@mijostyn , I have owned panels, and set up many. I understand and appreciate their virtues. However, when I say nothing compares to a live concert, it is my opinion, a good horn system comes closest, but still, no cigar. Is it the equipment’s fault ( speakers specifically ) ? I find, as I state over and over again in these threads, that we are limited by the recordings. An example would be when my guitar buddy Mike and microphone Me take a mixer and play through my Lascalas ( or his, which are not modded to the same degree ), and play our music. They handle it all. Most speakers ( commercial home speakers ), ime, fall apart. And try taking them to 110 db and above.......I would bet you could damage them. This is all besides the point. On another thread, I mentioned the fabulous recorded work by Tony Minasian of Tonian Labs. After listening to his recordings, it becomes apparent, again, how limited we all are with our systems, having the ability to sound live ( the recordings ). Growing up around live music, and being introduced to Khorns very early in life, there is no other way my ears / brain can accept anything other than good horns. I want to say, Klipsch is not the be all/end all, but with intelligent mods and updates, they are amazing at their price point ( I am a huge fan of PWK, and had the privilege of meeting him ). It is all good. I am thrilled you found your nirvana, as I believe it is important for all listeners to find " theirs ", as we are all different in what we want. Thank you for a very informative interaction. Be well, always, MrD.
If a " system " cannot do this, I move on........
I have been advocating on here for some time, that horn speakers ( properly designed, tweeked, executed and set up ) are the only speakers that my brain and ears find acceptable, for the enjoyment of music listening. My listening standard has been live, unamplified music, for now over 50 years. I have also stated on many occasions, that as an audiophile ( as well as being a music listener ), that we are hindered by the recordings themselves, minimizing what we actually are hearing. There has been much talk lately about engineers using " auto tune " ( specifically with vocalists ). Adele ( I am a fan ), with her new hit " Easy On Me ", does not use auto tune, and I am thrilled. Besides being a great singer, she sounds " natural ", less processed. Most recordings in the past 20 years, have used this other electronic " equalization " if you will, that we find embedded in out prescious recordings. The strive for perfection, that " audio nirvana ", we all seek, with the purchase of a new speaker, amplifier, cables, etc., gets us only so far. So yes, dynamics and details are very important to me. Tone, coherence and spatiality are also very important. But the reality is, our recordings, by the time we receive / hear them ( whatever format ), have been severly altered from being close to the real thing. Yet, audiophiles continue to spend big bucks on their gear, their rooms ( their systems ), to get to that place of enjoyment. The title of this thread, " If a system cannot do this, I move on ", has a specific meaning. What I listen for, most of all, with every recording I listen to, is an engagenment between me, and the performers. Following the individual rhythms and musical lines, by the artists, is the number one factor I strive to hear. My system allows for this. My question is : how many of you actually listen for this, or even know what I am speaking of. My personal experience listening to so many high priced systems, has been very disappointing in using this criteria. I am not anticipating this thread to develop into a very large or popular one, but I have not participated in Agon for a while, and I just wanted to shine a light on a subject that is crucial to us and our time listening to music, which some of us spend much time doing. Enjoy, and be well. Always, MrD.
Showing 7 responses by mrdecibel
@david_ten , Thank you my friend, and I am very glad you and your family made it through the rough times that came your way ! |
Hey everyone. I appreciate everyone’s comments, positive and negative, as well as my return to Agon, posting. As we all know, anyone on this site, is surely adimant about certain things related to this hobby. I do not judge the preference that folks have ( there was a time I did, when I consulted in helping people build a better system suited to their " tastes " ). Are horns up front and in your face ? Not in my room. They do have a dispersion characteristic that minimises side room bounderay reflections, at least with me and my system. Their dynamics brings out much that is lost due to the recordings ( again the staple of our hobby ), and I appreciate that, especially coming from my live musical background, so shoot me for that. Adele not being talented ? Really ? You might not like her music, but come on people. I also love Sarah Vaughn, Billie Holiday, Barbara Steisand, Krall, Barber, and hundreds of others, so shoot me, again. If someone is using mini monitors, and they feel they are getting the most out of their music listening....I am thrilled for them. The entire point of this hobby, and my post, is getting to that point of enjoying our music, without ever thinking about what is missing from the experience, as so many do, leading to the upgrade bug. On another thread a while back, I had mentioned the recordings by the genius of Tony Minasian of Tonian Labs, stating that if all recordings sounded this way, we would not need to spend a fortune on gear to compensate for what is not there ( the Sheffield mention was a good point of a great recording ). But, I cannot only listen to SOTA recordings, because my listening pallette would be empty of so much enjoyment. I never said Adele’s recording are great....but I do feel her voice and vocal talents are. Are some people not understanding that it is the " talent " of our favorite musicians, that makes this hobby what it is. A band I have loved forever is Jethro Tull. Recordings are poor, but the MUSIC is wonderful, exciting, a joy for me to listen to. I know many people who could not listen to this band on their systems, because technically, the engineering is not up to snuff. That is their loss, imo. There are many posters on this thread that get what I am saying, but a few are still lost, based on my understanding of their words. So again, Enjoy, and be well. Until my next post....Always, MrD. |
@jbhiller , thank you.....And, without being negative, or to pick on you too, my words concerning Tull, verbatim, " Recordings are poor, but the MUSIC is wonderful, exciting, a joy to listen to "...I am not sure why you misunderstood. *** Many of you are reading this thread, thinking it is a horn speaker thread, and if I intended it to be, I would have posted it within the speaker section ( I have done that many times ). I suppose my goal for the thread, was to re-engage with fellow Agoners, to voice my experiences ( likely due to more extending listening due to the pandemic ), of how much I " simply enjoy listening ". Not thinking of a new piece of gear. Not wondering what some other tweak might do to change or enhance the presentations of the performances. Just listening, and enjoying. I want for nothing else. Of course, things can change....but I have felt this way for some time, and many on the Gon, are not at this " place ", based on my readings......That’s it in a nutshell. Again, enjoy and be well ! Always, MrD. |
@au_lait +1 |
I just listened to " Romantic Warrior ", and the playing of these 4 ARTISTS is simply uncanny. NO, they are not in my room, as I know and am aware of, a recording is what I am listening to. 1st, the total lack of any noise, distortion, hiss, hum, at full throttle( music not playing ). Now, the quickness, the agility, the sharp, non compressed, slurred transients, the balanced tonal richness and coherence, the " tightness " of all 4 members playing in sync together.......just wonderful. This recording, in my opinion, is a real test. Enjoy ! |
@mijostyn, some interesting thoughts on the subject, and agree on the musical choices. IME, live performances that are amplified can be exciting, as seeing a favorite band live is awesome, but a smaller venue without amplification is " dabomb ". I have never heard a hifi system approach this sense of realism, and I blame the source ( recordings ), as I have stated many times in my posts. However, I enjoy every recording I listen to, because I listen past the recording quality, and envelop myself with the artists, and the story they are telling. With an audio system, the shape and size of the stage, the musician localization, and the distance between me and the band ( the imaging thing, etc. ), which is all important, becomes 2ndary to me, as I feel, the performance and the playing, is why I am listening. Many systems I have heard, can be very " spatial ", but do not connect me to the musicianship. You mention Chick as being the standout to you, but Stanley, Al and Lenny are all standouts. A great system, imo, allows you to hear them as individuals, and convey the togetherness of them as a whole. Thank you for your participation, and enjoy ! |