You may want to check out the Tad-60 - there a few used ones for sale right here that are well within your price range. It is a versataile amp which can also be used as an integrated as well, and there are several gushing reviews for it right here in this forum. I doubt you can do very much better, sonically speaking, at your price point. That being said I have not heard the amp but I did own Paul's Cayin Tad-30 which was a fine integrated and Paul states the Tad -60 is much better. I currently own the Tad 1000 monoblocks which are fabulous and did have them paired with quad 21L's (which I believe are similar sounding to the 22L's) - with excellent results. |
You may want to check out the Tad-60 - there a few used ones for sale right here that are well within your price range. It is a versataile amp which can also be used as an integrated as well, and there are several gushing reviews for it right here in this forum. I doubt you can do very much better, sonically speaking, at your price point. That being said I have not heard the amp but I did own Paul's Cayin Tad-30 which was a fine integrated and Paul states the Tad -60 is much better. I currently own the Tad 1000 monoblocks which are fabulous and did have them paired with quad 21L's (which I believe are similar sounding to the 22L's) - with excellent results. |
Metman,
This will be first dedicated 2-channel system, so I don't know the first thing about biasing or replacing tubes. I read a little of the TAD-60 review & discussion and the technical details seem to be complicated.
How often do you need to do this & how difficult is it? Should I just stick to SS or hybrid components for now? |
I don't know how my reply was posted twice, but anyway, don't be intimidated, biasing the tubes is a piece of cake. It really involves nothing more then hooking up a meter that I believe paul provides and turning a screw until it reads the proper bias, and this only needs to be done on the power tubes, and only needs to be checked very infrequently or when you replace a tube. Talk to Paul at Bizzybee, He's a great guy and will answer any question you may have. if you cannot reach him via phone just email him, he's usually fairly quick to respond.
Ken |
This is actually less than your budget but the Audio Refinement Complete is an absolutely wonderful SS integrated. I've owned amps from NAD, Rotel and, while I think the Rotels are a good value, the Audio Refinement is a big step up from either the NAD or the Rotel. |
just purchased a prima luna dialogue one . tried it with my quad 22l and sounds great. beautiful build lots of power.dont need to know much about tubes ,i dont. check upscale audio website. |
I owned these great speakers.
I second the Cayin T-30 (Paul's TAD-30)for an amazing tube amp, and actually a tube roller's dream with the extended bias option ( kt-88, 6550, el-34, and more).
HOWEVER the Arcam A85 is THE match for the 22L's. They have smart microprocessor-controlled toned controls that actually work. It will get rid of some of the slight box colorations the L22 may have at lower frequencies. a divine match for a great budget system!
Good luck ! |
sonicbeauty,
I am trying to find something used to stay below 1K. I see a few Arcam A80s on audiogon but not A85. Are they similar? I assume tube rolling is swapping out replacement tubes to find the best match & sound you like. Right now its a starter system so I'll keep it simple. For tube amps, I have been suggested Primaluna Prologue One/Two because it is self-biasing. Is it comparable to the TAD-30?
Thanks |
wow, this is too much coincidence, same speakers, same size room, same dilemma. I tried running the 22L's with an Onix SP3 integrated tubeamp and it was a horribly failed experiment. The SP3 gave me super detailed high frequency extension but it was way too bright and fatigueing.
Now if you read the reviews on this unit this generally isn't a quality attributed to this amp. I think that the power provided by tubes is simply insufficient to drive these speakers. They're 89db 6ohm rating is misleading. Look at the recoemended power rating from Quad on this speaker, it's 30 to 300watts : O .
Now I'm not claiming to be an expert on the subject but it seems to me that a tube amp is a poor choice for the 22L's. The dual 6" Kevlar woofers in these speakers are power hogs, and if you really want to energize them fully to reproduce Led Zeppelin Bass then stay away from tubes.
Just to calrify, I'm not knocking tubes, I run a CRT projector in my theatre and feel there is a certain majic to tube based equipment. It just seems that in the last few years they've become so popular that it becomes easy to forget tubes don't fit every application. I would hate to see you go through the same problems I'm having and lose money on an amplifier that doesn't work for yuo.
I don't have enough experience with different kinds of amps to make a recomendation. However I can tell you the direction I'm looking to go is at least 150 watts per channel, dual mono class A/B. Something like a Mcormack DN-A1? |
The Cayin TAD-30 has been discontinued and is no longer being sold by Paul. You may be able to source the Cayin elsewhere but it won't have paul's mods. I would strongly suggest you reconsider the TAD-60 Paul does say it exceeds the Cayin sonically, and again as of yesterday there were some good used ones for sale here in the $800.00 range |
If you are going ss might want to try a Portal Panche used ones have come up at $1K, and from time to time Joe Abrams at Portal Audio sells loaned out to reviewer models (bought mine that way still get full 3year warranty and Joe checks them out before resending them out) for slightly more than what you want to spend - it is a really nice amp - good across the range , but exceptional mids PS I have no relationship to Joe nor selling an amp - just think the panache is a fine amp |
Draganm,
That is really a coincidence. Thanks for the warning on the Onix amp. I had considered it as one of the sub-1K tube amps for the Quad 22L.
I have received an equal number of recommendations for tube & ss amps. Some of them like the Cayin, Pathos Classic etc. are more than $1000 used on Audiogon. I want something which I can use for at least an year before I feel the need to upgrade. Something like the NAD C352 is a safe bet as a cheap but good quality integrated. At the same time, it seems to me that for around $800, I have a few more choices which are sonically in a different class. |
I just found out that Quad has released newer models of their L-series speakers. So its 22L2 now.
A white paper regarding the changes:
http://www.quad-hifi.co.uk/downloads/L2%20Series%20Moving.pdf |
What a great paper on the 22L2 Quads.
By the way, of course the Cayin TA-30 has been discontinued by Paul (thanks to Kevin Deal and his purchasing clout...). I was referring to being a bit patient in finding a used one, and contrary to what was said by someone else here MANY if not most, have the extended bias option.
I heard the TAD-60 only once, but in my opinion - sorry - the TA-30 beats it, and on build quality and looks, the small Cayin still has it in my humble opinion. But the TAD-60 IS a nice amp nevertheless, and IS a good buy.
I was told they sold many more Cayin TA-30's than TAD-60's, yet you often find anywhere from 1 to 3 TAD-60 units available here for sale on the 'Gon. The Cayin TA-30 is a harder find, and usuallly gets sold very quickly - proof is in the pudding. I was just saying that this amp is so good that it's worth the wait. I personnaly now have the Cayin A 88-T. Just as big a bargain, it's a stunner. |
I'm definitely in agreement with you regarding the Cayin TAD-30 being an excellent amp as I still have mine and am reluctant to sell it. Mine only has the focus control, no extended bias and I am currently thinking about sending it back to him to see if he would be willing to to that mod as well as the external bias. I'm currently using Paul's Tad 1000 monoblocks paired with his Tad 150 preamp and won't be looking back anytime soon. |
Srinivos: Did you ever choose something? I'm looking at doing the Outlaw for my bedroom system with Blue Minipods and my 37" LCD connected to my Media Center.. I thought that buy using the USB direction connection I save the cost of my Squeezebox or other device, plus the bass controls are key as I need to use a sub. I've heard those speakers and they sound great.. especially as you pull them out into the room.
With the USB connection you can use Media Player, Itunes, Foobar, etc.. Softsqueeze (frontend client to freeware slimserver)
Curious as to what you decided on? |
That's a coincidence. I just checked this thread after more than a month & there's a new post.
Cytocycle,
I went with the Audio Refinement Complete Integrated based on multiple recommendations. I bought it used on audiogon & it has been a great match so far. I moved it from the hall to a spare room & am experimenting with speaker position right now. How far from the side & back walls do you have your Quads?
I also bought an USB DAC on ebay made by MHDT Labs, a mfr in Taiwan. So I can use the Roku & Oppo DVD player along with a laptop as source components. |
Srinivos: I heard the Quads like 3' off the back wall and almost 1 foot of the side walls in a near field arrangement and it was pretty amazing...the speakers were 2/3 into the room, Rule of thirds is pretty good. with the seating position on the back wall to minimize bass problems. It's a really really different sound.. huge depth with this method.
Nice Setup and the Oppo players are a bargain!
Chris |
I owned these fine speakers for 1 year. The Arcam A-85 integrated was a great match, with its subtle tone controls. Also had the small Cayin amp - great match - but the Arcam was more adequate.
Good luck! |
I have 22L's in 1 of my systems. I have used both Quad 909 amp/99 preamp/99 cd as well as Cayin a-50t. Instead of int. amp. why not Quad 99 amp/preamp? You should be able to get a similar price for the seperates compared to the Cayin. I think the Quad 22L's like the control of the Quad amp over the Cayin unless you are only playing strings or background music. The extra power can't hurt for the bass as well. Either way you should be happy! I am not as familiar with the Arcam products but both Nad & Outlaw pieces have been hooked up with only fair results. They are great value products but the Quad & Cayin's are a very definite step up. |
