No argument on that. (Sorry :) .But I do agree isolation and room treatment is great. ATB, Pete |
Simply email respected well known professional acoustical engineers (Anthony grammani, Russ Herschelmann, Richard Rives ,etc) who've been engineering n designing all level of custom theaters for couple of decades now, n and ask em " green glue sandwich drywall vs quietrock?"
Again, im betting no more or less than a decibel or so difference, all things considered. Can't be anything more than another drywall option better than standard at best. Kinda like rockwool vs fiberglass in a stud cavity.
Um...yup |
Thanks Ptss. I actually ran across that site a couple years ago when I was researching this so I'm familiar with the product. Looks like a good product, but I'm not sure what it gets you over just bonding two sheets of drywall together with Green Glue other than saving some time. Estimating it would be 2 to 4 times more expensive to use Quietrock, but might be worth it if it offers significant benefits and saves time on a project. |
Hello Soix,
I think the Quietrock site may be of interest to you as well. (I have zero interest in the company,commenting for knowledge sharing only. No offense intended to those who don't wish to learn) |
http://hometheaterrx.com/how-to-properly-soundproof-your-home-theater/
SOIX, not totally. As i started, BARE MINIMUM "somewhat more effective for base" (much better on mids n highs though) is mass loaded deadend drywall on fured out studs, decoupled with isolation clips, is what i should have done on this small room. Still its only modestly effective in effectively issolating super long bass waves that still vibrate within the small air cavity of single leaf wall stRucture. Read this article (and others) n u'll see that even the world renouned Anthony Grammani acknowledges that a separate quadrouple leaf separate wall structure separated completely from each other is most effective. also states that mass by itself is only minimal but helps with de coupling, yes.
As i said, its minimal acceptable n what i should of done. |
"Keep in mind I am aware that even simplly isolating w RESILLIENT won't help keep bass in or out very effectively! Only wall thickness depth and mixed with mass barier is only way there. SPRUNG walls only really help mid and high frequencies used with green glue or deadened drywall."
Ooh. That strikes me as exactly backwards. Resilient channels are helpful in absorbing low frequency bass waves and preventing them from being transmitted to the studs and then to the rest of the house with the added benefit of improving the bass characteristics within the room itself. Trying to do that with wall thickness would require walls way too thick to be practical. Obviously constructing a room within a room would go even further in improving isolation. On the flip side, wall thickness/damping can be very effective in preventing the transfer of mids/highs while also helping acoustically in that range within the room. If you haven't already, get Premium Home Theater by Earl Geddes. Haven't read it in a while but I think I got this right. By far the best book I've read on how to construct a dedicated room, and it applies just as much for audio as it does for home theater. Highly recommended for anyone looking to build/treat their listening room. |
Ptss, ...I wouldn't waste my time again. This is merely another drywall product with patch and calk! 100% sure if I switched out my green glue sandwiched drywalled and sealed/calked walls in the room with Quietrock, I'd have zero improvement in results, basically ...and likely worse.
Um, yep...channels, separate walls, room-within-room, etc...only ways. But you let us know if it works out for you, of course. |
I suggest you check the Quietrock website. |
Keep in mind I am aware that even simplly isolating w RESILLIENT won't help keep bass in or out very effectively! Only wall thickness depth and mixed with mass barier is only way there. SPRUNG walls only really help mid and high frequencies used with green glue or deadened drywall.
In this respect, the separate issokated room-in-room (possibly with heavy dense ouuter wall shell barier??? ) would get best bass isolation effect by also spacing outter vs inner wall structures, im sure.
Just more thoughts there. |
Soix, since sound isolation (keep in and out) was the main goal in the room, I failed in number of areas, yes. First was (for just bare min acceptable results imo) NOT USING RESILIENT CHANNEL N ACCOUSTICAL ISSOLATION CLIPS!, yes. While I considered this, I tried to save max inner room dimensions in small room (was,11.75' x 13.5' x 9' originally), n opted to only FURRED OUT the walks w staggered studs -even in closet -to isolate from outter walls. I would say this had only minimal effect ultimately in the upstairs spare bedroom flanked by other bedrooms. Then I simply 1\2" dryall + green glue + 1\2" drywall inside (tried keep it thinner because it makes sound HARD n unyielding inside, plus not enough base absorption., so counter productive in noise isolation). Then I used sound cover over windows to help there (again minimal effect)
Next failed effort was FLOATING FLOOR CONSTRUCTION! I didn't engineer it correctly, partially in attempt to keep floor thickness to minimum yet "floating". I used 1\4" foam closed cell pading underlay, with Hardybacker board heavy underpayment + green glue + lamin flooring over that. This also only minimally helped, but mostly hardly at all!!
What should been done is perhaps small modestly spaced acoustic isolation rubber pads with sound deadened sandwiched 3\4" plywood construction, I believe. Really the minimal isolation point contact between subfloor is key plus mass floating above it as new floor. . then prob carpet n padding.
Next was hard dropped ceiling which WAS NOT USING RESILIENT CHANNEL, NOR SPRUNG WITH ACOUSTIC ISSOLATION SORINGS. Either way that also needed to be isolated, and it ended up not being done!! So also dropped ball there, partially from compromised soffit design recommendations from contracted construction guy and wife's desire for inceiling lighting choices. I caved in n failed basically, sound issol wise.
Of all things, probably the solid door and new jam helped plus sealed weatherstripping rubber around, and seal at bottom had best results compared to otpriginal hollow crap door.
All in all, ideally some floating floor with separate isolated room - within a - room concept would have been way better (including improved bass ISSOLATION with added wall spacing depth, but left small small space inside ultimately. Second best - and only real viable improvement option for space, budget, and practical application was to probably still fur out wall to isolate walls between rooms, THEN PUT SOUND CLIPS N REZILLIENT CHANNEL + sandwiched green glue construct drywall attached to that all around the room! (Including over newly built soffit +acoustically sealed recessed lighting or other lighting option externally)
Also I'm sure some sort of isolated doubled thick pane window configuration or thick cover or something to help sound there.
Anyway, yeah, made mistakes and you really can't when it comes to sound issolation !! Sound doesn't know you are trying to keep it in or out just because you TRIED!!! LOL.
Next time I'll put a better effort forward, for sure |
Avgoround, just for my own information in case I redo my basement in the near future (more for better sound than isolation, although isolation would be nice too), what things did you do wrong? Thinking there's a good chance I'd make at least some of those mistakes so would be helpful to know. Also, did you use resilient channels on the walls/ceiling? Thanks for thoughts. |
Ptss, I literally just cut and pasted some similar concept product web pages, and did no research at all on what might possibly be the cost to purchase one, all the ergonomics n options, and so forth. Lol. Guess I didn't care enough to follow through there!? Pricing? Yeah, have no idea.
Also im pressuming these products offered no acoustical treatment adapted products for internals, so I'm just piecing the ideas in my head.
What I do know is that it's EXPENSIVE to convert an existing even small space to a reasonable improvement in sound isolation, as I've done such rooms myself before. Last one I did cost me nearly $10000, and I did a lot of labor and sweat myself! And, that was room construction for sound isolation, - Inc associated reworking HVAC, Dropping ceiling, rerouting electrical, double drywall n texture , furred out studs, insulation, green glue n hardware, floating floor, new door n frame, etc? All that and I still screwed it up! (Lots of mistakes in design) But I'm guessing this could be done for less or comparable, and with better results, with the modular concept?? Yup, not really sure.
Im pretty sure the concept would need to be designed and constructed to really know. |
Interesting, but how does the cost compare to on site methods of adequately isolating a hi-fi movie or music room? |
