Officially the Ahmad Jamal review is over; Acman, and me simply realized we have an "Ahmad Jamal" gap in our collections that needs filling in. Feel free to post whatever you like, and we'll review it.
Enjoy the music.
Jazz for aficionados
Orpheus, I am not sure have we understood each other. Of course that I am using ytube as well, to hear music of interest. If I like it, always try to buy it, on cd and than I may choose to write about it. So, I 'review' only albums that I already have. Wanted to say that if we are all aware that for examp. Jamal is inspiring artists and if we all have posted favorite albums, or albums that we have or think as good I am sure that any of us will be capable of finding more of his music. Of course that you or anybody else may post more of his interesting findings anytime. |
Acman, I have fewer of Ahmads albums than any other major jazz artist, if I only reviewed what I have in my collection, we would have been through, but the object of this thread is to add new music, and it has functioned quite well for me. Since I have so few of Ahmad's albums, I will continue to search through "you tube" and share what I find with you guys who don't believe you should use "you tube". The man is forever changing, and always interesting, and he gets the most out of any musicians that accompany him; as is illustrated on this cut. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMS9SGtIy6g Enjoy the music. |
Acman, that is so beautiful! Believe it or not, I have met a number of sax players whose last name was coleman; no not that one, he's older, they were younger; just a strange coincident. Ahmad was really digging that sax, I noted the expression on his face. This is an unusual trio for him. You know he was going to have to appear at Lincoln Center. What separates Ahmad from many other musicians is his sense of "aesthetics"; every body wants it, and would like to have it, but not everybody got it; he just seems to make all of his music pretty. I cut him a loose after one bad album; a big mistake on my part because he got better with age. If we are going to review one artist, we should all focus on that artist. Maybe we should simply erase that method of moving forward from this forum. Enjoy the music. |
Alex, I am unaware of any jazz on this forum, old or new, that I did not gain insight from. Your preferred style is no different. I am amazed at the level of talent that has been forgotten, by the passing of time, but if you look at the big names we have discussed, we can always use more input. Take Ahmad Jamal. Great talent, long career, many records, nearly impossible to have them all. I have about 4000 recordings but only 3-4 of Jamal. If others have the same recordings we have a very incomplete look at Mr. Jamal. Also, I have noticed on this and other long threads that going different directions at the same time, is not nessesaraly bad, and seems to keep people involved when discussion goes in directions they hate(fusion), or even worse, have no interest in( Rok's point). I found so many fantastic YouTube videos, that I could never find a break in discussion to add, so I just lost them, but as O-10 has said "we can walk and chew gum". My opinion, Just put them out there, before you lose them. |
Acman and Orpheus, so far I have always tried to point out at some of the artists and their work that were, imho, unjustly overlooked. I sincerely hope that some of you guys liked what I’ve posted and perhaps bought some music of ’unknown’ artist that I ’ve mentioned. Always avoided writing about well known names or albums, because I believe if one is realy interested, its quite easy to find lots of info or music online. Mentioning some of the greats (for ’beginners’) and digging some of the hidden ones for the rest, is something that I concentrate on. Somehow ’reviewing’ albums that I dont have feels like ’cheating’, and any album that I realy like, I try to buy anyway. Often, I am looking for a right moment to post something, because the discssions are not always following the clear path. Finally, if somebody has any suggestions how to make this forum better, please share. |
Rok, that was 24 Feb 13; that was over 3 years ago, I ran through my collection of "Jazz" a little while ago. This is the only thorough way to go, and not miss any winners. The last time anybody posted was Thursday; we could have been through with Ahmad, and gone to someone else. If you think this is a bad idea, we can consider Ahmad concluded, and not do it anymore; how's that? Enjoy the music. |
*****
I'm going to ""review records in my collection"", and you'll be able to decide if they're worthy of your collection. These records are what I consider "must haves" for any jazz aficionado,***** From the OPs initial post on Aficionados. Next point, it depends on how you listen to and buy music. I don't do downloads or computer file music, and I don't listen to you-tube clips as a source, except for the ones posted here. I want to hear from a person who owns the LP/CD and can speak to the entire package. All the tracks, the notes / booklet, the recording quality and the presence of "filler" if any. The history / details. You-tube is good to post 'samples' of the CD. The "100 best from the 1950's" is a case in point. Lastly, having to stick to one artist is like being in music school. Hmmmmmmmm. The variety of folks just posting the stuff they listened to recently is the best way to keep things interesting. Suppose we all hated Jamal?? Cheers |
Acman, initially some music was on 'you tube' without the artists permission, and that music was taken down, but after the artists discovered, with, or without their permission, it was beneficial to them, because the artists have so many records that were forgotten long ago, and without "you tube" it's for sure they would stay forgotten, plus they have some really boss records that were forgotten. My point of view is quite simple; reviewing records that I have not heard before, then deciding whether or not the record is worth writing a review on, and then writing the review is work, and if this work was spread around, it would be fun. Alex, and Rok, never stated their reasons for not wanting to review records that aren't in their collections? You're right about Ahmad dipping his big toe into fusion, but didn't stay long. That suit was a dandy allright; didn't look like his style, but what do I know. Ahmad slipped a time or two just like the rest of the artists; I noticed "Jamalca" in my collection, but I didn't think too much of it. None of the rest of the records waiting for review are in my collection. Enjoy the music. |
O-10, I was in my last few clips showing that Ahmad Jamal was not entirely unaffected by fusion, although on the first cut, you can still hear his unique playing. The second was, at least to me, a horrible version of a Steely Dan cover. The comment on the suit was supposed to be funny. I know that suit is sure hilarious ! |
I can surely see why someone would want to only review music they own, as they would have had time to know the music, and have had a chance to hear the little nuances in the music. Then they might be ready to discuss what they have heard and sometimes even how their opinion changed or grew stronger with more listening. I also think we have a great resource in YouTube, and there is no way any of us can have a third of someone like Ahmad Jamel's music in our library, much less keep up with music from older less known, and newer emerging artist in the past 40+ years. We can play what music we have and stuff we don't from YouTube and both learn together, from and with each other, or just play the music we know and own, and HOPE someone here owns different music to show us music we may have missed or quite honestly just forgotten . Ultimately it will, of course, be up to each of us to play what we want to play, and I will respect each of your decisions. Probably much ado about nothing but one Jazz Lovers opinions. |
I must admit that, like Rok, post only albums that I have. Of course that using ytube helps a lot, to hear albums that I might like and buy, but there is one more tool that I can recommend. In my case, its a jazz encyclopedia and there are few good editions. There are lot of informations on internet, but if you already do not know the name of artist or performer, its much more difficult to randomly find his work Rok, if you like 'Legendary' recordings, try the other one that I have posted, 'New chamber music', same line up, simmilar feeling |
Rok, why are you only posting the albums in your collection. "You Tube" is like a library of music that they want everybody to post. In the beginning, some artists objected when their records were posted without their permission, but after it was revealed that resulted in sales of their old records that everybody had forgotten, they no longer objected. Since it is illegal to copy for sale, the artists are not losing anything by exposure through "You Tube"; as a matter of fact, they are gaining sales they otherwise would not have. Please follow the script, we have already reviewed those records. Enjoy the music. |
Today's Listen: that's right, don't like it, too bad. Ahmad Jamal -- THE LEGENDARY OKEH & EPIC RECORDINGS I think Alex already mentioned this CD. I am sure all you Jamal fans have it, otherwise you would not call yourselves fans. Nice notes by Randy Weston. He points out some of the great pianist to come out of Pittsburgh. Erroll Garner, Mary Lou Williams and Jamal. In the pictures of Jamal in the booklet, he looks like a teenager, Which I guess he was not far from being in the 50's. The best place to start with any artist, is in the beginning. This be it. A few from the CD. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttBJKrIcq2M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LM_ntfxkDE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrTx5evEHM4 Ain't got it, git it. Cheers |
Rok, maybe you could help me with my review. "Freelight" was the last album I posted, it was recorded in 1971. We can go forward from there, and you select what you think is worth posting. This is discography from Wikipedia 1971: Freeflight (Impulse!) 1972: Outertimeinnerspace (Impulse!) 1973: Ahmad Jamal '73 (20th Century) 1974: Jamalca (20th Century) 1974: Jamal Plays Jamal (20th Century) 1975: Genetic Walk (20th Century) 1976: Steppin' Out with a Dream (20th Century) 1976: Recorded Live at Oil Can Harry's (Catalyst) 1978: One (20th Century) 1979: Intervals (20th Century) 1980: Live at Bubba's (Digital Master) 1980: Night Song (Motown) 1981: Ahmad Jamal & Gary Burton In Concert 1982: Goodbye Mr. Evans (Shubra) 1985: Digital Works (Atlantic) 1985: Live at the Montreal Jazz Festival 1985 (Atlantic) 1986: Rossiter Road (Atlantic) 1987: Crystal (Atlantic) 1989: Pittsburgh (Atlantic) 1992: Live in Paris 1992 (Birdology) 1993: Chicago Revisited (Telarc) 1994: I Remember Duke, Hoagy & Strayhorn (Telarc) 1994: Ahmad Jamal with The Assai Quartet (Roesch) 1994: Ahmad Jamal at Home (Roesch) 1995: The Essence Part One (Birdology) 1995: Big Byrd: The Essence Part 2 (Birdology) 1996: Ahmad Jamal a Paris (Birdology) 1997: Nature: The Essence Part Three (Birdology) 2000: Picture Perfect 2001: Ahmad Jamal à l'Olympia 2003: In Search of Momentum 2005: After Fajr 2008: It's Magic 2008: Poinciana – One Night Only 2009: A Quiet Time 2012: Blue Moon (Jazzbook Records ) 2013: Saturday Morning (Jazzbook Records) 2014: Ahmad Jamal featuring Yusef Lateef Simply look up the LP on "you tube" and post what you think is significant. Enjoy the music. |
With Ahmad Jamal, you can decide which aspect of his piano you like best; light and whimsical, or really banging, and go with that. Right now I'm listening to "Poinciana", from the album "Freeflight", and it's interestingly different; so different, that I will get that CD if it's available. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQtpRRVk6jA&index=2&list=PLf54dkJsWJ3P7R5HJPkKXGYdbEda_JtpI The way Ahmad gets so much out of the same tune, reminds me of "homeboy" Eddie Fisher, and the way he got so much out of "The Third Cup". I went to see him live every time he appeared at a place called "Mothers". He could work that jam around so many different ways, that you could listen to that one tune all night. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuAQFFOuy3c Enjoy the music. |
Without a doubt, this is the best way to proceed. I'm learning things that I thought I knew by each artist that we review. The bottom line function of this thread is to add the very best music to our collection. Once upon a time I thought new music to my collection, meant the latest music, but now new music to my collection, means the best music, no matter when it was recorded. By reviewing the best artists, we are able to select their best music, no matter when it was recorded; our present system is working much better than I had anticipated. Rok, the purpose of "you tube" is to help us discover new music that we didn't even know existed; if you don't know it exists, you couldn't possibly have it in your collection. By only posting music that's in your collection, you are defeating the purpose of "you tube", which is to help you and everyone else to discover music that is not in their collection. |
I only post music that I own and have on the shelf. I have posted Jamal before on more that one occasion. At the Pershing and Live. If you people would read my posts you would know this. Just received 7 CDs by McCoy Tyner. Will report later. Also Erroll Garner's COMPLETE CONCERT BY THE SEA. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cytUz9KkK9M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zkH-d0IoAU Cheers. |
Ghosthouse, you're one of the regulars, you could never overstay your welcome. Remember back when I said getting this thread to go in a straight line was like herding cats; one cat wants to review every single record by Ahmad Jamal, and another cat that doesn't even know who Ahmad Jamal is. How was the Caribbean Rok? I can see that you got "jet-lag", and I know it takes time to get back together after sailing the islands; I bet you even picked up the accent "Mon". Back here we are still reviewing Ahmad Jamal. We can review anybody you choose next, and we will all contribute to whoever that artist may be. Enjoy the music. |
O- almost left a PS about Stolen Moments last night but figured I was overstaying my welcome ("So, why you back, dude?"). I don’t know that tune at all...just what I heard on AJ’s The Awakening. What struck me is you get to around 30 seconds before the end right at 6:03 of 6:32 total. It seems like he’s going to play a final resolving chord and end it but NO...instead he goes into this interesting (practically solo) chord progression and then with cymbals sizzling behind him, finally brings it to a conclusion. When I heard that...really HEARD it - I wanted to jump up and shout "YEAH"! Glad to see Rok is back...didn’t want you all lonesome, knowing I could never fill his shoes in this thread! :-) |
Back, by popular demand!! Just to get you so-called aficionados, howling and foaming at the mouth. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en6kmiX0SDc Cheers |
Acman, the suit totally eludes me, I'll let somebody else take that one. Bass – John Hurd* Drums – Frank Gant Engineer – Neil Brody Guitar – Calvin Keys Keyboards – Ahmad Jamal Percussion – Selden Newton* I noticed he's sticking with Frank Gant on drums; I'm not familiar with the other artists. I call this nice easy listening, standard Ahmad Jamal. As I remember, the ladies always liked Ahmad Jamal, and if you think of a couple when you listen to this, it will sound better. Enjoy the music. |
I listened to "Stolen Moments" which is a tune I'm familiar with, and Ahmad really captures the beauty of that tune. Every familiar tune that I like, I like it even better the way he does it. It's amazing how much music he gets out of bass, drums and piano. His style has not changed radically since the beginning, and this is 1970 when Miles is into "Bitches Brew", and every body else is in to fusion; that lets you know how constant Ahmad is. Enjoy the music. |
Ghosthouse, I distinctly remember Schubert say he was slipping. The reason I mention this is because I'm only a few years younger than Schubert, and it's better for a person to recognize that he is slipping, than not recognize it; I hope I recognize it, because if you live long enough it's going to happen. My mother in law is all the way gone, we can't let her out of the house by her self, and she always has an appointment she has to keep. Ghosthouse, we discuss almost everything on this thread; now back to the music. From my point of view, KJ plays a fusion of classical and jazz; call it "Classi- Jazz"; that sounds better than "cerebral- jazz". Maybe only smart people like Keith, and I don't quite make that category. Enjoy the music. |
I single out KJ though that's probably not fair...there're others that would fit the bill AND I recognize he is highly regarded by many...including people I respect (e.g., a bro-in-law who is a gifted musician himself). Never the less, I single out Mr. Jarrett because to me, based on my limited exposure, he seems to exemplify this cerebral sort of jazz musician that just loses me on an emotional level. I find AJ a lot more visceral and conveying more emotional content on a frequency I receive. So - that's my O-pinion and you know what they say about those. I like to add to that one..."I have several". We are indeed, "enjoying the music". |
Ghosthouse, you can apologize to the KJ fans for me as well, my listening, and his playing never got in sync. As far as I'm concerned, it's good to be polite, but it's not necessary to go in depth in regard to why you could live without an artist. Some disagree with that. I'm going to proceed from the awakening and go forward; as a matter of fact, "The Awakening" is an album that I can get into and stay awhile; consequently, I wont be jumping to the next thing just yet. Enjoy the music. |
O - I’ll be interested to see what comments you get about The Awakening. It is a 1970 recording so it does jump ahead a good bit from the late 50s time frame you were in. Doesn't matter to me. You can really hear his "classical chops" all through the tracks of that album. I also think his sidemen are really, really good. Things are nice and tight. Need to look at credits and see who he was working with. I’m not a jazz aficionado like some of you (more from a blues/rock listening background) and admittedly very ignorant about jazz so take this with a huge pile of salt - but at this point in time, I listened to 10 seconds of Ahmad Jamal in The Awakening and was hooked. I try to listen to Keith Jarrett for 10 seconds and I’m bored to death in 5. Apologies to the KJ fans. I know he is considered a major talent. Maybe I shouldn’t even be talking about Jamal and Jarrett in the same sentence. Regardless, for me, AJ’s got something and KJ doesn’t. You can chalk it up to ignorance. |
Ahmad Jamal "The Awakening" is the album I'm reviewing today. Ghosthouse, I believe you are already familiar with this album; since it has such a high rating, I'm reviewing it for the rest of the aficionados. According to "Sputnic Music", review by Tyler Fisher; if there was ever a man that never received the credit he deserved, that man was Ahmad Jamal. Jamal played jazz piano differently from everyone else. He had the classical chops to play all over the place and use his jazz knowledge to run across the piano with all kinds of different scales, but Jamal was smarter than that. He knew that 32nd note runs for 8 minutes straight would get boring and tiring. He used space and silence so well that it inspired much of Miles Davis’ playing. However, the world gives Davis the credit for revolutionizing that style of playing. The general public doesn’t even list Jamal in the top ten jazz pianists of all time. Obviously, that means nothing to Jamal, as displayed in his track title I Love Music. That’s really all that matters, and that mindset shines through brilliantly on The Awakening. To know a musician, is to know and love his music; if you know a musician, and idolize his music, it's a good start to a friendship. A musician and his music are one; although that sounds like a simple statement, it takes an aficionado to understand the depth of that statement. It's time to listen to some music; lets begin with the title tune, "The Awakening", this is "classic" Ahmad. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=az5bBFWAI8I Lets go with "Stolen Moments" from that same album. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=274HuIch2GY There you have it, now I'll wait for your take on this album. Enjoy the music. |
Ghosthouse, I saw him live in Chicago, and he really cooked, I mean he doesn't always play with space; he can play a lot of notes when he wants to. If you think about it, his music in your listening room could be quite entertaining, but almost boring on a live set; that's why he set the house on fire; especially in Chicago, his adopted home town. Frogman, I remember Schubert getting messed around, and he felt Audiogon should have been more helpful in resolving it. That's the last time I remember him posting. Whatever the reason for your absence, I'm glad I was wrong, because a professional musician's interpretation of the music is always more definitive. Enjoy the music. |
Frogman, I think your last paragraph is "spot on" and captures my reaction to Jamal perfectly...much better than I could say it. Just listened to that 1958, Poinciana track from the Pershing recordings. Can clearly hear his use of "space" in that one. Much more obvious than in the later and somewhat busier album, The Awakening that I started with this evening. |
I don't know how old Schubert is; but, I know that he is (was?) one of the most musically astute posters on this site. I believe that what happened (based on his own posts that I happened to read) is that he had a very unfortunate experience with a sale and, it seemed to me, caused him to get discouraged and stop posting. I hope he is well. A pause doesn't necessarily mean a "loss". Been traveling a lot and haven't had the time or inclination to post. As I said recently, from my point of view, not only are pauses in posting to be expected, but it might be good to take the sense of urgency out of the equation. Jus sayin. Jamal is the rare player who seems to have found the stylistic sweet spot that appeals to just about every type of listener sensibility. There is an infectious "feel good" quality about his playing that is wonderful. His style is accessible, tuneful and very economical with great use of space (silence). He doesn't crowd a listener's senses with a lot of notes and there is a wonderful simple logic in his style. Love his playing. |
O- I really like the Ahmad Jamal tracks you linked to. I also finished all of The Awarkening and liked that from start to finish. Might be buying that one. I don't know enough to talk about how his renditions would compare to another jazz pianist's version of those. I can say, to my ear, there's an economy at work and a very nice sense of clarity and balance in his playing. Also a lot of heft to it...even when he's playing a fast run in upper octaves, it has weight and is authoritative even in piano sections. Not sure why that is but do like his style. What was up with the "lack of interest comments"? AJ not considered "orthodox" jazz by some? I enjoyed reading the various quotes. The one from Cannonball Adderly, especially, about AJ always giving the impression he had something in reserve. So much of jazz is new to me. This was a nice intro to AJ...one of those, why was I not told about this sooner moments. THANKS |
Orpheus - YES...Schubert. Sorry about that. Horrible with names. Hope he’s OK. I will go and check out your links. Haven’t yet. I am listening to Ahmad Jamal right now. "The Awakening". He is really good. (no one needs me to tell them that I suppose). Maybe not the best place to start. If you have something earlier to recommend...let me know. I like what I’m hearing very much (only into track 3) but the piano solos don’t seem to be exactly poster children for fewer notes...don’t get me wrong, he’s got the right notes! :-) On "I Love Music" he sure plays a lot of chords (we like chords) but there’s also great melodicism. I don’t know enough to say whether these tracks are "standards" or his own compositions. Assuming they are his, I like his "ear" very much. On "Patterns" now. Thanks for prompting me to listen to him. I’ll get back with comments (for what they’re worth) on your links . Ciao. I like this track (Fred, from TW Lifetime) quite a bit. Much good stuff on those albums, I think. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCaixOPkgaQ |
Ghosthouse, you mean "Schubert" don't you. I believe he was over 80 and now that you mention it, I haven't noticed him in quite a while. From what I could discern, he lived around Minneapolis. I remember, he mentioned that he was not as swift as he used to be, which was not in reference to his physical health, so he might be OK and just quit posting. Tell me, what do you think about the links I posted. AJ changed Miles thinking about his music, Miles began to appreciate space, and the philosophy of less is more. ( somebody on Agon advised me about the speaker I was designing, and told me I needed to drop off one of the drivers, and sure enough, less turned out to be more; the speakers I'm listening to now, have one non functioning driver) I will most certainly check those albums out this evening if they are on "you tube". Yes Miles bragged about TW a lot. Enjoy the music. |
Orpheus - speaking of "lost members", anyone heard from Schumann recently? I realized some weeks ago I'd not seen a post from him in some time. Hope all is well with him. O - your comments about Miles re AJ have roused my curiosity. I know nothing about him...other than have heard the name. More often than not, "less is more" seems better to me too. Have been spending some time with Tony Williams Lifetime - The Collection. Liner notes are interesting. Miles had high praise for TW. The first two albums (Believe It; Million Dollar Legs) by this second iteration of TW Lifetime are covered in "The Collection". This group includes Allan Holdsworth on guitar: Virtuoso without a doubt. Solos made up of incredbly fast, complex runs...but after a while, "YEESH"! I need a break. Alan Pasqua's keyboards provide a nice contrast to all those notes (not that he can't rip it up too). TW and Tony Newton on bass, round out the personnel. |
Well aficionados, apparently we have lost two constant members of our esteemed group who were most knowledgeable on the subject of "Jazz", for reasons unknown; but still, move on we must, and move on we will. Miles said Ahmad influenced him more than any other musician, therefore we will listen to how, and why this is so when we hear Ahmads music. Rather than point out specific tunes, I prefer to compare Miles's music, and Ahmad's in general; they both preferred fewer notes, rather than more, they both used space between the notes, and we know this is the way Ahmad played from the beginning. Most of the music we have been listening to has included horns and a lots of notes; frankly, I have gotten tired of "toot, toot, toot". Ahmad is a welcome change for me. I last touched upon a compilation of the trio, and I'm going to go back to that and pick out my favorite cuts on that compilation, and you can post yours. Here is "New Rumba" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykem8mJ5tio Next is "It Ain't Necessarily So" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4Dwd2jL-mw Enjoy the music. |
Acman, I'm glad you explained that; some of us are retired and we don't have an excuse, other than who knows for what reason, we just didn't want to respond. As you stated, he has gotten a lot better, but we're talking about music, and maybe not "jazz jazz". I have no intentions of trying to explain what I just said. I know this; I love listening to his music, which has evolved, as opposed to changing, and in order to enjoy it, you must listen with nothing else in mind; the more you listen to his current music, the more you will like it. Any audiophile with a good setup will certainly appreciate his current music more than ever, because he pays close attention to recording quality. If I get feedback to continue, I'll pick up where I left off. Enjoy the music. |