Holo Audio May DAC

brge2,
I have limited experience with other DACs in my system. I had the Denafrips Terminator for a long weekend last summer (2020) and I thought it was good but not great. I like the MAY considerably more. I have listened extensively to the dCS Bartok and the TotalDAC in a friend's system and there is a chance we will be comparing the MAY to one or both of these highly regarded DACs. 

cudfoo5,
No, the MAY will not get much better with break-in. If you don't like it now, you are unlikely to like it in the future. However, your description of "bass is bloated" and "image is diffuse" is the polar opposite of my experience with the MAY. There must be something wrong with your particular MAY DAC or something else in 

Just got the May DAC. 15 days after order - must be a record! Make the mistake of listening right out of the box (after an hour or so). Sound is just ok. Not in the same league as PSA DSD. Bass is bloated. Image is diffuse. Has trouble locking onto different sample rates. Using USB maybe that’s part of the issue. Had been using I2S with Matrix/Uptone PS w/Aurender streamer. Thought I’d start with USB as I’ve heard so many positive comments (not much of a fan of USB usually) Thinking... hoping it’s got to get much better with break - in. We’ll see...

@cleopatra52 , thank you very much. I must say that you seemed to have been lucky avoiding the duties - good for you: they should have been ~15% of the cost of the MAY KTE (which is $USD 5000 from I understand). It is good to have a break once in a while :) ...

Do you have past experiences with other DACs (including may be the La Voce S3) and if so, which aspects of the KTE DAC makes it a superior DAC compared to the others you have owned?

not all of the filters are better than pure NOS

@nquery did you tried the EC modulators as well? do you still like the pure NOS over EC mods with HQPlayer?
I ask because per your post I noticed you are using PCM not SDMI'm just curious that's all

brge1
I'm in Canada and I ordered my MAY KTE in the last week of May. I received the DAC in about 3 weeks, half the time predicted by Kitsune. I think shipping came to about $280 US and DHL  brokerage fee were less than $50 CDN. So far, I have not been charged duties or taxes but, of course, that could change. 

The MAY is an amazing DAC!

This KTE MAY DAC has really caught my eyes.

I would have 3 questions for the people on this forum:
1) [ Canadian citizen only]: Has any Canadian citizen ordered a MAY DAC, and how much did you end-up spending for shipping, duties, broker fees, and any other fees on top of the DAC itself?
2) Has any of you owners or ex-owners of PS Audio DSD Sr. had the chance to compare the KTE MAY DAC against the DSD Sr. + Edcor XS4400 mod?
3) Has any owners of the KTE MAY DAC had the chance to compare it against the Aqua La Voce S3 DAC, and if so, how would summarize the difference in sound quality (bass, mid, highs, image) ?

Not 100% sure on this but it looks like my May DAC will be here next Monday. Less than 3 weeks from purchase date, Received this from DHL. Can anyone confirm this is the DAC? 

StatusProcessed at HONG KONG - HONG KONG SAR, CHINA: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 9:27 PMShipperPARCEL FROM HKShipper addressROOM 709 7/F LINGNANDUHUI HUAYING R OAD NO 18 JIA HE WANG GAN VILLAGE IF RTO PLS RTN TO HKG FOR SHPR INST OAD NO 18 JIA HE WANG GAN VILLAGE TSING YI nonePick up23 Jun 2021Estimated delivery28 Jun 2021 by End of DayPieces1
 
I have no other items I've purchased from China recently...

Thanks

@jcarcopo I go back and forth with HQPlayer - not all of the filters are better than pure NOS. I am really loving the recently added sinc-mx with LSN15 upsampled to 768hz pcm. I also have a $140 intel pc stick arriving this week that I will use as an endpoint so I can try 1.536khz. Really trying to see how much I can wring out of this dac.

@nquery I have the Pass Labs XA25 which is single ended aswell, but honestly, it's sounds beyond superb to me. No chip dac I've heard has what the May has. Also, I ditched HQplayer, as it didn't do anything for me, personally, but that's just me.  At the moment I control the volume with Roon and derive just as much pleasure, naturalness, uncanny realism, and all the micro/macro detail I've ever heard in 25 years. 

Now my new Legacy Whisper XDS speakers are arriving in late July and they come with the newly upgraded Wavelet 2 ( It's bespoke premium preamp, 4 way dsp active crossover, it handles room/speaker correction, and has a built-in DAC (which I'll only be using via its USB input for "Tribe Virtual DJ", an Oculus VR app that I'm addicted to 😁, which should suffice for EDM genre music I mix), the May will be going balanced into the Wavelet 2, but then back to single-ended to the XA25. I never thought I'd be a Bluegrass fanatic, but the way the May handles acoustic instruments is nothing short of amazing and has me listening anything acoustic. 

Good luck with your changes and I hope you gain an improvement. 

@nquery... I too am using the MAY single ended.  Do report back on your experience with the Bal-SE solution differences I am very interested.

I should provide an update after another 10 days of testing the May alongside my Lampizator Amber 3. In straight head-to-head comparisons there are pros and cons to each. But where the May has shined for me is with HQPlayer upsampling and digital volume control. It’s extremely low noise floor certainly allows for a lot more flexibility and tuning in this regard and obviates my desire for a better analog volume control/pre-amp in between DAC and amp. But the Lampizator is absolutely no slouch at all and I would still like to hear the new Baltic 3.

One other factor is that my amp is single ended and after some reading and talking to others about the Holo architecture and such, I am convinced that I am not getting the most out of the Holo May. The May actually only uses the output of one side of the R2R ladder for RCA outs, and Jeff Zhu even says the balanced outputs sound better. To this end, I have ordered a quality balanced to SE transformer, the Black Box from AmpsandSound. It is basically designed for this exact problem with many current DACs and the recently updated version Justin is sending me has an additional stepped attenuator to dial in the excess gain. Will update with my observations once it’s in the chain this week.

@dvdboulet

So with that in mind... is there an affordable preamp or "analog volume attenuator" that is affordable? It would seem that in its most pure sense all I’m really after is a way to attenuate the sound without degrading the quality (i.e. what’s basically happening with the volume control of the wavelight)... any such device? Or is an audiophile stuck having to buy a $$ preamp to basically serve that purpose? Any input appreciated :)

If that’s all you want then why not just use the digital volume control in Roon or HQPlayer?? That’s what I have successfully done while testing the May into the pre-in of my Line Magnetic amp. It has provided an incremental gain in SQ over the somewhat basic/mediocre pot volume attenuator in my integrated. The May's extremely low noise floor combined with 64 bit volume control provides for tons of headroom.

i have the wavelight and the may kte.

the may kte is an excellent dac, but I am preferring the wavelight by a small margin. and yes, the wavelight preamp is very very good.

I'm still months away from a new DAC, and now the May has moved into my sights which were previously fixed on the Wavelight. In my system I have no preamp (just feed my current dac with volume control direct to my Hegel amp) so one thing that attracted me to the Wavelight, besides the organic/analog sound-quality accolades, was the fully analog volume control that was also well-praised. If it had the May I'd need to get a preamp (and another set of XLR cables).

So with that in mind... is there an affordable preamp or "analog volume attenuator" that is affordable? It would seem that in its most pure sense all I'm really after is a way to attenuate the sound without degrading the quality (i.e. what's basically happening with the volume control of the wavelight)... any such device? Or is an audiophile stuck having to buy a $$ preamp to basically serve that purpose? Any input appreciated :)

That video on the Holo May was great. The best example of objective and subjective evaluation I've seen. It's was troubling to see on his part 2 video that he mentions that the Denafrips Ares II does not do real NOS but "linear interpolation" instead (if I remember it correctly). Makes me wonder if all of Denafrips line up do that instead of actual NOS. 

All the best,
Nonoise

great - thanks for the info

I sold my DSD a few weeks back for $3k and it sold in just a few hours.

Thanks all. Looking forward to receiving the unit. Any idea what the used market is looking like for the DSD. You think 3k is possible at this point? Mine is 3yrs old perfect condition. If I could get the May with 2- 2500 out of pocket that would be great. thx again...

May absolutely trounced the Direct Stream in almost every way. Frankly I was shocked at the magnitude of the change. I initially purchased the May just to check it out knowing the demand was high I could easily sell after re-affirming the Direct Stream... but the May trumped the DS.

That is the difference when converting PCM recordings 16/44, 24/96 or DXD via R2R Mulitibit conversion vs Delta Sigma conversion.
R2R will convert it "bit perfect" where Delta Sigma can only give a "facsimile" of it.

Great video BTW  https://youtu.be/Wa3sOSRa-U0

Cheers George

Here is a link to a very thoughtful (and glowing) YouTube review of the KTE MAY DAC.  Very informative as well.
https://youtu.be/Wa3sOSRa-U0

I too went from the PS Audio Direct Stream to the Holo May KTE.  I kept both in my system for a few weeks and in my particular system the May absolutely trounced the Direct Stream in almost every way.  Frankly I was shocked at the magnitude of the change.  I initially purchased the May just to check it out knowing the demand was high I could easily sell after re-affirming the Direct Stream... but the Day trumped the DS. 

And welcome to the club 🙂

I am not good at audiophile descriptions. It just sounds like what I hear at classical music concerts, and compared to the DS: bigger soundstage, more air, more acoustics of the recording space, more precise/less boomy bass, amazing cristalline clarity overall. 

Hi,

Just ordered the May a few days ago. Also been using PS DSD with Sunlight. Could you provide some detail on the differences between the 2 DACs?

@nquery  Very nice write up on the comparison!  Thanks.  I am enjoying this.
Peter

A few days later and what I have done is create an A/B setup with Roon playing to two endpoints as a grouping, one going to the May and one going to the Lampizator. Each of which is connected to different inputs on my Line Magnetic 805ia SET amp. Same PEQ (but no upsampling!) is applied to both endpoints in Roon with the headroom adjusted slightly differently to level match the volume within 0.1db. So now all I have to do is flick the input on the amp to switch between the two while live - the changeover is absolutely imperceptible in both volume and timing. (One of the cool things you can do with Roon).

There is very little between the two much of the time. The May possibly has a slightly wider, taller soundstage and thus instrument separation, but does not have as much depth and thus less 3-dimensionality to instruments. The May is a bit clearer with more bite (particularly the bass), and has a bit more air to the sound. (i.e. frequency extension no doubt better). Tonally, the May is really neutral across the entire frequency range whereas the Lampi has a bit of that tubey mid-range bloom and richness. The Lampi is a bit rounder and fuller. Timbre is a toss-up. Punchiness is a toss-up. Detail a toss-up. May has a wee bit more PRAT, Lampi a wee bit more romantic. May a bit more forward than Lampi.

Nothing really surprising here given their topologies and builds. My LM amp is rolled with best-of-class tubes such that it’s extremely clean/punchy/dynamic - dare I say almost solid state like (but still with that SET magic). Speakers are very neutral/revealing Spendor D7.2’s. The May and D7.2’s might just be a too much of the same ilk, or maybe I just prefer the slightly smoother/fuller/organic sound of the Lampi tube DAC with my system, giving up very little in other sonic measures. When I first plugged in the Lampi after owning a Schiit gumby I had a huge wow moment and was surprised by how much better it was. Not so with the May, though the gap was obviously not as big. But I do get why many think that the Holo May is a reference level DAC.

Still going to let the May run with music for another week or two before deciding. I do think it has improved a bit since I first plugged it in 100 hrs ago. Will follow up again in a week.

@nquery I'm looking forward to hearing your future findings.  
I have not experienced harshness, etched or overly detailed sound from mine.  I have not heard this experience from others either, so it is a curious thing.  Break-in could be a part of it but for me, I did not hear those characteristics during break-in of my unit.  After 600+ hours on mine I can say that it is more refined than when it was new, but the improvement is not night and day.  From the moment I unboxed mine and plugged it in it has sounded great.  
I am wondering about choice of cables, source, or other factors to explain what you are hearing.  Or, as another said, perhaps the comparison to tubes is revealing your preference in sound signature.  
Either way, let us know what you find.  
Happy listening!
Peter

Nquery...thank you for your post, I thought Holo May just puts everyone in trance or something, so it's refreshing to hear something a bit different. Could be it's not fully broken in or you may just prefer the tubes in your system. Keep us posted.

I just received my Holo Audio May KTE a week ago.
Wow !
My PS Audio Directstream dac is for sale.

So I have acquired a slightly used Holo May ( 200 - 300 hrs in mint condition) and have been listening to it for the past few days, comparing it to my Lampizator Amber 3. I am on the fence so far to be honest. Earlier in this thread, more than one person suggested that the May would be a sideways move from Lampizator DAC’s and I am beginning to agree with this. While it’s incredible detailed, accurate, with a black background and neutral to a fault, it doesn’t have the full, 3-dimensionality, or organic sound of the Amber 3. No doubt it’s technically superior in every way - but it’s just not as *pleasant* to listen to, is more forward sounding, and very unforgiving of poor recordings - etched and bright at times. I will let it run for a couple of hundred more hours before re-evaluating.

Just received my new May and I have to echo what others have said, this sounds fantastic right out of the box! Can't wait to get it burned in a bit.

I deleted the album from my Aurender playlist and reloaded it (it is a FLAC file).  It plays fine now as NOS.  Dunno, but not an issue I guess.

Well after waiting for the May to arrive, and listening periodically over the last ~500 hours, I'm happy to report that the May is hitting its stride.

I've done most listening in NOS mode which has fleshed out nicely during burn in.  I listened a few brief times over the break in period to OS, and it definitely does not sound as good as NOS.  I wonder, however, what actually happens during the break in process, ie the DAC chips used in OS are different than the ladder DAC circuit that I've used for nearly all of the break in.  I discovered this morning that 88.2 files cannot be played in NOS, so I listened in OS.  Just wondering what if any improvement to expect if I burn in the OS circuits?  Also, is there any way to run NOS on 88.2 files?

Hi jjss49,

Have you tried Aqua La Scala Opticalogic? Has tubes!

Still drumming my fingers waiting for the May DAC. I guess........the waiting is the hardest part.

@georgehifi I was told by kitsune that those are not coupling caps. I think Tim said they are for power filtering. 

While waiting on the May DAC to arrive I am getting by with the DAC in my Oppo 105D. It's music, but it's not the same! Can't wait.

nquery72 posts
Thanks for pointing that out @georgehifi. I am thinking about a Holo May to front my single ended Line Magnetic 805ia and was concerned that I would be missing out on optimal connectivity, that the SE connections would be compromised.

I think I could be wrong here.
Just found this pic (beautifully made btw) which shows the Holo May "may" have the correct amount of R2R resistors per channels (red) to be balanced from the R2R dacs to outputs, but there seems still to be many opamps between it and the outputs, I count 6 per channel.

Uses a 1uf coupling cap which maybe for the SE output? = -3db at 3hz with even down to 20k load, -3db at 6hz with 10k load
https://ibb.co/3yyqzV2
The balanced output "may" also be direct coupled and uses one of those opamps as a dc servo.

While I’m at it, here the power supply no switchmode (smp) rubbish here.
https://ibb.co/JymQ9Mc

Cheers George

@tinear123 thanks. I am currently using a Lampizator Amber 3 with my LM SET amp. I want to either upgrade to the Lampizator Baltic 3 or the Holo May. Lampi's have a certain house sound that is palpable and vivid but possibly a little too much at times. I have owned a couple of lower end R2R's before (Denafrips Ares and an Audio-GD) and recognize that the typical R2R sound is quite different from the Lampizator house sound, but not entirely sure to what degree the Holo May bridges that divide. Guess there is only one way to find out ...

My Holo May arrived 2 days ago, now burning in. It was worth the wait. I'm using USB input and balanced output to an Allnic preamp. I guess that the single ended output is ok but I've always preferred the balanced connection with my gear. Is it true that the May is not truly balanced?
My PS Audio DSD will be up for sale pretty soon. Even with upgraded output transformers and the newest firmware, the DSD doesn't stand up. Maybe I just prefer the sound of r2r DACS over chip based dacs? I don't know.

@nquery... I just added a Holo May KTE in front of my Don Sachs tube pre & Coincident Frankenstein 300B mono's and It's really that good.  Absolutely kills my old PS Audio Direct Stream DAC.

Thanks for pointing that out @georgehifi. I am thinking about a Holo May to front my single ended Line Magnetic 805ia and was concerned that I would be missing out on optimal connectivity, that the SE connections would be compromised.

I haven’t tried single ended.

SE will probably sound better, because I don’t believe Holo use "dual" discrete banks of R2R resistors per channel to get true balanced.
I think they are single bank of R2R resistors per channel for the SE output, then probably a SE to balanced opamp to get pseudo balanced output.

So far the only one I know that uses dual R2R banks for true balanced out put is MSB flagship models and Soekris top models

Soekris models
True balanced dual R2R resistor banks per chanel https://ibb.co/bFCR0pY
Single Ended R2R resistor banks per chanel https://ibb.co/LQQ0dBJ

Cheers George

Congrats on the May KTE achipo.

b345t, I’m using WireWorld Platinum Eclipse 7 XLR’s to my VAC pre.  I haven’t tried single ended.

@b345T I run unbalanced source direct to my Pass Labs XA25 amplifier using Roon as the volume control.  Sound is excellent.  If I could have ran balanced I would have, but the XA25 supports single ended. 

Hey guys I'm about to go for a KTE May. One question for owners, do you use balanced xlr outputs or unbalanced rca? Has anyone tried both and preferred one over the other? Cheers

I don't think 11 is part of his name here :-)

@achipos11 congrats buddy!