Jazz for aficionados
Speaking of George Coleman and Miles. One of my favorite things with Coleman. My favorite rhythm section of all time and which would later be part of my favorite quintet of all time: https://youtu.be/XdrAzpYdOYs |
mary jo, definitely yes to "Straight Life" pryso, I have not read "Beneath The Underdog" so I cannot compare. I am an avid reader. I often read 2 books at the same time and as soon as I'm done with one I read another. I like boxing biographies and musicians as well. For history I read military books with an emphasis on the second World War - first World War - American Civil War - and ancient Rome. |
nsp, I read the Higgins - Evans comparison on Wiki (not the best source): Eddie Higgins's delicate tone and conception were often compared to those of Bill Evans, one of the most influential and successful jazz pianists. He mostly played bop and mainstream jazz music throughout his career. Higgins was at home playing melodies with swing-like feeling. His melodies had groove and swing-feeling without being superfluous. Such swing-feeling of Eddie Higgins was also often compared to those of Oscar Peterson and Nat King Cole. Schubert I know it was a tongue in cheek comment about Stitt/Coleman and so was my reply that's why I put the lol in there. That was a funny analogy you made. |
pjw. My favorite Liz is this , appeals greatly to my Christian beliefs . https://youtu.be/eWZ_ebqr6j0?t=4 |
pjw Not sure where you read the comparison between Eddie Higgins and Bill Evans? I have at least 10 albums by Higgins and really like him but I agree with Frogman that Higgins touch and sound is similar to Evans but his improvisational solos to me are much different. Higgins stays a little closer to the original Melody while Evans usually spins out lyrical lines and stretches out more harmonically. I haven't listened to frogman Evans Higgins Cuts but will do so when I get a chance. I will post some cuts from the Chick Corea Trio album when I get a chance. It's a great chance to see Corea and who knows how long he'll be performing. |
mary jo, if you are bothered by "a thin line between fiction and nonfiction", then I suggest you don't read Mingus' "Beneath the Underdog". That certainly stretched credibility, but I found it highly entertaining none the less. So instead, maybe a bit of his music, an early version of this one - https://video.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=Mingus+music&hspart=att&hsimp=yhs-att_001#id=15&... |
nsp, I will look into getting tickets for the Chick Corea show. I can't believe a giant of the jazz world is playing at a small venue in the suburbs of Long Island an hour east of NYC! I will also check out that 3 disc session you mentioned which I was not aware of. I agree with your assessment of Art Pepper's early playing and later playing. frogman also made the same assessment up thread. Schubert I highly recommend the following 2 disc set since you are obviously a huge Sonny Stitt fan (as am I). https://www.amazon.com/Pepper-Presents-West-Coast-Sessions/dp/B01N2NTGV6/ref=sr_1_1?crid=25NWW6RYLVL... I do think your sandwich remark regarding Coleman was a little harsh lol. Coleman is no Sonny Stitt but, IMHO, is a very good player. frogman, Great Bill Evans - Eddie Higgins comparison. Nice versions of "Laura". |
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nsp, your point is is well taken and it applies to any genre. Not meaning to put too fine on point on the issue it should be pointed out that emotional expression of life experience and technical facility never have to be mutually exclusive. I’m not sure that Pepper’s troubled life experience “took over”. Perhaps it did out of necessity. Playing any musical instrument is a physical act. Because a troubled life, especially one which included life long drug use destroys the body it destroys a musicians’ “chops”. Muscle control and even teeth are lost. The instrumental playing gets very rusty and is the reason that his playing sounded “rough” at the end. The miracle is that a genius like Pepper could still express on that level right to the end; and, of course, he had a lot more to express at the end. Just as with the effects of old age, when you start out at such a high level you can “afford” to lose some of your chops and still get the story told. Thanks for the heads up re the Patchogue concert; sounds awesome! |
That was pretty funny, Schubert. Although, it should be pointed out that some like the spiciest wasabi instead of homemade mayo on that perfect ham sandwich 😊 One of the most recorded tunes of all time, there is a great back story to “Laura”. Renowned film score composer David Raskin was commissioned to write the score for the film with the same name, but the producer wanted to use Ellington’s “Sophisticated Lady” as the film’s theme song. Raskin was not happy about this. The producer gave him a couple of days to come up with a theme that would be better than “Sophisticated Lady”; obviously, a tall order. This coincided with Raskin learning that his wife would be leaving him. According to Raskin the tune “wrote itself”. Some favorite “Laura”s: https://youtu.be/6abYzamJ06g https://youtu.be/fxi707che_Q And, of course, and for our OP, wishing him well: https://youtu.be/mmm9u8dPU4A |
pjw Just wanted to mention that Chick Corea is doing a Piano Trio concert at the Patchogue theater on Main Street on October 25th Friday night. It is his working group with Christian McBride on bass and Brian blade on drums. They recorded a triple CD set in 2014 which I own and is very good. My friend and I have seats in the seventh row dead center. There are still excellent seats available but they're a little pricey 69 to 89 dollars. Thought you might be interested:www.patchoguetheatre.org |
Put it this way , if a guy had an-ex named Laura that he yearned for( we all know that feeling) and said guy heard Sonny’s version he’d be tearing his hair out, pounding his head on a concrete wall an scratching his his eyes out . Same guy heard Coleman he’d say" nice piano" and go make a sandwich . Everything else aside , Stitt has the divine "it " than only a few just "get" . |
pjw I think George Cables was Art's Last piano player if I'm not mistaken. I can attest to the fact that Arts biography straight Life Is For Real so to Mary_jo I recommended reading.. I remember Art saying.. in the bio that as a jazz artist you needed both technical facility and emotional expression. If someone had one or the other but not both it would not make it. I think in his early career or technical facility was more prevalent and after living a life of drama is emotional expression took over and came out through his horn!! |
I like Eddie Higgins very much. Fine player and I can’t disagree with the comparison to Bill Evans.... mostly. Similar touch on the keys as Evans’; although not quite as light and “covered” as Evans’ and more rhythmically “obvious” than Evans. For me, not quite as introspective and lyrical as Evans. Then again, who is (was)? Evans was a rare genius, imo. https://youtu.be/fJBhfa4V6EE https://youtu.be/FTlKzkdtW9I |
frogman, I agree with your observations of Art Pepper’s 70’s early 80’s sessions. Arts playing really moves me in a way no other saxophonist ever had or still does. That rendition of "Laura" is beautiful and really long. I have that Coleman disc live at Ronnie Scotts. I agree with what you said about Miles - Stitt/Coltrane. By the way, Hank Mobley also filled that chair briefly with Miles. What do you think about Eddie Higgens’ piano playing. Many compare his playing to that of Bill Evans which I found interesting. Have you been to see Jimmy Cobb play since he turned 80? (the last 10 years). He is remarkably fully in control of all his faculties and is a pleasure to converse with after the show. Always signs my CD’s. |
pjw, great Art Pepper/George Cables. Thanks. I remember when I heard that great record after it first came out. Like most of his last recordings it was uncomfortable to listen to the raw emotion in Pepper’s playing. The horn playing was rough compared to the beautifully controlled and lithe quality of his earlier recordings, but it was that incredibly raw quality that was almost painful to listen to. The man clearly had a very troubled life and this poured out of his horn. Wonderful record. A couple of thoughts re your comment about Miles and Sonny Stitt: I love Stitt’s playing. He was a fabulous player and the “Laura” that Schubert posted is a great example of what made him great; “melodic perfection”. Although he played and recorded on both tenor and alto, to my ears he was an alto player first and foremost; that was his voice. More importantly (imo), he was a hard core bebopper. In the context of Jazz in 1960 I think it can safely be said that he was a traditionalist. Bebop was his comfort zone. Coltrane was anything but a traditionalist and I don’t think he was too interested in comfort zones. As has been often noted, he was always searching and reaching for something new. As we all know that was what Miles was also all about and it’s easy to understand why he felt the way he did re Stitt after having had Coltrane in his quintet. Between the time that Stitt played with Miles and when Wayne Shorter joined the quintet this tenor player filled the “chair” and I think he can be seen as a great middle ground between the traditional and the new (for the time). A different take on “Laura”: https://youtu.be/Rdz0AjbAV3I |
I can assure you mary jo "Straight Life" is not fiction. It is Art Pepper's life told by Art to Laurie Pepper. There are many other sources used also by people who were involved with Art throughout his life. If you are skeptical of biographies or autobiographies then all I can say is don't read it. I know what you mean but if that is the case how can you read any books other then fiction? Read the reviews on Amazon for a start. |
Those are nice links Peppe & Cables, pjw. As for the "Straighf life", I already had in mind to look for it and to read it although I am not a fan of "based on the true story" books. Being aware of the fact that there is a thin line between fiction and nonfiction, I would constantly ask myself the question: was this truly real or not...? |
Art Pepper's last studio album. A duo with George Cables: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rafXSARZtSw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGib0BAT2I4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFX_hO96ino |
frogman, George Cables is a great pianist no doubt about that. He was Art Pepper's favorite piano player when he made his comeback in the 70's. Speaking of piano players since I started posting on this thread I have never saw a post about Eddie Higgens https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80AkUq_ViY&list=PLk0W9z0R0_TAuxGn5SZNF3_fNBp39I6pV |
Here is a really good Jimmy Cobb interview for Billboard: https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/8527648/miles-davis-kind-of-blue-drummer-jimmy-cobb-shares-m... I have had the pleasure of watching Mr. Cobb play in many of the NYC jazz clubs. 3 different times at Smoke Jazz and Supper Club alone. I know at 90 years old he will still be making the rounds on the NYC jazz scene for the rest of this year and 2020 as well in support of his new album "This I Dig Of You". God bless him and I will be checking on his tour dates. https://jazztimes.com/reviews/albums/jimmy-cobb-this-i-dig-of-you-smoke-sessions/ |
On Green Dolphin Street Stitt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55vzIClGoCQ Coltrane: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CRX9h3gaXM |
Bingo ! Hot off the press . 35min of lost Sonny Stitt off album"Primituvio Soul" !1964) Sounds like African music , great sound and fabulous conga work on firstpiece which is all I have time for right now .https://youtu.be/UnDFjMTLiDM |
Maybe he spoke French .Or his mother did . What makes me laugh is that folks think classical players don’t improv. The SPCO home is the Ordway Hall in down-town St. Paul .Millions were spent on acoustics in what was already a very good hall. Friend told me , 50 years a middle hall guy , you could sit front row center and still get great instrumental separation .Right, right say I , he buys me a ticket and in a 1300 hall seat he was right ! Its very subtle , but in their wheelhouse , Mozart and Haydn, from 10 feet away sometimes looks like that’s all these world class players do ! First time I heard Evans , maybe 20 years ago, you could tell he was classically trained .When I hear so and so never was trained and he's great, I say your are right and think he could have been even greater . |
Remarkably similar touch and attitude. And, he wasn’t French! He was, however, a big admirer of Ravel. Coincidence?: https://youtu.be/Nv2GgV34qIg |
God as my witness frogman . the French National rendition was SO moving that I really and truly could not believe any human could continue playing and not just float up to heaven . Afraid to go to "Classical Minnesota " playlist on that one . Chamayou is French , i think you would have to be to get done to the bones of the masterpiece like he does . Amazon here I come . You see a lot of "secrets of life" stuff from old folks on the internet . Mine is simple , "pay attention " . |
Schubert, very glad you are enjoying the John Wriggle book; fantastic research as you say. And, you are so correct, whether Jazz or Classical the most successful musicians are usually the ones that let their experience and knowledge of one genre inform their performance in the other. To my ears, a great example of letting the music speak for itself without a lot of pointless affectations (“expression!”) getting in the way; something that happens so often with music like this: https://youtu.be/cwL4nSb9am8 |
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Great stuff, all. McNeely’s old boss Phil Woods was himself a great composer/arranger. The art of the great arranger. How to pick and assign just the right notes to each particular instrument based on that instrument’s unique sound and how it will blend (or not) with another. Check this out. Only two horns.... for real! Fools the ear and sounds a lot bigger than that: https://youtu.be/DpC1P34L32o |
Thanks, Frogperson . I’m about 1/2 way through " Blue Rhythm Fantasy(old eyes cutting my speed) .Unreal research, figured out in first chapter was a worked over PhD dissertation (good thing) . Were I running a School of Music anywhere , I would see that all jazz students read this book . Much of what what went on then is still going on now, just in another suit . Wouldn’t hurt the Classical students either , there is a lot of gender blend like Debussy whole -tone scale etc . Re: Language and music , Just listed to one the most moving pieces ever written on FM, "Pavane pour une infante defunte" , can’t ever guess how many times I’ve heard it .Today it was played by French National , froze me in my tracks . Literally .Classical soul at its very best . |
Jim McNeely's a beast of an arranger! 2 favorite records are the one he made with his longtime boss; The Phil Woods Quintet Plays The Music Of Jim McNeely and his own; Jim McNeely Tentet - Group Therapy (You've NEVER heard a version of Silent Night like his, guaranteed!). I know dropping videos is SOP around here but I was surprised to see that there aren't any cuts from these 2 records available. Great music! |
