position them better, move them, tilt, toe. Etc to see if I can make things better. I’m also looking into potentially buying either a boulder 2060 or the new Mcintosh 1.25 kws monos. I won’t give up on these until I try different things and if all fails then I may have to just try to get my clx back. I also wanted to know if anyone here has had to tilt their speakers forward more than their spikes allowed and if that was the case, what did they use ? I’m looking for ideas to tilt them more than what their spikes allow. Let me know guys ! |
