Jazz for aficionados

Thank You- orpheus10- I will look into Abdul Malik.

Paul Chambers on deck...

Abdul Malik, is a bassist we only touched upon; while he's known for adding a mideastern flavor, I would like for us to investigate the numerous times he has been a sideman with other jazz musicians.




          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5_Ciot3wsE


          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kPrfmqOaTM



          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebru71tMvzw



Enjoy the music.

Hi O-10 - I am pretty sure I have read a transcript of that discussion before, but when I get a chance (I see the whole thing is an hour long) I will definitely check that out - thanks for posting it!  

Rok, Javant, here is some interesting work by Mingus, that I don't think Rok presented;


                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0uOJzabdqQ


                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOKjTzW4IWM


                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiWrMX6bJCs




I like this album because of the varied changing moods it presents; reminds me of when you look at the sky and the sun is shining, then abruptly dark clouds are overhead. I use to play this for my parents when I was at home, "Yall quite bugging me now, just let me be cool".




Enjoy the music

Orpheus, perception is strange. Have 'Salt S.' album as well, now you made me check it for H.Parlan. Had no idea he was playing there, always thought about that record as one where Eric Gale plays nice sounding, blues guitar.Those Cti recordings are kind of baroquesque. Here is another album of Stanley Turrentine from period that I like more, and aldo I have it since long time ago, to my surprise just noticed that Parlan plays there too. 
'Up at Minton's'

https://youtu.be/-JReGzY6C08?list=PLF46F133F083566FD

Rok, Lee Morgan is "smokin" as usual. Wes Montgomery sounds better on albums before he had those hits, and changed to a more popular oriented sound. I only have scratchy records of the time when he was deep in a jazz groove. New CD's sound so much better than records.

Alex, I remember Horace Parlan from Mingus Albums, also he was especially good on "Salt Song" with Stanley Turrentine; these are the albums I have with his work as a sideman, now I'll have to get one where he's the leader.



Enjoy the music.

Thanks! for sharing- orpheus10 & rok.
Happy Listening!

Today's Listen:

Lee Morgan -- LEEWAY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybtS1HM-aJ0   

Wynton Kelly / Wes Montgomery -- SMOKIN' AT THE HALF NOTE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4qLD3c2rGA  

Cheers

The Grammy Awards:

I can't decide which was more absurd, The Categories, The "winners", or the so-called 'Music' itself?

I did recognize about three names.  The Fairfield Four, Tony Bennett and Buddy Guy.

The Fairfield Four won in a new category:  "Roots Gospel."  WTF is that?   Wiki says it was created this year to 'protect' traditional (real) Gospel.   So modern day noise makers could win awards in Gospel Music.  Sort of like kid's sports these days.  Everyone gets a trophy. What a farce!!

And people howled and sneered when I suggested Jazz might need a little 'protection'.

Someone said 1959 was the Greatest Year in Jazz.   1939 was the Greatest year in Hollywood.   When you think about it, the arts in this country have been in decline for a long time.

I used to be able to name  the conductors of all the major US and European Symphony Orchestras. The were giants.   Legendary.   Who are they now?   Who knows / cares. 

One Frenchman's Opinion.

Cheers

Horace Parlan, plays piano on Mingus album, also  played  with Lou Donaldson, Booker Ervin, Eddie ‘Lockjaw’ Davis, Johnny Griffin, Rahsaan Roland Kirk and others. He  made few recordings as leader for  a Blue Note label,at the begining of 60's in various set ups. This one is in trio form, called simply Us3, that I like. Probably he is in that 'underrated' category.
Here is the link

https://youtu.be/BsEDeLrk65k?list=PL34877C742F2457B0

IME, 1959 (the best year in Jazz) Mingus really took off both musically/professionally. Ah Um.

lEARSFOOL AND Frogman, this is especially for you two guys; these top jazz musicians are talking to other musicians about "music". While I enjoyed this clip, I didn't always know what they were talking about; but they discussed "modal" and other aspects of music.

Although the center of the discussion was "Kind Of Blue", they went much farther than that; it was about Miles Music. First and foremost, this documentary is about "music"; consequently, Learsfool there's a lot you will understand in this documentary, that eludes me.



              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RqrBKfg1sE


              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSwyd0E767Y&list=PL0F7DF9D912BA575B



              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-EgyUcHSSQ



Enjoy the music.

Jafant, many of my favorites by Mingus are on this album.



                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPT__sB6hgU

Rok, as long as I've been listening to jazz, and that includes listening at a variety of friends homes, you would think that I had at least heard about almost every album in this time frame and genre (that's what I thought) I've never heard of either one of these albums; I'll have to get them.

"The Big 6" has made an old tune brand new; each one of those musicians is a star.



Enjoy the music.

Orpheus - I suspect we aren't that different, age-wise.  Childhood: what a mixed bag...dreams and nightmares but definitely, some magical moments.

Today's Listen:   


Modern Jazz Quartet -- MJQ & FRIENDS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XH0eZSqIris&index=13&list=PLkvefAESc4RE0cEeElzmWTv9NzC33R7VM    

Blue Mitchell -- BIG 6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn5XzaL2K20&list=PLGdgbOOYV_kV027psKqOP2aDj-lDBxuCN

Both Discs are just wonderful.


The Frogman:  One of the Composers of 'Billy's Bounce' was a guy named Billy Kyle, hence the name.  I guess.

Cheers

Jafant, although Charles Mingus plays bass, I don't think of him as a bassist because of all the music he's composed, and fantastic records he's made.

I hope that's not too confusing, but when you get to be an old jazz "aficionado" you'll understand.



                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sfe_8RAaJ0



Enjoy the music.

Ghosthouse, I really appreciated your thoughtful post. When you get to be an old man, there is nothing more precious than childhood memories; this was at a time when everyday revealed something new and magical, that you shared with "a childhood friend".

Thank you.




Enjoy the music.

Hang in there Orpheus10-

as above, our next Jazz Bassist is Mingus. Discuss...

Lost childhood, lost friends and regrets - certainly not unique to you alone, O. Thanks for sharing those memories.

I hope the words in this song are true...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdtAfUtOEWA

I don’t believe it’s all for nothing
It’s not just written in the sand
Sometimes I thought you felt too much
And you crossed into the shadow land

And the river was overflowing
And the sky was fiery red
You gotta play the hand that’s dealt ya
That’s what the old man always said

Fallen angel
Casts a shadow up against the sun
If my eyes could see
The spirit of the chosen one

In my dream the pipes were playing
In my dream I lost a friend
Come down Gabriel and blow your horn
’Cause some day we will meet again

There is Leon Thomas the musician, and Leon my childhood friend; when they had the funeral for Leon the famous musician (famous in St. Louis) I had to close on the very same house I'm living in right now, and I couldn't attend both. In hindsight I wish I had canceled, and scheduled the closing for another day.

After Leon's funeral, I was sorry I didn't attend, but I got over it. Now it's hitting me that wasn't just Leon the musician's funeral, that was also Leon my childhood friend; we use to catch grasshoppers together in the field behind our houses. Me, him, and his brother went swimming together. You are never supposed to eat anything before going swimming, but he ate a half a chicken with lettuce and tomatoes every time before we went swimming, and never got a cramp, or gained weight; those are some of my memories.

The eerie part of this is, now I hear Leon my childhood friend, as opposed to Leon the musician. He sounds better than ever on these new CD's, and I'm enough of an "audiophile"to consider that an objective statement. I admit it would take a psychiatrist to sort this out, but I'm reconciling with those two people; soon I will have them focused into one person.

I think I have resolved my quite personal "Leon Thomas dilemma", now we can go on to other things.





Enjoy the music.

I would like to add one thing about musicians and money - the vast majority of musicians do not make very much at all from album sales.  Only the very top artists who sell millions of albums make good money from sales - the record labels kept just about all of those profits.  This is also true of the studio musicians in Hollywood - there are only about 300 or so musicians total in LA who make a lot of money from royalties from films they played on.  And for orchestral musicians, while we often get small payments from making a recording, this is insignificant compared to our regular income.  Some of the top soloists will make some nice royalties, but even for them, the majority of their income is from the actual live performances.   

So many of those jazz musicians O-10 is asking about would indeed have made more money touring and performing than they did from recordings, again only excepting the very top names.  

There are actually many battles going on right now for musicians to get paid fairly in this digital day and age.  I would encourage everyone on this board who loves music and musicians to write their congressman in support of the Fair Play Fair Pay Act.  I'm bad at providing links, but this can be googled for those curious, which I hope would be all of you, or I can speak more about it in another post if people want. 

***** Rok, while checking out Jimmy Blanton records I ran across this and knew you were a fan. Can’t figure out why? ;0 )*****

I just love American Opera Divas.   Started with the tough, street wise, NYC babe,  Beverly Sills.  Battle is a treat to hear and see! She conquered the Opera World, but never forgot her church roots.

I will assume this was made prior to her musical relationship with Wynton.  Otherwise, I am sure he would have been the trumpet player.

I have a 3 CD set by Ellington called "The Blanton-Webster Band". Also one Cd titled "This one's for Blanton" with Ellington and Ray Brown.  This should tell you what Ellington thought of him.

Thanks for the clip of Miss Battle.  I do miss her.

Cheers

Hey Frogman - Thanks for your insights into preparations for that Mingus sextet performance.  

"...that solo by Dolphy is deliciously strange."  :-)  Well said.  I'm no Dolphy-ologist but the little I know, that seems to be the story on him.  Zappa certainly appreciated him.  (Yet another who died too soon).

http://www.allmusic.com/song/eric-dolphy-memorial-barbecue-mt0010976240

Rok, while checking out Jimmy Blanton records I ran across this and knew you were a fan. Can’t figure out why? ;0 )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLVbIT-y7ts

Rok, sometime you have a hard time understanding things; before Leon Thomas was anything, he was a childhood friend, and now he's dead. Although he's been dead since 99, I haven't dealt with that fact. I might start a record, and then stop it. When he was alive, I enjoyed his records, but now it's a mixed bag.

This is no different than if you were hearing a childhood friends voice that was no longer with us. I should have dealt with his death when he died, but I didn't; and now whether I want to deal with it or not, I have no choice. It's no fun dealing publicly with something I should have dealt with a long time ago, but such is life.



Enjoy the music.

****let's talk about Jazz bassist...Was there anyone of significance prior to Scott LaFaro?****

You bet there was.  Duke Ellington's bassist Jimmy Blamton was very influential .  How about Ray Brown, Paul Chambers, Milt Hinton, Charles Mingus, Wilbur Ware?  And of course the already mentioned Pettiford.  LaFaro was a pivotal figure in the bass world but hardly the first important bass player. 

Re jazz musicians and money: don't know much about Grant Green the person, so I don't know about his particular situation. I do know that the lifestyle of jazz musicians does not promote good money-management habits.  Being in the road all the time is very difficult and can lead to bad decision making that can affect your pocket book.  Think about it: who is more likely to save his money and possibly even invest some of it?  The guy who is on the road all the time and who is dealing with the endless temptations of life on the road or late-night gigs; or, the guy with the stable home life and family?  

Re Mingus/Take The A Train:

Agree that Mingus had a very tight and well rehearsed band.  But for the sake of perspective: I would bet anything that for that performance of A Train they probably did nothing more than talk about the order of the solos.  No rehearsal. Not a criticism, but a testament to the experience and talent of the players involved.  There's no arrangement to speak of and rehearse; just play the melody after the traditional piano intro, everyone takes a solo and there may be backgrounds made up on the spot.  For guys like that, playing A Train is like a great chef making scrambled eggs; at a very very high level.  Again, not a criticism at all, but simply to point out that it's pretty standard fare; a popular tune that everyone knows and can play in their sleep.  Still, great music and great playing.  Btw, that solo by Dolphy is deliciously strange.

Rok, Ghosthouse is exactly right; Anderson is conducting.  Specifically, he is counting down the last couple of measures in the last chorus of the tenor solo so that the band can all come back in at the right time.  While it would normally be Wynton's job to do that, Anderson is in the front of the band where he can be seen by all. 

Glad to see so many great posts. 

Rok - 
I think he's sort of conducting...counting off so they all hit the (time signature?) change together.  Clarinets come in for a little break and then the trombone guy solos.  

Loved how everybody was really watching the drummer on his solo last part of Poco Loco.  What a great show.  Just want to say again, I really enjoyed that whole thing.  Held my interest all the way through.  THANKS.

Rok - thanks so much for that Wynton Marsalis.  The sound is EXCELLENT on it.  For one reason and another a bit of a downer kind of day but it is putting a smile on my face.  REALLY liked the opening Horace Silver piece.  Wynton's solo on Inner Urge was fantastic.  The whole thing has my toes tapping.  Thanks again.  I feel like I know sh** about jazz; so much of this is new and great fun.  Thanks again.

re the Mingus performance/film...I would have loved to just hang with those guys.  Pack up their gear or whatever; watch rehearsals (now that would really be something).  

Later.  Ciao.

Ahmed Abdul Malik was an interesting bass player; he was of Sudanese descent and played with Thelonious Monk, Randy Weston, and Coleman Hawkins. This is his most exotic record.


                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVDnfy9soNU


                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOGqAvElCAs




Enjoy the music.

This is a long clip.   The last tune is Bud Powell's "Un Poco Loco".

Great tune.  Does anyone know what Wes Anderson is doing at 51:44.   The tune starts at 47:20.   Feel free to skip ahead. :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4BC3vErvpc

Cheers

***** Hey Rok - when you get a chance, check this out.  Curious what you think of it (hoping it is new to you but pro'ly. not).*****

The Greatest ever, small group composer, playing the music of the Greatest ever, big band composer,  there is only one thing to think;  I wish I was there.   They were pretty close to the audience, but that did not seem to affect them.   I had seen this clip before, but never really noticed the vocal support of the players before.

The first time I ever heard Mingus on LP, way back in the day, a friend who turned me on to Mingus, and  was playing it on his system, said to me, "this guy's bands are always very tight and well rehearsed.  No sloppy, this is good enough, nonsense".   He was right.   I have been hearing it ever since.    Great clip.

Cheers

Orpheus - OK.  I getcha.  No argument from me on the "artist" not always getting their fair share "back in the day".  Plenty of examples even outside jazz where unscrupulous agents and managers ripped off their clients.  Sad story about Grant Green.  Was reading about Jaco Pastorius the other day.  Another tragedy.  The business model does seem to have changed for the better in many ways.  

Ghosthouse, jazz musicians depended more on record sales than concert tours. I forgot what the ticket prices were, but this wasn't a stadium; jazz musicians depended on record sales, and although records were selling, the musicians didn't seem to reap the benefits. Now there are local musicians who record, and sell their own CD's; they're living at about the same level as someone with a good job; nice house, new car; they are not hurting.

Maybe Frogman will chime in and enlighten us; we're not talking about musicians with big dope habits who could make any amount of money and still be broke.



Enjoy the music.

My point Ghosthouse was that with all the records he made, why should he be so desperate for money? I know nothing about the music business, but that used to occur far too often with jazz musicians; but now that "Rappers" are taking care of everything in the business of recording and distribution, they're rolling in dough.

While "Rappers" may sell more records, jazz musicians sold over a longer period of time; there's no way jazz musicians should have been desperate for money. Local musicians who work on a regular basis aren't desperate for money. What I'm saying is that when too many people are handling things, money disappears.

Are we on the same wave length? If not I'll come back.

Believe it or not; I read that Leon was going to be in town, appearing at the same joint where I saw Grant Green.

During intermission, I saw guys from the old neighborhood gathered around Leon on the sidewalk out front. Naturally I joined them and began reminiscing about old times. All of a sudden, two tons of ugly comes running up with the assumption I'm causing trouble with the star he's hired to protect. When he starts running off at the mouth, they leave me on the sidewalk with Mr. 5 X 5 two tons of the ugliest bouncer you ever saw. (Deja Vu) It seems I've been here before.

You got that right, I never went back to that joint again.

Orpheus - apologies but you will have to connect the dots for me on the why for the Grant Green bio.  Don't misinterpret my comments as being down on musicians getting paid and making money.  It's more a case of their priorities...doing what they love first and eventually getting paid or producing a contrived product calculated to "sell".  That's the best I can explain what makes m crazy about "the industry".  When you are inclined, let me know why you brought up Mr. Green.  Thanks.

YAW, Jafant - as ever, a pleasure to talk about the music.  

Hey Rok - when you get a chance, check this out.  Curious what you think of it (hoping it is new to you but pro'ly. not).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuCbQCnoIzI 

Ciao.

Many of the best jazz songs are like a short story. I've written a vignette for this song.  The name of the song is "invitation", and now the song becomes alive with your imagination.

There's a mid city lounge that feature strong drinks and good jazz; they run a reel plus a juke box, and jazz lovers like to come in to listen and unwind. Coincidentally, an attractive lady and a guy happen to be at opposite ends of the bar regularly. There's a long mirror on the wall behind the bar; not wanting to be obvious, they had been checking each other out in the mirror; but this time they got caught and discovered they were both checking each other out. They smiled at their reflections in the mirror.

He was just trying to recover from the end of a love affair and not to eager to start another. She had different ideas. They left separately without engaging in conversation, although she wished he would make a move; this is where the song begins.



                [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyp1yvSBq5I[/url]





Enjoy the music.

TY- orpheus10 & ghosthouse.
Happy  Listening!

Ghosthouse, Grant Green died going on tour because he needed money, when his doctor told him not to go.

Grant spent much of 1978 in hospital and, against the advice of doctors, went back on the road to earn some money. While in New York to play an engagement at George Benson's Breezin' Lounge, Grant collapsed in his car of a heart attack in New York City on January 31, 1979. He was buried in Greenwood Cemetery in his hometown of St. Louis, Missouri, and was survived by six children. Since Green's demise, his reputation has grown and many compilations of both his earlier (post-bop/straight ahead and soul jazz) and later (funkier/dancefloor jazz) periods, exist.

They can say what they want to say about "Rappers" but they're taking care of business and making money.

I think your evaluation of Leon is "right on target". Now I'm going to pipe your link into the big rig, relax and listen.



Enjoy the music.

Thanks for the Caterina Valente, Orpheus.  Not my usual listening but those certainly open a window back to another time, "In the days before rock 'n; roll" to quote Van.  How did things get so f'd up?  Love the somewhat busy string arrangement on The Breeze and I.  More and more these days, those arrangers are my heroes.  Kind of working off camera, if you will.  

Just another comment on Leon...he's someone who serves the music.  Not the other way around as is too much the case nowadays where so often music is just a convenient vehicle for self-promotion.  

Talk about killer arrangements.  Please give a listen to the following.  The LP is good but let's cut to the chase...the main point can be heard by dropping your needle right down at 20:30.  For me this is absolutely one of the best songs EVER.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayW8uK1JwTE
Kinda sad to me that Curtis got a lot more credit for a song that William wrote and recorded first! Hope you will enjoy it.

Jafant - listening right now to Hartman with Coltrane.  My amateur opinion is that Johnny's vocal style is a bit more studied than Leon's.  I hear Sinatra (or maybe even a bit of Dean Martin) in Johnny's "tone" (not talking influences, just similarities),  Leon's style is more "naive" and his tone quite different to my ear.  I think Donny's voice is slightly higher pitched than Leon when comparing the two signing a straight lyric (it changes when Leon does that yodeling!).  This might raise some eyebrows but when I listen to Leon getting into the mid and lower half of his range, I hear shades of Barry White.  Barry's generally a whole lot deeper but the two have a similar kind of rich tone.  Upper half, I'm thinking Nat King Cole. (Hope no one decides to throw stones now!)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSYwGEiowHg

Rok, you know that Lou Rawls is my favorite male vocalist; that hasn't changed, and I like Diane Reeves, what's there not to like?

Enjoy the music.

I just got Leon's CD "Spirits Known and Unknown"; the music is fantastic and so is the recording quality.

It has one controversial cut; I wouldn't touch that subject with a ten foot pole, I fulfilled my military obligations at the time Viet Nam started. If that's a problem, I suggest finding another CD with as much of the music you can find that's on this CD minus Viet Nam.

I'm having trouble listening to his voice or looking at his picture; he sounds and looks the same as I remember, jovial and smiling.

When he sings song for my father, I can see his father; Leon looked a lot like his father. I'm going to have to listen to this CD in stages; enough for now.


Enjoy the music.

I don't think Leon Thomas has ever received this much 'press' in his entire life.
And this from the same group of folks, that dismissed the Bey Sisters in one short sentence.   Makes a body wonder.

Wanna hear some real singing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M__j_feCKG0

Cheers

Was Leon similar to Donny Hathaway ?
Johnny Hartman?

Here's a singer that I really liked when I was in high school.



                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G35oUvfqnsk



                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbCJbnNDmoM




Enjoy the music.