Hahahahahahahah He had a lot more notes to play than I ever did.
I imagine the music business requires a great sense of humor and great patience.
Cheers
I imagine the music business requires a great sense of humor and great patience.
Cheers
Jazz for aficionados
Jazz for aficionados
I'm going to review records in my collection, and you'll be able to decide if they're worthy of your collection. These records are what I consider "must haves" for any jazz aficionado, and would be found in their collections. I wont review any record that's not on CD, nor will I review any record if the CD is markedly inferior. Fortunately, I only found 1 case where the CD was markedly inferior to the record.
Our first album is "Moanin" by Art Blakey and The Jazz Messengers. We have Lee Morgan , trumpet; Benney Golson, tenor sax; Bobby Timmons, piano; Jymie merrit, bass; Art Blakey, drums.
The title tune "Moanin" is by Bobby Timmons, it conveys the emotion of the title like no other tune I've ever heard, even better than any words could ever convey. This music pictures a person whose down to his last nickel, and all he can do is "moan".
"Along Came Betty" is a tune by Benny Golson, it reminds me of a Betty I once knew. She was gorgeous with a jazzy personality, and she moved smooth and easy, just like this tune. Somebody find me a time machine! Maybe you knew a Betty.
While the rest of the music is just fine, those are my favorite tunes. Why don't you share your, "must have" jazz albums with us.
Enjoy the music.
I'm going to review records in my collection, and you'll be able to decide if they're worthy of your collection. These records are what I consider "must haves" for any jazz aficionado, and would be found in their collections. I wont review any record that's not on CD, nor will I review any record if the CD is markedly inferior. Fortunately, I only found 1 case where the CD was markedly inferior to the record.
Our first album is "Moanin" by Art Blakey and The Jazz Messengers. We have Lee Morgan , trumpet; Benney Golson, tenor sax; Bobby Timmons, piano; Jymie merrit, bass; Art Blakey, drums.
The title tune "Moanin" is by Bobby Timmons, it conveys the emotion of the title like no other tune I've ever heard, even better than any words could ever convey. This music pictures a person whose down to his last nickel, and all he can do is "moan".
"Along Came Betty" is a tune by Benny Golson, it reminds me of a Betty I once knew. She was gorgeous with a jazzy personality, and she moved smooth and easy, just like this tune. Somebody find me a time machine! Maybe you knew a Betty.
While the rest of the music is just fine, those are my favorite tunes. Why don't you share your, "must have" jazz albums with us.
Enjoy the music.
31,740 responses Add your response
Wadada Leo Smith: Played with Leo in High School. He was 1st Trumpet, I was 5th. I tried to tell the band director there was no such thing as 5th Trumpet. He said, "there is now." They were always jealous of me. Leo is no longer in the same universe as Sousa. Wow! His Dad was a very good Blues player. Cheers |
Freddie Hubbard and Tom Harrell are also giants... Thanks for the link keegiam.... sometimes also some surprizing younger magician: Wadada Leo Smith... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=176jcgfIZcs |
Someone say Saxophone? Just My Imagination https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGKOehe1LTs Since I Fell for You https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgRSI58aJVg What's Going On? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRcqjIr6ItA Ruby, My Dear https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6liAgg4SN88 Cheers |
@pjw81563 Thanks, I'm looking forward to curling up with the "Footprints" book this winter (while finally getting more time to listen). Also, an honorable mention to Kenny Wheeler, who I believe got even less notoriety than the great Kenny Dorham. '76: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGQ2a11UYog '68: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1QQv2sDV_E @frogman So many profound observations re: WS - not to mention the spot-on collection of quotes ("spot on" because they reflect so perfectly the musical mindset I've been hearing for half a century). JFA rewards yet again. Thank you. |
If Bach was the last person to compose after those who did before himGreat point! That reveal that the center of gravity of a wave is more important than the periphery if we want to understand the way a wave fall in the ocean of creativity....In this perspective Schoenberg or Scriabin make sense AFTER Bach or AROUND Bach like you rightfully suggest... But the succession of composers is an "history" which like a river has a direction... This direction is the result of consciousness creative dynamic mysteries way more than the results only of our individual or collective taste around any center... Only my intuition here... |
Nice joke. Not the first time that Solti has been the subject of a joke. True story: Solti was known for having a very small beat pattern; not to mention little sense of humor. Early in his tenure with the Chicago Symphony, during a rehearsal one of the bass players was complaining that he couldn’t see his pattern clearly. Apparently the bass player got to the point of getting “snarky” (😊) and set up binoculars to look in Solti’s direction. A bit later in the rehearsal Solti held up a small piece of paper in the direction of the basses. The bass player zoomed in and on the note was written: ”You are fired” |
Jazz or classical music are created by musicians that wrote it before playing it in one case and others that improvise first and call it a "work"... Jazz or classical music are too big dynamical machine to be classified always on the separate label where we put them...They intersect in some audible way in the works of Kurt Weill and Gershwin for example... I do no more labelling now, jazz, classical, iranian or Persian music.... I dont listen composers so much like in my past life, i listen mainly to musicians interpretations or improvisations...And some musicians interpretations are almost improvisations... The golden Age of classical for me is Bach.... But what will be our understanding of Bach without Schoenberg or Scriabin ? I will take the " debatable hypothesis" that Armstrong is the Bach of Jazz then what will become of the legacy of Armstromg and others golden era musicians without Sun RA or Roland Kirk for example true uncircumscribable geniuses or those inspired nowadays by more calm revolutionaries like Miles Davis or Wayne Shorter ? These are only my thoughts and i am not a musician by far tough.... Then feel free to disagree.... My best to all.... |
No worries, fast friends 🙄 However, what I am suggesting to you, Rok, is that you assume that when those Jazz greats say something about the music that you don’t agree with that they are dong so for opportunistic or insincere reasons. I would reconsider that. These are very deep individuals and their commitment to the art form is equally deep. I think “mere” needs better context. |
Some here seem to think I started listening to The Duke and Armstrong back in the 30s and 40s and got stuck and never left. I started my Jazz journey with fusion. By journey, I mean buying records. At one time I had more ’Weather Report’ than ’Miles Davis’. More Al di Meola and Metheny than Coltrane. And just as much Lee Ritenour as Wayne Shorter. All on LP. My only Shorter LP was ’Atlantis’, recently posted. Then along came CD, and everything got reissued, and I discovered REAL Jazz. With the help of Stereo Review. So I went from the ’new’ stuff, back to the real stuff, which is what Shorter plays. pjw, I loved your joke. Wagner and 'The Ring' is an interesting choice to start your Classical journey. Cheers |
C'mon men lets be friends. It is wrong to put a "blanket statement" on any subject. I say let rok stick to his old school jazz and call a lot of the music by older jazz artists who evolved and experimented, as well as the new "jazz" people....NOISE. I agree with all of the frogman posts Re "what is jazz" And I like a lot of Wayne Shorter's "new jazz" and I agree that jazz is at the core and is the foundation of his art. I read Wayne's book. The man is arguably the most cerebral and philosophical musical artist ever. Did anyone like my joke about George Solti and Alfred Lion?? |
First of all, I am only commenting on what Shorter SAID in an interview as reported by you. Nothing I have said is meant to be a criticism of Shorter the Jazz artist. I have spent too much money on his recordings to even go there. Over the years, I have noticed a trend of Jazz greats, during interviews, to say in effect, they are much more than mere Jazz players. Including, if memory serves, The Duke himself. All of this to the delight of the interviewers. Does not happen in any other genre. Hmmmmm, makes a body wonder. I do not define Jazz. No one person does. The Jazz audience itself makes that definition. And when you leave the reservation, they call you out. Exhibt A: Miles Davis. That S**t Miles is playing ain’t Jazz - Wynton Marsalis. ***** “Bebop is Chinese music” - Louis Armstrong***** Your Point? hahahahahahaha Surely you are not challenging Pops!! One of my most recent, a twofer, Shorter and Wynton. "Contemplation" - Jazz at Lincoln Center Orchestra with Wynton Marsalis feat. Wayne Shorter 2CD set on Blue Engine Label. Highly recommended. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1sWfVM3RJQ Cheers |
Please explain just how it helps Jazz, the music and its relevance, overall, to hold such a strict view of its “definition”; as if doing so would, somehow, bring it back to its (your) “glory days”. It is clear that many, including many giants in the field, don’t share that view. So, why is it so important to drive the point home? Instead of commenting on the music you make an assumption and a blanket statement about what the motivations of artists might be without knowing anything about those motivations. Why does it matter? Not liking certain music does not automatically mean that it is not good music. Not to mention that music is always a reflection of the times. Don’t shoot the messenger. What you are objecting to has been happening in Jazz since its inception. I do encourage you to consider that you are seriously short changing a seriously great artist’s later work. “Bebop is Chinese music” - Louis Armstrong |
*****
I think you miss the point…..surprising for the last remaining true JA. The point is that Jazz doesn’t always have to sound like a traditional form of Jazz….the way it is “supposed” to sound.***** Sounds like you are putting words in his mouth. ***** Break boundaries? Absolutely.***** You break too many boundaries and you will find yourself outside the realm of Jazz. Then The Frogman's First Law comes into effect. ***** It is an ever evolving art form.***** There is a limit to how much a thing can evolve before it becomes something altogether different. They say Birds are Dinosaurs, I won't argue, just try telling that to T-Rex. Actually, I think they object to the word JAZZ, not necessarily the music Jazz. They don't like the history and / or origin of Jazz. If Jazz had been started with and by someone like Ornette Coleman in NYC, it would all be cool. Cheers |
I think these WS quotes give a glimpse into that mindset and the man: ** I always say that music is a small drop in the ocean of life. I was told a long time ago that your horn, or whatever instrument you play, is a means to be in the world.** ** Jazz is a fighter. The word 'jazz' means to me, 'I dare you. Let's jump into the unknown!' ** ** Clouds float in the same pattern only once. ** ** Dealing with the unknown, the unexpected, is a reflection for me musically of what's happening in the world, because people are learning how to dialog with each other without any past strategy or any kind of formula from the past. ** ** Play and write music the way you want the world to be. ** |
“Lists”……a joke related to recent comments. Has nothing to do with your post……mostly. I think you miss the point…..surprising for the last remaining true JA. The point is that Jazz doesn’t always have to sound like a traditional form of Jazz….the way it is “supposed” to sound. It is an ever evolving art form. That you miss the point is further highlighted by the suggestion that a Jazz artist of such stature would “distance himself from Jazz”. Break boundaries? Absolutely. Distance himself? No way. “Dis” Jazz? Quite the contrary. It is about honoring one of the most basic tenets of the art form. That is not to say that there aren’t impostors. Wayne Shorter is not one of them. Would be helpful to understand that aspect of the mindset of a great creative artist. **** The one exception to this phenomenal is Wynton. We should all be thankful that someone sure knew what they were doing when he got the job at Lincoln Center. **** If you only knew just how close part of the real reasons for this would be to incurring the wrath of Tammy, were they to be written here 🤔 |
He is not the only one to try and distance himself from Jazz. You put a microphone and camera on these guys and they all try to dis Jazz. Hell, makes me wonder why they didn't record for Deutsche Grammophon or Hyperion. Or better yet, why didn't the Berliners and Karajan ever do a session for Blue Note?True that rok. One of the best posts I have read on JFA. The only classical music I have purchased is Der Ring des Nibelungen (The Ring of the Nibelung) - 3 different versions of the complete 4 cycle masterpiece. Yes one of them is the Karajan. Georg Solti "Hello Mr. Lion I need 20 hours of studio time to record at your studio. Is Mr. van Gelder available tomorrow?" Alfred Lion "Yes Mr. Solti but we don't know if we could fit your orchestra into his studio" |
Easy, but probably foolish to question a genius on the very subject of his genius without digging a little deeper into the full meaning of something he has said. He is not the only one to try and distance himself from Jazz. You put a microphone and camera on these guys and they all try to dis Jazz. Hell, makes me wonder why they didn't record for Deutsche Grammophon or Hyperion. Or better yet, why didn't the Berliners and Karajan ever do a session for Blue Note? I could explain all this, but in doing so, Miss Tammy would probably shut us down again. The one exception to this phenomenal is Wynton. We should all be thankful that someone sure knew what they were doing when he got the job at Lincoln Center. Lists?? Read my post again. The word 'List' does not appear. You like showers? Great. The unwashed still rule!! Cheers |
mahgister And i love trumpeters like i love pianists.... The trumpet is probably the most "symbolic" instrument when it come to jazz genre. I agree with you and will never call one trumpeter "the best" But as you also said we all have our favorites and I would like to mention a few of mine Roy Eldridge, Dizzy Gillespie, Louis Armstrong, Freddie Hubbard, Miles Davis, Chet Baker and Lee Morgan - not necessarily in that order. I do admit though, to being a Clifford Brown completist. I would also say he is my most favorite by just a hair over the others. I also really like Kenny Dorham. As we aficionados all know, Clifford Brown was an up and coming star in the jazz world and a young phenom on the trumpet when he tragically died in a car accident at age 25 in 1956. Brown won the DownBeat magazine Critics' Poll for New Star of the Year in 1954. Kenny Dorham's talent is frequently lauded by critics and other musicians, but he never received the kind of attention or public recognition from the jazz establishment that many of his peers did. For this reason, Dorham's name has become "virtually synonymous with underrated." I am wishing the 6 songs I chose to represent both of these exceptional artists are acceptable selections to show off their respective virtuosity, and most of all the distinctive sound of each of them. I think the two of them made Louis Armstrong proud. Clifford (10) Art Blakey & Clifford Brown - 1954 - A Night At Birdland Vol1 - 05 A Night In Tunisia - YouTube (10) Clifford Brown & Max Roach - Study In Brown ( Full Album ) - YouTube (10) Clifford Brown & Max Roach - Jordu - YouTube Kenny (10) Kenny Dorham - 1961 - Whistle Stop - 04 - Whistle Stop - YouTube (10) Kenny Dorham - Una mas - YouTube (10) Manhã de Carnaval (Live) - YouTube |
Maghister, few more trumpet players to enjoy (playing at the same time) The Trumpet Summit Meets The Oscar Peterson Big Four (1980) https://youtu.be/RvPM2zsSglA more from the same session (issued on another album) https://youtu.be/0ajHkXjBJmM I dont mind beeing on 'alleged' list....its not a big list in any case... |
Great comments on Shorter; and great clips. Thanks! Blue Note debut: https://youtu.be/8OxrGVPBzZM A new voice; a move to a focus on soprano saxophone: ”To hell with the rules, I’m going for the unknown." Another is, "Jazz shouldn’t have any mandates. Jazz is not supposed to be something that’s required to sound like jazz. For me, the word ’jazz’ means, ’I dare you.’" - WS https://youtu.be/Qhndif8nSgg https://youtu.be/0PQKnjwlN6g https://youtu.be/EbORudcyOh When all the stars align. Worth posting again. Inspired!: https://youtu.be/-NSJtCdlhe4 |
But Wayne was also independently churning out masterpieces like JuJu, Et Cetera, and Speak No Evil, and we'll be forever better off for it. Mesmerizing, exotic, intoxicating, essential.keegiam Wayne Shorter never had a bad album as a leader. Even in the 70's, 80's and right up to his last release "Emanon" A great book to read. I did and I highly recommend. Footprints: The Life and Work of Wayne Shorter: Mercer, Michelle: 9781585424689: Amazon.com: Books |
The mere mention of Wayne Shorter often launches me on hours-long journeys that are both nostalgic and exploratory. Back in the day, he marked my second level of immersion (after the initial Miles/Coltrane fascination that seems so common). Shorter was a compositional genius right out of the box. Miles saw and heard it, and thus was born the core of the greatest jazz quintet ever. But Wayne was also independently churning out masterpieces like JuJu, Et Cetera, and Speak No Evil, and we'll be forever better off for it. Mesmerizing, exotic, intoxicating, essential. From Shorter's first record as a leader, 1959 (with a jovial, light-hearted Lee Morgan): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR_DoavkF28 |
The best jazz piano-man alive with his trio on a new album out this summer . https://youtu.be/18YcMequR9A |
frogman that 1959 complete set 1 from Art Blakey And The Jazz Messengers in Paris is a gem. Thanks for sharing. Morgan was 21 and Shorter 26. I count myself lucky to have seen Wayne Shorter live for his 80th birthday anniversary tour at NYC Town Hall. I have about 15 each of Morgan and Shorter as leaders and everything from their stints, live and studio, with Blakey as I am a "Art Blakey completist" You and Mahgister have expressed all that I hear when listening to those two great musicians and so I only want to say if you can get a chance to watch this video please do so. I highly recommend it. Watch I Called Him Morgan | Prime Video (amazon.com) |
The “light and heartful” is what I hear as the infectious swagger in his playing.Yes and to be honest it is after reading your comment that this comes back to my mind, and searching for a comparison the particular exhuberant effortless way Morgan play remind me of Armstrong in the screaming high notes...Screaming is not a critic here in my mouth at all only a metaphor to convey my subjective impression... His inventiveness remind me of Miles Davis... |
Not necessarily in overall concept, but in how his playing became more and more economical; as if he found ways to say what he had to say with fewer and fewer notes. One of the most expressive of saxophone players, he could express so much emotion with one or two notes.It was my impression but having not your knowledge and experience, i miss the "word" economical... Thanks...Minimalistic but powerful expression yes.... Controlled in a mysterious way.... It is the first time in my life that a sax player induce in me the same love some trumpeter do...( i am excessive in my love or dislike or neutral gesture yes ) This 6 albums series is now one of my favorite one.... Jazz Giants.... Thanks for the recommendations.....I will swiftly look for them.... I listen the 2 short Wayne Shorter clip.... This guy play sax like i ,at the end, love the instrument at the level of my appetite for trumpet playing...I was ready to discover it....Timing is important in life.... I am in paradise.... I am passionate yes, but only hyperbole can convey my surprise listening their playings... And my surprize that jazz can hide jewels and gems like these... Lee Morgan and Wayne Shorter are a "musical deal squad" made in heaven for sure....Like Coltrane and Davis in "Kind of blue"....But these two ressemble more each other for me and they integrate deeply their playings in one another, not one beside the other at all...It is not criticism of the 2 other geniuses only my way to describe my impression of their playings...I am not a musician tough feel free to correct me.... Lee Morgan is stupendous in his easiness and fluidity always meaningful chords....He play to surprise us with some chords inscribed in the "great musical book" already there and now here forever... He is so great that no showmanship is needed.... « Do you think that a blind who just see the light could be outrageous with too much hyperbole?»-Groucho Marx 🤓 «No,but Groucho you fall of your chair each day... »- Harpo Marx « I quit my chair each week my dear, dont exagerate with hyperbole....»- Groucho Marx 🤓 |
Interesting comments, mahgister. I share your feelings about these two masters. Shorter in particular is a favorite. He is also one of the greatest and most interesting Jazz composers. A true genius. One of the most interesting things about Shorter is how much his playing changed over the course of his career. Not necessarily in overall concept, but in how his playing became more and more economical; as if he found ways to say what he had to say with fewer and fewer notes. One of the most expressive of saxophone players, he could express so much emotion with one or two notes. https://youtu.be/CYg_3pQN-LU https://youtu.be/ydsqGRYqW88 I don’t feel there is a “greatest” among the very top trumpet players. Morgan was certainly one of the greatest. **** And Morgan for me own something very light and heartful from Armstrong and something which is the brain of Miles Davis.... **** Exactly! Great comment. The “light and heartful” is what I hear as the infectious swagger in his playing. https://youtu.be/uHd0qP4UKX4 https://youtu.be/eRA8EOR7Nm0 |
This compilation through many years, Of Shorter and Morgan together or not is one of my most loved album already... All the numerous musicians are good but my personal discovery are really Shorter and Morgan... I am very difficult and picky with sax players.... I love Shorter... Some other sax players like Clifford Jordan also... And Morgan for me own something very light and heartful from Armstrong and something which is the brain of Miles Davis.... A truly great trumpeter....One of the greatest.... And i love trumpeters like i love pianists.... |