Honest question about cartridge vs. turntable performance.

Guys (or gals) the original question posed was not belt versus direct. One technology is not better than the other. It depends on the table. Some manufacturers make both types. OP is talking about going from a good basic turntable to something better or upgrading a cartridge. 

From my experience, the arm is most important (but I don't have experience as Mike Lavigne from bottom to very top of the market). It must be matched to the table. However, you want to look at resale value down the road. As someone who faced this type of decision, it is hard to sell a tonearm standalone and people like to buy known quantities. Years ago I had an MMF 5.1 and wanted an improvement. I was about to buy an arm, but was able to get a new table with the same arm for almost the same price (Rega, known fro their arm's high value). If I sold the MMF with a better arm, it would not have added the same resale value as the new table. All you Rega haters just please relax (especially Chakster). When I upgraded the Rega it was easy to sell in pieces because I upgraded the arm first (huge improvement) and then matched it to a table that cost about 80% more than the arm upgrade (minor improvement). I think up to $5K or so, get a table with an arm to match. So a table upgrade (with arm included) will yield better results than a cartridge.Then you can look at more complicated decisions.

Cartridge, as Mike Lavigne said is disposable. I wouldn't spend more than $1K, but that is me. Second most important is phono stage, which is not spoken about much, as one of the 4 main components. Not talking about Linn that breaks it down into a million pieces.

So, I guess cartridge is 4th, assuming your table is at the right speed with minimal rumble (sometimes a bd assumption). Also, you need to look at your budget. The question is how do I get the best improvement in SQ for my buck from a given investment. That is critical, otherwise you can go down a rabbit hole of upgraditis since there is ALWAYS something better of everything. Figure out your budget and go from there. Significant improvements cost significant dollars and the more you spend the more you have to spend to get noticeable improvement.

For a grand or two, I'd get a new table/arm. Then a new phono stage. Then cartridge to match the phono stage, assuming you are happy with your speakers and cables (oh no....you're going down the hole....)

What matters is the table/arm/cartridge interface. If they don't "have chemistry", it doesn't matter how much you spend on one over the other.

I remember buying a Grado at the upper end of their offerings and installing it in my Sumiko MMT arm on my VPI HW table. There was nothing that I could do to keep it from literally bouncing across the record.

I brought it back to the store owner, who then chewed out the salesperson for not knowing about the "Grado Bounce", something that happens when you put one in an MMT arm and every salesperson is supposed to know about.

Dear OP,

As I believe your question was about acquiring a nice/substantial upgrade in your vinyl set-up. If I may presume you are reasonably happy with your MMF 5.1. My best guess is that you will absolutely make a very fine upgrade with a new (and hopefully better) cartridge. Changing your turntable while holding on to the Ortofon Black would just be a sidestep. I do not think you will gain much.
I am not familiar with your particular player. But I was triggered by some denigrating remarks considering your Music Hall and the whole breed of belt driven turntables. I really think this is complete and utter foolishness. To put it mildly. And a sure sign serious audiophiles can be anally retentive snobs. 
So, back to the original question, when happy with the player, what cart? There are quite a few possibilities, but there are some restrictions as well. I have no idea if your preamp can accommodate LOMC's. You have got to take the Project 9 arm in account (11gr, medium to lightish, total mass). And your budget. Wold you like to try a MM/MI cart? Or would a HOMC do? Is shopping in the 'vintage corner' not too daunting? Mind you, people who appreciate such fine differences will verbally go to war for their weapon of choice. I am familiar with old LOMC's as the Denon 301 or Supex 900. And I have given the HOMC's ( Denon 160, Dyna 10x4/2 a fair share of black circles. But all in different tonearms. And they were vintage, but I sure wouldn't mind mounting the in a Pro-Ject 9 arm.  So, I am sure there are quite a few very knowledgeable folk around for some more modern choices. I am looking forward to your solutions!

Kind regards, StefV

It isn't an either or situation.

Mind exercise:

A cartridge can put out X - X= 100%  That's if it were held perfectly in the air with no external vibrations affecting it.

Attach it to an arm on a turntable with interconnects to a phono preamp etc. and depending on the capabilities of each, they will subtract a varying amount from the 100% that the cartridge is theoretically capable of producing.

Is a great cartridge on a so-so table better than a more modest cartridge on a great turntable? I don't know for sure and I'm not sure anyone else does either, but if you start with a good cartridge and then use and upgrade the rest of the gear along the way, at least you will be able to hear what each change does.

Nothing further down the chain can remedy a weakness in a component up near the top of the chain. It can just allow you to lose less of what came out of the record/cartridge interface in the first place.

You guys are right; I apologize for my part in digressing from the real topic of the thread. To the OP, I would say that my experience over the last 10-12 years, with running up to 5 turntables using 5 different tonearms with dozens of different cartridges is that you should consider the cartridge and tonearm as a unit, a closed system.  The SQ from any given cartridge, no matter how expensive or how cheap, and no matter how it transduces physical motion to an electrical signal (MM, MI, or MC), is highly dependent upon the tonearm/headshell into which it is mounted.  Mating cartridges to tonearms for optimum results has in my experience been a hit or miss affair (after one has done the homework to make at least a good mating), in terms of max results, but you can get "good" results by thoughtful matching done on an empirical basis.  After that, turntables each have their own character which seems to remain fairly constant regardless of the tonearm/cartridge mounted on a given one. Also, to a large degree, where a tonearm has exchangeable headshells, you can manipulate the result by experimenting with various headshells.  So, I never think of the relative importance of a cartridge and a turntable per se.