A really good 8 ohm speaker could dip down to 6-4 ohms. A good 4 ohm speaker can go down to 2-.2 ohms. If your amp doesn't "double down" when resistance is halved , you're losing music. See what your amp can do , and buy speakers appropriately . Or buy an amp that will handle anything you throw at it and pick up some Maggies. |
A chime in note on cables. If you haven't already broken the bank on speakers and amps, always ALWAYS get rid of the stock power and interconnect cables that may come with your equipment - especially where the analog signal path is concerned. You can get low-end hi-fi (still very decent) for $50-100 which gives you a good bang for the buck.
The nice thing about cables is you can do it gradually over time as you feel the need. I suggest starting with your amp since it's the most power hungry component. Better the signal path with quality interconnects next and then the power cords to the rest of your components. Finally, add a conditioner if you can - even simple ones will do wonders for imaging.
Adding it up, I spent about 10% of my system cost (~$11,000) on cables (60% of that was speaker cable). $100 Transparent Audio power cables (3) and interconnects (1) have done a lot for me. I've tried some more expensive stuff, but found better use for the money in a power conditioner. |
Mr Tennis - I just spoke to Soundlabs and tried to resurrect the Rennaisance - that was exactly what I wanted. They build-to-order, so they considered it, but in the end they didn't go for it. Part of it is because I wanted it for 5 or 6 or maybe 7 at most k. They are working on getting the new PX stuff into all their models, and the PX stuff is expensive and still relatively new, so there would have been design costs just for my one-off. In any case, their cheapest full range speaker is the Millenium-2PX and am not sure of price, but perhaps in the 9 - 11k range. They have a high-freq adjustment, so shouldn't be too hot. If your upper limit is 20k, you might be able to go a model or two up the line from M2PX.
I'm getting 3.6s right now, which is under your price range and I assume your very familiar with them, just to say they have option for tweeter resistor to calm it down a bit if desired. I was shocked when I heard how different 3.6 is to 1.6 fwiw.
And lastly I heard Martin Logan was coming out with another full range, could be wrong, but I heard that, so might be worth waiting for.
You are also in 20.1 range, but I assume you are super-familiar with those as well.
Hey - for real fun get a Tympanni IVa and have them reconditioned. Many say those are still the best Maggies, but I don't know how much of that is nostalgia. But there are many, many pairs still running and people swear by them!
Even crazier, some people are taking 3.6s and adding the woofer sections of a Tympani IVa... That should be awesome!
http://www.esnips.com/doc/13d4a7e4-f6f4-4a28-917d-320e04685ad3/June6-3-07-200 |
What ever happened to Marakanetz, Sugarbrie, Swampwalker, Natalie, and Sean? |
hi inwanw:
i own 1.6s. there have been threads regarding this speaker. i will be brief. room size and spl will determine power requirement. i have a 30 watt amp and a 120 watt amp. i use both and have no problems. leave space between speaker and rear wall. at least 4 feet is advisable. ironically, i am looking to replace my 1.6s because of the tweeter. it's too hot, even with a tube amp.
this thread is relevant to me, as i am shopping for a speaker. i am considering only panel speakers.
they can be pricey, i.e., more than $7000, retail.
it makes no sense to have a budget constrain me from findinga speaker which i prefer over the magnepan. there are so few speakers i like, period.
i would say, out of the totality of current production speakers, i like or would own, no more than about 7.
thus, for me, i have an upper limit of $20,000, which shouldn't be a problem. if i were less fussy, it would be easier to find a speaker under $10,000. i have received several suggestions but invariably they are cone-based speakers, which, in general are annoying after some period of time. |
OK, going to place this in this thread and hope the answers make sense to me.
Wife and I have been looking and listening to speakers. She is trained vocal, teacher wanted her to go pro as a teenager. Her likes are classical and opera. Now mine are rock and Jazz. Same story again I know.
Went out to listen to speakers,she liked/loved the Sonus Faber auditor series, the flute player in one piece was a note late she said and like the placement of instruments from the recording. Ok high price here, I also like because of the rich sound and warmth of the speakers
Next set was the Definitive tech Mythos. These speakers are harsh to me. But the wife loved them for the placement of instruments, a major thing for her.
Martin logan, more transparent and warmer sounding to me. Wife could not find the placement of instrument. Could be room set up here as I gather they do need to be placed correctly.
B&W nicer than the Definitive tech Mythos but still harsh to me.
Maggies, both of us liked but how much amp do you need with these? Thinking of probaly 1.6's so you can help figure amp size.
Any help appricated. |
A'goN people, is there a thread with a longer life than this one? Thanks, whatjd |
I'll largely concur down the line with Xxmalakeixx...and DON'T ignore the used gear market.
Modern electronics - even in the low priced mass produced category - are for the most part simply VERY good. In my 20s, it cost many thousands to achieve what is readily available today for a few hundred dollars.
Your source and your loudspeakers will be largely responsible for 80% plus of the sound that reaches your ears.
Don't waste a lot on fancy cables - but DO spend enough for decent quality - and here again, great used bargains out there. |
Let me have a redo on this, I've just experienced a system that I've owned for 8 years which I thought sounded pretty good but always thought something was missing. I never realized what power cord upgrades, conditioners, interconnects, and speaker cables could do for a system. Oh and not to forget source components, I.E. cd, or tt. I still have the same amps and pre and speakers I've had. I got a new TT and a new cdp which was a major improvement. This wasn't all I also had the pleasure of experiencing power cords and i-connects. I didn't have any idea, I thought a cdp was a cdp and a cable was a cable. If you are looking to get into this hobby and want somewhere to start don't neglect the source components and power cords starting with the source component. Don't spend all your money on speakers as the signal starts at the source or the cord going to the source. It has been an amazing experience for me finally realizing my systems potential and I hope that others don't make the same mistake I made of listing to good amps, pre's, and speakers thru bad sources and cables. I now think that is the most important part of a system. |
*$2000-$3000 speakers.(many great choices in that price)
*$650-$1000 source(CDP,Turntable or PC system with ext.DAC)
*$1000-$1500 amp,preap or integrated amp.
*$200-$500 room acoustics (absorbers, diffusers)
*NO MORE THEN $400-$500 on cables and tweaks.This can wait.
Start with your dream speakers first. Shop used market, better value.
Next amps or integrated. Source and acoustic treatment to fine tune your room and fix potential, existing room problems.
GOOD LUCK
M.S |
GREAT SYSTEM but would put you in the 5 to 6 grand range. B&W804N SPEAKERS, CONRAD JOHNSON PV14L PREAMP, MF2500 CONRAD AMP AND ANY DECENT CD PLAY USED FOR AROUND $800, bi-wire the speakers and use decent cables to connect equip but don't spend alot here. I have close to this only I have the mf2250 and it doesn't completely satisfy the 804's but I have since biamped and added another amp. wish I would've got the mf2500 to begin with. speaker placement is critical and my 804's sound great and have disappeared in the music and the sound stage and realness is great. I wouldn't even think about a tuner. |
Personally, ive found source components and speakers have 90% of the weight in your sound. So that being said i would spend the money there. If its for a 2ch system get a good CDP or SACDP ill never forget the difference i heard after buying my first rega planet. Also speakers respectavely have alot of weight as well. Theres more to it then just features but you really have to audition and test them yourself to get the best fit. sometime people are more happy with the 300 dollar bookshelfs sound then the 10000 dollar floorstanding imports [rare but it happens] so just make sure you dont rule any company out until youve tried them with your test music. that also being said make sure you have a specific selection of music you know well and would be able to tell differences as minor as possible in the recordings. some say make it your top 10 fav tracks but id be careful, if your like me and VERY picky you may kill the joy in those tracks from endless auditions ;) good luck in the hunt.
p.s. be careful not to be bitten by the upgradeitis bug whilst you audition :) |
If your wife finds out. she'll divorce you.That's about right |
Heard the Sjofn Guru system at the RMAF 2007. Pretty good sounding system for $3000. That's the amp,cd player and speakers in the package.
Extremely hard for an individual blend a system that is that balanced and synergistic sounding. It' very difficult to mix and match components as was exemplified in some rooms at the RMAF. |
With 5K you can buy a wonderful amp new.
With 5K you can buy a terrific source used.
With 5K you can buy, with a lot of patient searching, a magnificent speaker, used.
Having the one and only 1 ohm speaker demands the system be built around that. My monos did coincidentally cost 5K, the Source just 1K, and the wires .005K. I only payed 1.5K for the speakers. With my preamp costing 5K too, that would make my speakers just about 9%,
Even at that, it is still the speaker I would build a system around , there being none other that interests me. |
If you get Magnepans then you can spend as low as 10% of your budget on speakers :)... ha ha ha ha ha ha to everyone else...
Just having fun. But its actually somewhat true. If you look through virtual systems Maggies tend to get paired with much much much more expensive gear. Means they are very good value.
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If it were me, I'd buy used to begin with, on Audiogon. And start with a pair of Magnepan 1.6s at less than $1000. Then a matching pair of amp and preamps, the BAT VK-3i preamp and the BAT VK-200 amplifier at about $1000 and $1200 respectively. Then a good cd player, like the Jolida A100 tube player for about $900 new. For a total of around $4100. Later, you could do surround sound by getting another amp for surround speakers. If you want a good subwoofer, I suggest an Era, for the additional few hundred, making it just a little less than $5000.
In any case, have fun.
Sincerely, waltcertain |
Find a pair you love the sound of. Find the price and then you'll know how much to spend. |
I realize now what my future speaker will be. I orginally had my sights set on the Tyler Linbrook Sig Sys. In fact almost bought one used this weekend. BUT as my brother in law pointed out that speaker is 4 ohms, which my new Jdais Defy 7 could drive , but even better is to stay with the 8 ohms as are my current Seas Thor speaker. So I have made my final decision to go with the Tyler Linbrook Super Tower with 4 W18's per cabinet!!!! My orchestral collection will be taken to new even richer fuller sound stage over my current fantastic Thor speakers. I bought the kit for $1800 and honestly have not heard anything to compete with it for any price. Except Tyler's Seas line of course, as both use the smae drivers.
So since I could not sell my Thor's at $1200, I'll try again later this summer when I have some cash to get the Lin Super Towers. Can't wait!!!!!!
You do not have to speand $$$$$$$$ to get first calss sound. Many lines are wayyyyyyyyy over priced.They have to pay ad costs. |
There's a lot of responses already, so I'm sure my opinion here will die, ignored, in the ether... I don't think there's a percentage of a budget that you can copy/paste into making a system. What I can say is what _I'd_ do with $5k.
As little as $500 for used Vandersteen 2Cs or as much as $1,500 for used MartinLogans (SL3 or Aerius i are in that range).
Somewhere under $1,000 for a used amp.
Somewhere under $500 for used source components.
Throw in some interconnects.
Buy a used dirt bike. Probably a KDX-220.
The main idea is that I don't think you can build a permanent system in one fell swoop. You need speakers that speak to you personally. You're going to be staring at these things for years (probably) and that alone can fill your mind with doubts that'll affect your opinion of their sound. (Not that it's right, but it happens.)
Listen around, read, take your time and find the right speakers. Then you can find the right amp for them (I'm sure most of us can tell you the joys of the right speakers and the wrong amp... IT SUCKS!). However you do it, I'm sure you won't be anywhere near the $5k proposed... either 2/3s of it or 3 times it. =] |
That is a difficult question that has many variables. Price is only one. You have room acoustics, tubes or solid state, type of music, etc. I have found that system matching is manditory if you want the best possible sound. If you unbalance your system with one component then your overall coherancy is thrown off and is disjointed. This won't be glaringly apparent, it will just be a feeling that things just don't mesh. When this happens, you start listening to the sound rather than the music. This is my great judging factor in audio. Is it musical? |
I am in general agreement with Shadorne but there are some special cases. One that I am familiar with is Maggies, where a pair of MG1.6, for example, fit well with electronics costing four or five times as much (and that is not including vinyl playback which would run it up to at least ten times).
. |
I'm with Uraniumcommitte's 1/2 to 2/3 of total component spend, as a rough rule of thumb for speakers/sub (excluding room treatments and very small rooms). Distortion figures for speakers often make them the weakest link in the chain. |
No more than $1000.... DCM TFE200's! |
I spent $1600 on speakers (Paradigm Studio 60 v.3) , $500 on an integrated amp (Marantz PM7200) and $1000 on my SACD player (also Marantz-SA8260). Three hundred or so on cables and it worked out well for me. The amp is great for the price , but has been discontinued (as well as the SACD). They show up used here and fleabay. I don't know if you can set a "percentage" value with this question. Audition as many combos as you can with a total cost under your budget and pick the one you like best! |
Use the same formula that DeBeers uses (but wait, there's more than one!):
http://minuk.vox.com/library/posts/tags/debeers/
http://www.dashes.com/anil/2006/12/01/blood_diamonds |
I would spend 1/2 to 2/3 on speakers. It deepnds on what speakers you like, after all. Some speakers may take a lot more power to drive them, and so you may have to buy a used high-power amp to start with. |
having been some time since I added to this thread and some things have changed for me including my perspectives, I'll add this bit of experience and begin by echoing "Sonicbeauty"... RUN, DO NOT WALK! Away from this hobby. the balance of his statements may well serve you too.
Stick around if you really want to wind up with something quite superior in sonic performance though.
How easily satisfied you are or are not, will directly reflect upon both your wallet, and stress levels.
I'm still in the "it's What's up front that counts" camp. Solidly... because it works.
one decision in speakerage needs be made right off, apart from the amount of duckets being cast at them... "Which way shall I go to find my sonic paradise?"
Low power, or high power? Megga watts or just a handful? either works. Each has it's own character. Both can be done with the same speakers, IF more than "sound" is considered when buying them.
Erring here can cost later. substantially so, if you later decide to go the SET route, after first deciding Monster watts rule so eff ratings aren't important.
In the 'real' world you gotta consider upgrades. Speakers if floor standers, are usually large and certainly heavy. Tougher to ship for sure than componenets. Being out in the unprotected openess of a listening area, they get 'touched' more. See more the effects of day to day living.
Big, heavy, bulky, costly to pack and ship. speakers don't flow in and out of my house for that express reason. I have three sets though. one set will be moving on soon too, as i have decided to follow a different path in amplification, and never ever did I give the slightest thought I would go that direction. never entered my mind..
things change.
Being considerate of more than sound at point of purchase is very important, more so with greater expenditure. Efficiency, impedance curves, range, and flexibility, not just color and size have to be thought well of here and now... not just the sound.
Ratios? I've roughly $25K RETAIL IN FRONT OF $4K speakers... the next set of speakers will likely be in the $4 - $8k range.... so waht's that speaker to system ratio? 25% or so on speakers?
One doesn't need super high dollar speakers to have a super high end sound. Good speakers will sound far better with a better signal runing through them. that is a fact. In fact, every very good to great sounding system has easily had 3-4 times the value of the speaker in it's electronics.
There's lots of solutions here in this thread. Some quite good advice too. so go which ever way you are capable of now. Regarless. I started my re-entry this time around with exactly what was said above. A mass fi source, receiver, a sub, and a pair of speakers. All that remains of it are the Receiver and sub. the source died and the speakers moved on.
Think outside of your plans if you feel power is the answer. it's not. think efficiency and impedance curves as well as esthetics and sound, and you will be far better served for far longer.... but it ain't the end all be all... cause if you do stick around and are not the easily contended type, the first set of speakers will be just a memory soon enough anyhow. Just like the other 'first entrants' in the high end derby, because as was said, "...just begining..." was the thrust, and not "What's my last speaker?"
Spend wisely and comfortably. Listen to the ones you like on far better electronics than are being bought at the same time if possible, and if a spouse is involved, have her pick the color and perhaps price of this first set. it will be maybe your turn next go 'round to do likewise... cause there will likely be a 'next time'. maybe a few next times.
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What in your opinion are the best bookshelf speakers for classical music Fred -- that's a difficult question to answer. The BBC type speakers maybe? Or monitor types like the ATC (great midrange driver!). Maybe a Sonus Faber... There was only one small B&W I liked called something or other "silver" (which doesn't help much, sorry). Goebel is worth suffering for:) BTW, a have a few Koln cd's (more on vinyl) -- but they're not that bed sounding (true, a bit shrill). Cheers |
Thanks for correcting my English Gregm. Your absolutely correct, I buy the music and musicians. This is why I just purchased a Taddeo Digital Antidote so I can stand to listen to Reinhard Goebel and the Musical Antiqua Koln on the Archiv label at a decent volume without the violins hurting my ears. This is coming through a Rega Jupiter CD player analog outputs to a Magnum Dynalab MD-308 integrated amp. I am using Jamo D-830 speakers, which I have currently for sale in the classifieds. Am looking to upgrade to a pair of B&W's. What in your opinion are the best bookshelf speakers for classical music? |
If the music was properly recorded (than) then it is going to sound good when it is reproduced despite your equipment IF the music was well recorded. But usually one buys the music and the musicians playing the music -- not recordings. |
I have spent thousands since 1979 on speakers, i.e., Bose 601's floorstanding, Fried floorstanding, three other pairs up until 2001, Jamo D830 currently on stands; all in the search for what best reproduces classical period and modern instrument CD's. Am now trying to sell my Jamo's so I can buy a pair of B&W CM1's coupled with a Sunfire subwoofer as my listening room is less than 250 sq. ft. Associated equipment: Magnum Dynalab MD-308 integrated amp; Magnum Dynalab FT-11 Tuner; Rega Jupiter CD player; all connected with Kimber Kables. I probably spent more on my LP collection which I sold in 1990 than speakers. Since than I have spent at least $4000 on classical CD's. It is the source of your music and not the equipment that really makes a difference! Every professional musician I have talked with has confirmed this opinion, these include musicians from both the St. Louis Symphony Orchestra, the Cleveland Symphony Orchestra and Chicago Symphony Orchestra. I am not saying you should not try to find those speakers you like, I am saying make sure you spent a good percentage on your source material as well. If the music was properly recorded than it is going to sound good when it is reproduced despite your equipment. Good luck finding those speakers - I'm afraid it is a process more than a percentage! |
A couple of speakers you can get on the used market, like here on Audiogon, that I have in two of my three two channel systems are: 1) Platinum Audio Solos (under 1 grand now) - they are small but have tremendous bass, image well, and have very good clarity. they are power hungry as they have low sensitivity but this is a kicking speaker via my Coda 250 wpc amplifier and parasound budget pre-amp (for a couple of hundred bucks the parasound pre-amp sounds much, much better than it has any right to), 2) Spica angelus (there is not much bottom end so you will need a subwoofer but voices are stunning in their clarity and imaging is excellent, 3) Triangle speakers - I have some on my two home theatre set-up and like both pairs a lot. A buddy has them on his main steroe set-up and raves about them. I have listened to them via my two channel systems and they are very good and don't cost a bunch on the used markets.
Good luck. |
I use the SpeakerSpender Dart Board to determine how much to spend on speakers. So far it has never been wrong. |
Hello,
I will only respond to the first part of your paragraph, when you say...'' I am just starting out in this HI-FI stuff ''
Here is my answer: RUN, RUN WHILE YOU STILL CAN AND DON'T LOOK BACK !!!!
If you INSIST on spending 5K, here's a suggestion: ALL prices are ''AUDIOGON'' prices. Shop wisely and get mint for the price of rust.
AMP: 1K(or less)on a Naim Nait 5i integrated : INCREDIBLE for the money. All you need and more for this kind of budget.
Alternative choice: Arcam A 85. Nothing wrong with it - more power, more flexibility, and true usable tone controls.
Speakers: Polk LSi 15. (less than 1K) These are the most underated speakers on the planet. Forget about the Polk name not being ''audiophike enough''. Read up on them here (Audiogon) and on the web where there are many glowing reviews. I owned them once. Regret selling them too. ( And I once owned obscenely expense speakers in the past). Great overall performers, with refined sound in part due to the Ring Radiator tweeter used on some designs costing $$$$. Huge sound, extremely dynamic and lively. all you need, really.
Alternative choice: QUAD 22L. Much more body than a diminutive bookshelf, credible lows, and fit'N'finish worthy of 3 times the price gear. Good looking too.
CD Player: Shanling CDT-100 cd player. (around $ 1,000) Worth it's selling price on just sound. But of course there'es way more to this player as many of us know. Choice of tubed or solid state output, upsampling on the fly, headphone jack - and of course - a breathtaking visual centerpiece of your system - bathed in blue lights in a dimmed room.
Alternative digital choice: A good ( and less sexy )alternative would be the Denon 3910 universal player. Great sound, with killer DVD player thrown in for free.
Cables, (speaker and interconnects): Anti-cables by Paul Speltz: Very nice for the money. You could spend a lot more and get less. You probably cannot spend less and get more. No fuss, no big names, just great sound. Around $ 300.00 will get you speaker cables and two sets of interconnects.
So here it is
Naim 5i or Arcam A 85 = 900.00
Polks LSi 15 or Quad 22L = 900.00
Shanling T 100 or Denon 3910 = 1,100 (Shanling)
Cables from Paul = 300.00
If you shop wisely, you can get this nice (and it WILL be nice) system for less than $ 3,500
With the rest of the money, get $ 200 dollars woth of cd's (just to '' start the ball rolling'' with your system, and treat your significant other to a great evening out !
Your'e still $ 1,000.00 ahead...of your initial 5K. I doubt you can get better performance unless you spend quite a bit more. Then, maybe you will come to the conclusion that it is all you really need. Then forget about hi-fi and enjoy the music for awhile.
Hope you found this of some help! |
With so many great sounding budget electronics and source components these days, I don't think the old "garbage in, garbage out" argument holds up as stongly as before. You have Naim, Arcam, NAD, DK, Musical Fidelity, etc making great sounding budget amps and cd players that take you 80-90 percent of the way there where the big equipment take you. I don't think the same can be said for a budget speakers compared to a high quality full range speaker, the budget speaker just won't have the range or ability to move enough air fast enough or efficiently enough to create a cohesive and convincing full range sound. My opinion is that the shortcoming of a budget speaker and the cohesive sound quality of well made full range speaker is easier to hear and is a big factor in the enjoyment of listening to reproduced music. |
The speakers are a choice that is left up to a persons own ear For that matter, so are all other components. I'd add the "eye" as well as the ear. In practical terms, however, the above statement indicates absolute precedence to the speakers: speakers are the ones coverting an electrical signal (that we do NOT hear) into sound pressure (that we DO hear). I agree with this take on the statement above (even though it doesn't seem like the intended one:)). In ABSOLUTE terms, you choose a speaker and then work upchain accordingly. In real life's relative terms, things aren't so simple: pbs such as, i.e. "how do you drive said spkr" come to mind. Maybe a spkr+amp combo is the way to go! I for one would strongly urge in that direction. |
I'll chime in on the "garbage in, garbage out" side of things. Proportionally too little money on the source(s) and even amplification can lead to a kind of dead or ill-defined sound, even through the best of speakers- there's a kind of "musical integrity" lacking, is the best expressionistic means of putting it. I'd generally go roughly one-third for each stage in the chain, more for sources if you have a turntable and cd player- and I'd spend more on whichever source is more often used. No more than 10-15% on i-c's and spkr cables, perhaps more if power cords are also used. |
In building a system. First you buy Speakers that asthetically and acoustically work well with your particular Listening Room. Then you buy an Amplifier well suited to effectively power those Speakers. Lastly you buy the best sounding source component that you can afford. Add-in some good inexpensive Cables, and your done. As far as what percentage to spend on a particular component is concerned, it doesn't matter, there is no formula, it's impossible to calculate, there are far too many variables. The Speakers are the only Component that need to fit a physical and acoustic criteria set by the listening room. There are no physical restrictions on the other components, so this is where I would start, and let the costs/budget play-out from there. |
The speakers are a choice that is left up to a persons own ear!
After listening to 10,000 dollar speakers vs.1,000 speakers the pearson might like the sound of the less expensiveitem.
It's all in the ear of the beholder,not the pocketbook. |
Interesting quote from Ashley James of AVI Hifi (UK), not seen posted on here...
"If we score on a scale of 0-10 the difference in sound made by various components of a Hi Fi system, cables would score 0.1, electronics 10 and speakers a 100!"
Having faith in Ashley, I have to say.. he's probably right. |
I think you should budget as much as you can to get into the speakers you really want. Electronics are easier to buy/sell.
A good set of speakers will reveal every improvement you make up-stream too.
You can get some GREAT deals on A-gon for some killer used speakers! :) |
With all due respect, my speakers only cost 20% of the total price of my system (including only CD as a source -- not including turntable). For some reason, for the 25 years I have been an audio junkie, speakers have always been the "sexy" components. Unfortunately, It took me many years and many thousands of dollars to realize that past a certain price point, source and electronics by far have the greatest impact on listening experience.
If a friend of mine had $5,000 to spend on a system, I would recommend that he spend a grand on good used speakers, a grand on a good used CD player and 3 grand on used electronics. (Unfortunately, there is a lot of over priced crap on the market in the electronics department.)
Five grand should get a person a very musical system. |
I think first instead of how much you want to spend on speakers, but rather what type of speaker you want and what type of sound you are looking for. Depending on your choice might change how much you put into your speakers. If you do not know what type of sound or presentation you are looking for then you should go to a local store that will let you bring in your own music and let you listen to various speaker types. |
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Buy your dream speakers first and build everything else around them. Speakers are the least likely to improve in technology over time, heaviest and hardest items to sell and ship, lowest on investment return during sale, however, provides the greatest pleasure of all of the items in your system. I have lost count how many amplifiers I've bought and sold, and the same goes for front end equipment, because it's hard to keep up with the technology. I still have the same Klipschorns that I bought back in the mid 70s, and I still have the LaScalas that I added since then. The Khorns have hardly changed in 50 years and in my opinion are still the best speakers ever made. By the way, back then the new Khorns cost $2000, and the new LaScalas cost around $1000. |
I am of the front end school. But for what it is worth here are my suggestions.
1)buy good used gear on audiogon.
2)Buy the speakers last. Buy good compact 2-way monitors e.g. pro-ac tablette, totem model 1 signature, etc.
3)Buy a good amplifer, preferably 100-150 watts. (musical fidelity, quad 909, ayre v3x, bat vk200, etc.
4) pre-amp is more important than many think. Buy something simple. (pass x2, musical fidelity, etc.)
5)Digital source: something competent (one box player) e.g.
Creek cd50 classic.
6) cables: sensible well made stuff: cardas neutral reference, Goertz alpha-core sapphire for interconnect. non-bi-wire speaker calbles (cardas, supra, etc.)
You should wind up with a very musical and enjoyable system.
The upgrades will be genetically inevitable. Often the first or earliest systems are played in rooms with modest dimensions and small monitors are suitable. Transport costs are less and resale is easier.
Good luck with your decisions!
Appassionata |
Your speakers are only going to sound as good as the room will allow! If you spent $200k on your room and acoustics... then you are allowed $40k on your speakers.
Regards,
Bruce |
I used to be in the "spend the most on the speakers camp" however, as of today, and but for my interconnects and speaker wire, my speakers are the least expensive item in a 23K rig..(msrp of course), the breakdown as follows:
Speakers: Devore Fidelity Gibbon Super 8s ($4K)
Front End: Naim CDX2 w/ XPSII and damping by Symposium ($11K)
Electronics: Edge G3 ($5.3K)
Cables all Acoustic Zen: ($2.5K)
By far the most enjoyable system I have owned. But, I will say that I am going to move to a larger more full speaker, most likely the DeVore Silverbacks....then I guess I have to retract this posting.
John |
Opticaltee,
Hmmmm... you must be as old as me :)
I remember the 50% rule from way back in the Stereo Review Days!!
The problem with this guidance is that one might find a 4K speaker that meets sonic needs, space considerations, WAF etc. It may not be nonsense to pair them with a 3K amp 2K pre and 3k front end.... you get my point.
I like to advise beginners to spend as much as they can to get speakers they like and build from there.
But then I don't bore easily! |
