Jazz for aficionados

Very first sounds I heard today when I woke up to this on WBGO this morning. What a way to start the day! There's groove and then there's GROOVE.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LNePe0E7KQ0

Although presently I'm focusing on jazz vocal groups, I'm also deeply moved by vocals of a religious persuasion, such as "Motherless Child" by Afro Blue. It seems that all of us were moved by that group.

Never before have I been moved by vocals, minus musical instruments, but they did it; they plumbed the emotional depths of "Motherless Child". While it's not easy finding new vocal groups of this caliber, I'm sure you guys can do it.

Enjoy the music.

Rok, glad you post you ravings on here,a fool like you would be dangerous in real time.

No, you're not. That was beautiful. I especially liked "Motherless Child". Lovely blend and intonation. Thanks, O-10.

****Rok, since you like vocals of the religious persuasion, here's one especially for you.******

Wunderbar!!! Maravilloso!!! Merveilleux!!! Wonderful!!!

Do you know how hard it is to find music like this, sung like this. Reminds me of the Fisk University folks.

And this appears to be a good source of other good music. I checked out the brass group also. Great stuff!!

I like the venue also. Intimate.

Our OP does not speak often, but when he does, wow!!

Thanks for the clip and site. I will visit it often.

And I suspect, I am not the only person here that likes "Vocals of the Religious Persuasion. :)

Cheers

Rok, since you like vocals of the religious persuasion, here's one especially for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PF0yNKroigk

Enjoy the music.

*****She's maybe a little more grimy, ***** I assume you meant to say 'Gritty'. I would hate to think of Nina as grimy. :)

I love the woman. Nina Simone is a unique talent. I would recommend the 4 CD set "Four Women" if you want to get into her music.

I don't consider London a Jazz singer. She is awesome at what she does, but I would not consider it Jazz.

I am not familiar with Johnny Dyani, but I will search him out. Thanks for the tip.

Cheers

The 0-10:

Singers like these are my absolute favorite form of Jazz. But good ones are hard to find. I was hooked on LH&R from the day I first heard "Cloudburst". I was amazed because I heard and understood every word!!

The clip you sent with Bavan, sounds better than the stuff with Ross. Ross could get shrill at times. Hard on the ears. I think she ruined "sing a song of basie" by singing in an octave too high. I don't blame her, the arranger is at fault.

I knew of the arrival of Bavan, and I think I have one CD with her. I will search out the tune you sent. very nice.

The manhattan Transfer is my current favorite. The last one of theirs I bought was "swing". Excellent. They are with 'Stephane Grappelli' and 'Asleep at the Wheel'. I think the Swing refers to Texas Swing. Good Stuff. And last but not least, Janis Siegel is a FOX!

'The New York voices' are just a little bit too New Yorkish for my taste. Great voices, but the arrangements are too 'sophisticated'. I hesitate to use that word, might give The Frogman the big head.

The only other group like these that I am familiar with is 'The Swingle Singers'. Have them with MJQ and another with Oscar Peterson. Didn't like either. I think they are based in Europe.

Thanks for the lead on LH&B.

BTW, I get "Andy Bey and the Bey Sisters" tomorrow. Maybe I will have good news.

Cheers

Acman3:

I have that CD. Now I will have to listen to it. Nice clip.

The Blind Boys of Alabama really shine on "The Gospel At Colonus" I have that CD and the DVD. Check it out.

Thanks for sharing.

Cheers

*****There is no god or gods. All religions are BS.*****

A lot of people, sometimes referred to as 'armed mobs', have given their lives so you can believe as you please.

But, this is a music thread, and a Jazz one at that, and as we all know, the utilmate source of Jazz is religious music.

Therefore: keep it to yourself.

And if the countries that have renounced God are any indication, i.e. Nazi germany, Soviet Russia, Communist China, Castro's Cuba and North Korea, You should be on your knees thanking God there are God fearing people in this country.

Cheers

Today's Listen:

Roland Kirk -- DOMINO
w/herbie hancock,andrew hill,wynton kelly,roy hanes

This guy is one heck of a Saxophone player. As wonderful as his antics are, he is much more than that.

25 Tracks. A lot of multi takes. Including something called a 'breakdown take'. But all are wonderful. A little chatter after each take. I love that. The last tune, "Time Races with Emit", is 22 seconds in length. hahah You gotta love this guy.

Nice shots of notes on the muscial scores. I think I would enjoy watching these guys rehearse as much as seeing them perform. They say some funny stuff.

Cheers

Music is God's greatest gift to man, save his son...

There is no god or gods. All religions are BS.

****comments like this just encourage him.****

I don't think he needs encouragement, nor do I want to take on that role, but I think that kind of perspective is sorely missing in these discussions.

****you should always carry a card with the phone number of the New York Philharmonic, ****

Well, actually, I do; but, not for that reason.

****let the String section of the NYP not show up for work, and then let the gabarge collectors not show up for work!! See which wheel gets the grease.****

You might be surprised. You can look look up the numbers, but if memory serves, the recent sanitation worker's strikes in NYC lasted considerably longer than the most recent musicians strike, and one that I was involved with, the Broadway musicians strike . Now, I realize you referred to a NYP strike, but keep an eye on the Met Opera's labor/ management issues being dukes out as we "speak"; you just may have an answer very soon; unfortunately.

****Can feel and intuition in music ever be programed?**** - Acman3

Of course not!

****That is, to reconcile what you can do, with, what's in your head. In the book a lot of guys wished they could play what was in their heads.

I don't think I understand that statement. If you can think it or visualize it, what's to keep you from playing it. We are speaking of professional players, of course. Is it a physical thing?****

Remember that old favorite term of yours (mine)? "nuts and bolts" . What it takes to be able to execute what is in a musician's head: impossible to describe dedication, commitment, and years (life-long) of practice; and why they are underpaid. And, BTW, this does not apply only to jazz musicians. A classical player may have a perfectly clear idea of the tone he wants to produce, but there is no substitute for the practice.

****Check out his dress. Does not have anything to do with his playing, but it sure does look disrespectful. ****

I know Metheny; we went to the same conservatory. I assure you that lack of respect for the music or his elders is the last thing he is guilty of.

****This is true, but, the U.S. Art world is not blameless for this being the case.****

Now, things are getting interesting!

****Society, especially here in the US, values the arts less and less******

This is true, but, the U.S. Art world is not blameless for this being the case.

Cheers

Acman3, unfortunately musicians ARE being replaced by computers - have you heard of the new Virtual Orchestra? Absurd? Yes. Unfortunately, it is now a reality. Let us hope most audiences will not accept it in the future, right now that remains to be seen. It is a crying shame that most ballet companies in the US now dance to recordings rather than a live ensemble. Musicians everywhere have been protesting this, usually with the help of the dancers, but so far to very little effect.

Society, especially here in the US, values the arts less and less. Let's make a comparison to athletics. Musicians in the professional orchestras of this country have worked just as long and hard in their training, beginning at just as early of an age, as the professional athletes have, with odds as long of actual success in the field. We also use much weaker muscle groups that have to last for much longer careers. Yet the top athletes make many, many times what the top musicians do. I am a fairly big sports fan (soccer, basketball, tennis, swimming especially), so this is not said to denigrate athletes at all - I just wish that the arts were as appreciated in our society.

Nice interview, and playing by Hall and Metheny. Pat mentioned something that was a recurring answer in Nica's book "Three Wishes". That is, to reconcile what you can do, with, what's in your head. In the book a lot of guys wished they could play what was in their heads.

I don't think I understand that statement. If you can think it or visualize it, what's to keep you from playing it. We are speaking of professional players, of course. Is it a physical thing?

Btw, what ever happened to Gabor Szabo? I have a lot of his stuff on LP.

I have the Metheny and Mays stuff on LP. But he didn't make the cut to CD. Jim Hall did. I think my favorite on guitar is Burrell.

Yesterday while listening to Cannonball, he talks alot on his albums, he mentioned the lack of blues in modern Jazz.

Did anyone notice that Hall wore a tie and Metheny didn't. Just saying. :)

Cheers

Pointless but fun. As the man said, take with much salt.

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/orchestra-569062-philharmonic-symphony.html

Cheers

Acman3:

Well, I don't understand why Metheny didn't have a computer play his part. Should have been easy to do, based on his playing.

I hope this is nipped in the bud. What a sterile passionless thing.

Another thing that crossed my mind. These guys do not respect theirs elders or the pioneers in the music. Check out his dress. Does not have anything to do with his playing, but it sure does look disrespectful. It degrades the music. IMHO.

Can you imagine the NYP in jeans, tank tops and ball caps on sideways.

Thanks for the clip.

Cheers

Can COMPUTERS play Bop?

Can musicians be replaced by computers? Learsfool said all the younger players want to sound the same in the orchestra.

Can musicians play Bop?

Can feel and intuition in music ever be programed, or are they a human characteristic?

Do we even want them to be able to?

Rok, you and reality are total strangers.

If you did / do, not realize that the Germans have not changed one Iota since the Nazi era, you did not pay attention.
Lets get back to music. Jazz anyone?

Cheers

Rok, no doubt much of what I say is nonsense to be sure.
I'ts clear I've not been blessed with your mental acuity.

But the one thing I've never been accused of is not paying attention .

Rok2 Kid, since I was there and you were not ,how do you know?
In reality , many were murderous gangs , Armed mobs was a polite term.

If you ever lived in Germany, you didn't pay attention.

and

your post is nonsense.

Cheers

More thoughts . Germany, having learned that hate and militarism is for fools,is now perhaps the sanest of the large States.
In Germany a HS teacher makes 2/3 of what Docs do and has has more social prestige.
Any player in the Berlin Phil has more prestige than either.
The conductor is a half-step below God.
In Leipzig during the last stages of the GDR, Kurt Masur was God.
He walked the streets alone , telling people to be calm and non-violent, no one else could have done it. To this day a hallowed figure in eastern Germany.

Lord, Lord, my burden is heavy.

*****Eloquently and beautifully stated*****
comments like this just encourage him.

I never said they didn't deserve 102k, I said it was a lot of money. It still is. His rant didn't change that. I think most musicians never make what they are worth. I even think Wynton is under paid at lincoln Center.

Did not mean to trash the Minnesota Orchestra. Have a few of their CDs. LvB's 9th in SACD is a favorite. At least they record, which is more than can be said of most American Groups.

I have real empathy for all the Jazz / Blues / Pop and R&B people that never got the financial or public acclaim they derserved. But plenty of others got filthy rich off of their talents and efforts. It's actually a National shame.

Having said all that, there are plenty of professions more essential to modern society than musicians. They, musicians, can be replaced by computers!! hahahahhah not The Frogman or Learsfool of course.

Teachers, Cops, The Military, Doctors and even Lawyers come to mind. :) And lets not forget prison guards!!!!

let the String section of the NYP not show up for work, and then let the gabarge collectors not show up for work!! See which wheel gets the grease.

Most of this is just in fun. My real issue with Schubert is that he said the US Army and the USMC were armed mobs.

BTW, Frogman you should always carry a card with the phone number of the New York Philharmonic, just in case you ever get hit by a bus, they can call the trombome section to rush to your aid. :) Hell, who needs doctors anyway!

Could a computer play Be-bop?

Cheers

Just so, Frog, not to mention a good bassoonist is much harder to find than a competent Doc.

Eloquently and beautifully stated.

Rok, your comments surprise me given your deep appreciation for music and musicians.

****Ask the average working person in this country****

****Many / most people, work all their lives perfecting or improving their craft. Not just musicians.****

All bias aside, professional musicians are not average working persons, and most "working persons" don't even have a craft; never mind spending their lives perfecting and improving what they do for work. That has not been my experience. Of course there are many walks of life besides music that involve a craft and many of those craftsmen do spend their lives perfecting and improving their craft. The successful ones often make much more than $100,000.

****Doctors are immeasurably more important to a society than bassoon players. A ludicrous comparison.****

That's a matter of opinion as already pointed out. And while I would have chosen viola or banjo (sorry, couldn't resist) instead, most successful doctors make far more than $100,000, so I don't understand your objection to the comparison.

----------

Q: How can one tell if the floor of the concert hall stage is level?
A: The violist is drooling out of both sides of his mouth.

:-):-):-)

Rok2id, Reading you post again, I can not but agree the comparison between a bassoon player and a Doctor is ludicrous,the bassoonist is much more important.

Jazz groups are the one category we've only lightly touched on. While everyone is familiar with Lambert, Hendricks, and Ross; how about Lambert, Hendricks, and Bavan, with Clark Terry, and Coleman Hawkins. Here is "Sack Of Woe" by them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=--dBgh8Y52Y

New York Voices is another group I like; here's "Stolen Moments", an Oliver Nelson tune, they do very well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CP6mX_HtgGI

Manhattan Transfer is another fine group; lets take a trip on "Route 66"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQwb4SpNuKo

There are many new groups that I'm not familiar with. Tell us about your favorite groups, or other tunes by these groups.

Enjoy the music.

Not so, I'd rather NEVER see a Doctor than not hear Classical
Music Live, I am positive I would have been dead in both body and soul long ago without it.

Most people have a year or two at the job 20 times in a row.

Minnesota SO received RAVE rewiews in Europe , London Times called it the best in the world, which before its strike it was and will be again.

If anything I understated my case in 1st post.Music is God's greatest gift to man, save his son, and Classical Music is the acme of it, the pinnacle of Western Civilazation, and is so considered in every corner of the world.

Coming from abject poverty in the very bowels of the working class myself, no one is more aware of the great evil inherent in the huge inequity in income in the USA.
Classical musicians fight it by producing beauty , without which there is no hope, that the poorest person can readily access by turning on the radio.

Another view.

Schubert is hyperbole personified.

102k is a lot of money. Ask the average working person in this country.

Doctors are immeasurably more important to a society than bassoon players. A ludicrous comparison.

Many / most people, work all their lives perfecting or improving their craft. Not just musicians.

Minnesota is among the best Orchestras, only if that list is made up of many, many ensembles, OR, Europe is no longer with us.

I agree that housing in the Twin Cities, like most urban areas in the country, is expensive.

Cheers

I didn't want to be the first to say it, but Schubert is absolutely correct.

Thank you, Schubert!

102 K for someone who worked harder and longer to prefect their craft than the average doc or dentist is not a lot of money. A simple middle-class home in Twin Cities is 300-400 K.
Minnesota is one of greatest bands in the world, to play there you are like the Doc's at another Minnesota icon, the Mayo Clinic, the best of the best.

Rok, several Minnesota orchestra players left to go to other positions during that very lengthy lockout they had, so they now need to be replaced, including more than one principal player, if I remember right. Certainly the principal clarinet left, one of the most high profile ones to do so - he took a position in the LA Phil. I assume that is what this probably refers to - it may not be an increase in the actual number of positions, just filling the open ones they have now. I can look it up fairly easily if you really want to know, though, just let me know. FYI, some of the very largest orchestras in the carry have over 90 musicians.

The Frogman / Learsfool:

Minnesota is now back in business. Part of the agreement allows for an increase in personnel from 77 to 84.

What does this mean? What sort of players could they now need, that they didn't have before?

Minimum base salary is now $102,284!!

Wow!! nice gig.

Cheers

Forgive me if someone before covered these, I tried to read through most of the posts. I'm new here, but like to get other ideas about albums I may have missed or never heard. I like posts like this one, so I'll throw two out there for you guys/girls.

In reference to Julie London Foster, who I haven't listened to closely until after this post, and I agree is an amazing american signer. I'd like to suggest another american singer who I think is equally as good but in the other direction of Jazz. She's maybe a little more grimy, and maybe the recordings aren't as crisp as Julie London, but they are alive and breathtaking.

Nina Simone-Pastel Blues

And one more that I was surprised I never heard about until a D.J. last year was playing it in the record store.

Johnny Dyani-Witchdoctor's Son

She really did, I've read dozens of her friends and colleagues and saying this.
Also, they all said she was as nice a person as they ever met and it was not the usual false praise of the dead.
She also gave great amount of money to Child Charaties, just a great human being.

I hear you on Julie London Foster 9, beyond doubt the best american female ballad singer.

05-02-14: Schubert

Thanks Schubert. I've listened to recordings by many other females and in the past months for me her sound has passed them by. It's all about her "sound." Her recordings may not be jazz per se but she certainly is a "jazzy" woman. I did not know she lacked confidence in her talent. That's ironic. She was remarkable in her talent.

I hear you on Julie London Foster 9, beyond doubt the best american female ballad singer.
But she had little confidence in her own talent and sang what her producers put in front of her.
The few recordings she made of real upbeat hard-core jazz songs, showed her to be every bit as good at that as well.

Mitch4t:

Nice clip of Bey with Silver. His voice for some reason reminded me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPclJvyF_70

I have this Cd, I need to play it more.

Cheers

.
Check out Andy Bey's singing on Horace Silver's 'Total Response' album. 'Old Mother Nature Calls' is the vocal that I like on this LP.
.

I went thru an ECM phase also. Didn't quite do it for me, even though I found Jarrett intriguing. Esp the Koln concert. The ECM albums had great sound quality and playing, just did not speak to me.

Julie London was a great singer and actress. She is currently appearing on the Western channel with Cooper, in 'Man of the West'.

Beautiful voice and a stone Fox.

My latest 'discovery': http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jDDtUFUgbM

Will receive the CDs in a few days. I think I will like his style. Where have these people been hiding?

Cheers

I find it absolutely astonishing how tastes change over the years. Mine have gone full circle, now I'm back to where I began with "Blue Note".

Keith Jarret, Terje Rypdal, "Cadona", the group, John Abercrombie, Ralph Towner, Jan Gabarek, and Gary Burton, are just some of the musicians represented by my ECM phase as a music lover. I classify that phase and those musicians as quite introspective at that time.

Pat Metheny and Chic Corea were also with ECM, they've changed, and so have I; especially Pat Metheny, I can't get enough of his outing with Anna Maria Jopek on "Upojenie". Not only is the music outstanding, but so is the recording quality.

Enjoy the music.

I don't know if Julie London has been mentioned in this thread or not. I mentioned her excellence in a thread I started a couple months ago and she only got a little love from few posters. The more I listen to her, the more I realize she is an uncrowned queen of ballads. So much beauty and perfection in her voice that it boggles my mind.

"What Is This Thing Called Love?"
"Blue Moon"
"What's New?"
"Willow Weep For Me"
"Cry Me a River"
"A Cottage For Sale"
"Don't Worry Bout Me"
"S'Wonderful"
"Go Slow"
"Doncha Go Away Mad"
"Gone With the Wind"
"You Do Something To Me"
"You're Getting To Be A Habit With Me"
"Laura"