Just got my Holo May KTE DAC yesterday. Only 24 hours into 500 hour burn in, so I’ll need a few hundred hours more before giving a comprehensive review. I will say that I already have a good impression of a huge soundstage and incredibly solid and tight bass with this DAC. Current DAC is a PS Audio DirectStream DAC, which sets an high bar, especially fed with a Shunyata Sigma power cord and Shunyata Sigma USB cable. Both are now plugged into the Holo May. As an aside, the Shunyata Sigma USB was the single greatest upgrade for my PS Audio DirectStream. I just installed it 5 days before my Holo May KTE. It made such a huge improvement to my PS Audio DSD, I probably would held off on the Holo May KTE purchase until getting more time with the DSD with the Sigma USB. The Shunyata Sigma USB is a marvel. It is worth every penny given the impact it has had on my system. Anyway, more updates to come on the Holo May KTE after more hours. The highs are still a bit steely with so few hours on it.
Holo Audio May DAC
Just read a very nice review of this in Stereophile this month and after doing some research it looks like this one could be a very nice option for me.
https://kitsunehifi.com/product/holo-audio-may-dac/
It's made in China I think (or could be Taiwan?, and yes, I am very well aware that these are two very different countries. ;)), and employs a direct to consumer model to keep the price as low as possible. This does not worry me after purchasing a Jay's Audio transport from Vinshine Audio and having zero issues.
Just curious if anyone here has heard one or purchased? I'm very intrigued. I know the Denafrips Terminator is another highly regarded DAC with a similar ordering model, but costs a couple grand more than this one. Considering that one as well.
Thanks
https://kitsunehifi.com/product/holo-audio-may-dac/
It's made in China I think (or could be Taiwan?, and yes, I am very well aware that these are two very different countries. ;)), and employs a direct to consumer model to keep the price as low as possible. This does not worry me after purchasing a Jay's Audio transport from Vinshine Audio and having zero issues.
Just curious if anyone here has heard one or purchased? I'm very intrigued. I know the Denafrips Terminator is another highly regarded DAC with a similar ordering model, but costs a couple grand more than this one. Considering that one as well.
Thanks
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I just placed my order for the KTE. As per the website, only 2 KTE’s are available for order. Now the wait begins. I’ll be feeding the May with an Auralic Aries G2.1 connected by a Shunyata Sigma USB cable. I’m currently using a Yggy which will end up going to my bedroom system. The remainder of the chain is as follows: KTE May -> VAC Signature MkIIa SE (Cryoed Telefunken 6922’s) -> Pass Labs XVR-1 crossover -> Pass Labs X250.8 (mid’s and high’s) and Bryston 7B SST’s (low’s below 250Hz) to Maggie 3.6R’s. Subs for two channel include a REL 212/SE (Left) and a pair of S/5 SHO’s (Right). Interconnects are Wireworld Platinum Eclipse 7 XLR’s. Most of the above are powered by a Shunyata Everest 8000 while subs are direct to the wall. |
This is a very interesting review of the May KTE. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXKr_HNorg0 At 26:52 he says that if you turn OS on with the May DAC, it then uses a chip inside, and at that point you are not going to be using the ladder DAC. I wondered if he meant the digital to analog conversion was done with a chip in that case, so I sent Tim Connor an email with some questions. He quickly replied and clarified by saying the ak4137 chip in the May is an SRC which is not a DAC. It does not do anything other than convert sample rates from digital to digital. He explained the discrete DAC module has two completely dedicated discrete resistor networks for both pcm and dsd. He said the pcm network is highly advanced r2r architecture but far advanced beyond the typical. If you send the DAC a dsd file it has a completely separate discrete resistor network for 1bit content and requires high speed switching components to process dsd. So a resistor ladder is used for both pcm and dsd. I'm seriously thinking of buying the KTE May. My last separate DAC was a PS Audio DirectStream. Currently I'm using a one box setup that has a streamer, DAC and Purify amp modules inside. I use Roon and it's 64 bit volume control. I'm buying a Don Sachs Valhalla integrated tube amp, and need a DAC to use with it. This is a great discussion, glad I found it! |
@yyzsantabarbara As you can see here, https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/kte-may-technical-measurements.8933/ the balanced outputs measure better. Atkinson at Stereophile stated that there were no differences besides gain, however. I haven't seen anyone do the subjective tests and claim one to be superior. |
Take that with a grain of salt. Not that much in it, balanced is slightly better below -130db!!! and looking at all the noise makers in the background tubes, laptops, screens, test gear etc etc with SMP buzzing their brain out, it’s no wonder the balanced look a little better. My linear Tektronix scope make noise if it’s close to any source gear too. Cheers George |
Just a quick note that I do feel like break-in is going to take a while with the May. I'm on day 6 of mostly 24/day playing and feel like it's just starting to come together. I think Kitsune recommends 500 hours. I read one report (for a spring 2 i think) where they put 500 hours on and said it took another 200 until they understood what all the fuss was about. Sorry if this was mentioned earlier in the thread and I missed it. |
break-in is going to take a whileI think break in is a valid exercise for mechanical things, like phono cartridge suspension, speakers roll-surrounds, maybe even laser suspension etc etc. But with electronic devices dac, pre, amps etc I believe if your not getting "off on it" after 10hrs, which by then even the most stubborn of caps have polarized/formed properly, then your only going to talk your self into it waiting for 500hrs. BTW: Also, nothing will measure any different from 10hrs to 500hrs. But compliance in the mechanical things above do. Cheers George |
As break-in goes, I heard great things from the May KTE right out of the box. Once I got 20-30 hours on it I thought it sounded slightly better (10% improvement?). Beyond that it sounds great and I haven't really thought much about it. I doubt I have more than 200 hours on mine so far (I spend a lot more time listening to records) but I am still very happy with the May. I have not heard the Audio Mirror DAC, but have heard good things about it. Either way, the May DAC holds its own among the Super DACs, and for me this is enough. As I mentioned I mainly listen to records, so naturally I prioritize my efforts around my analog set up. If these priorities change at some point, I will likely pursue DACs that cost more and perform more highly than the May. Happy listening! Peter |
George, agreed that you know the basic character after a day or two. That said, I've had two experiences that have convinced me that electrical break in is real and can take a full week or so. I had a Pass Labs xa30.5 and decided to get their int30a integrated with the same exact amplifier circuit. Two days into listening (48 hours of play time) it still sounded worse than the original amp. I was told they would sound identical after a week by renohifi and they were correct. I also built my own First Watt f4. Eventually I decided to build new boards with the highest quality parts available and when I excitedly powered up they sounded way worse. That remained true for a couple days. After a week of 24h/day play it became the significant upgrade I'd planned for. |
Termi vs Termi +. Had them both in my house side-by-side. I so badly wanted to like the plus better. Latest model, oven controlled clock, has to be better right??? I kept the Termi. The plus was great, a slight, very slight, bit more “drive” behind it. Almost like digital equalization slightly tweaked. I didn’t find the change necessary or better, just different. Also, when listening to very delicate detailed highs (“My Foolish Harp” Isabelle Olivier) the Plus couldn’t quite match the delicacy of the Termi. Forced my wife to listen too (yeah, I know) she also preferred the terminator over the plus. Tried both with and without the Gaia. The Gaia provided a barely discernible improvement to both—kept it. Toying with trying the May but with no trial period, and being extremely satisfied with Termi I just can’t bring myself to do it...Yet. Roon Nucleus+. Mark Levinson pre and monos. B&W 802D3s |
@73max, how many hours on both? With such a close sound and the Plus not handling delicacy as well as the standard, sounds like just a break-in thing. When I had a Termi, delicacy and final details is what took the time... Not saying your observations are not true, just aways a chance with something ‘new’. Especially since they’re so close. |
@falconquest I have both in my system (see my system page for more information) right now. The May is extremely clean and extended with great tonality across the frequency range. It paints an amazingly tall and wide picture across my soundstage. The AM-T3SE is a little less even handed, but provides more body and "meat on the bones." It shrinks the soundstage more between the speakers, but also draws more depth and 3-dimensionality. It's obvious to me that both are superb dacs. I'm maybe talking myself into a conspiracy theory, but for people who track the distortion profiles of their electronics, it does kinda feel like a classic 2nd (depth and warmth) vs 3rd (clarity and details) harmonic dominance difference. A lot of good information on that from Nelson Pass in this link if anyone wants to put themselves in the weeds with me (https://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/the-pass-h2-harmonic-generator/). It's feeling like I'll probably put the May up for sale soon. I think the "demo" has kind of solidified for me that I prefer 2nd harmonic distortion profiles and am going to exclusively shop for them in the future. This also fits with my experienced preference for First Watt f4s (and Coincident 300b SETs) over Atma-sphere M60s and a Pass Labs XA25. Anyway, I can let people in here know if/when I do. Feel free to PM me if you're interested and want to talk about it before I release to the general public. |
The May is extremely clean and extended with great tonality across the frequency range. It paints an amazingly tall and wide picture across my soundstage. The AM-T3SE is a little less even handed, but provides more body and "meat on the bones." It shrinks the soundstage more between the speakers, but also draws more depth and 3-dimensionality. It’s obvious to me that both are superb dacs.Was this done with both in NOS mode or OS mode? If both, was the outcome the same, as for me the borrowed Holo Sping L2 in NOS was richer perhaps not as microscopic than OS mode. Cheers George |
@73max, how many hours on both? With such a close sound and the Plus not handling delicacy as well as the standard, sounds like just a break-in thing. When I had a Termi, delicacy and final details is what took the time... Not saying your observations are not true, just aways a chance with something ‘new’. Especially since they’re so Definitely way more time on the standard. Over a year. I ran the plus 24 seven For about two weeks. Started comparisons around 10 days. I think most of the character had developed, but you are correct there may have subtle changes to come. Based on the overall character I had a definite preference standard. Very subjective, based on my ear, my room and my system. |
@pgalvin I do not leave mine on 24/7. It runs pretty hot and whether it actually does or not, my perception is that it will shorten its lifespan if it's constantly left on. I also imagine that it's using a fair amount of energy being on, though I do not know the number of watts it consumes. I don't notice it needs to be warmed up much to sound good (maybe one hour) so I just turn it on an hour before I start listening. Cheers |
I believe the front panel power switch is actually a standby and keeps some of the internals running to minimize warm up time. I know that was true of the spring at least (https://community.roonlabs.com/t/holo-audio-spring-r2r-dac-does-dsd512/18516/5). Could help explain why people don't notice much difference... |
I wanted to follow up on my experience with my Holo May KTE DAC. I’m about 450 hours into burn-in since receiving my DAC a few days before Christmas. At least with the KTE edition (I can’t comment on base or level 2), the burn-in hours are a must. There are a ton of upgraded capacitors in the KTE, and from my days of burning in teflon capacitors with my Conrad Johnson preamp and amp, you have to grind through the hours to get the reward. There were lots of ups and downs with the sound, at some points, the DAC not sounding particularly exceptional. If you are at 200, 300 hours and thinking, "Eh, this is not such an amazing DAC", hold the line and keep grinding. You should start to hear marked improvements around 450 hours. As I close in on 500 hours (I’ll probably keep it running another 200 hours to see if there aren’t more incremental improvements after even 500), the sound has taken a marked turn for the best. Soundstage has gotten huge... both in width, height, and depth. The tone has also become more natural. Appropriately warm, but not too warm... natural. Microdetails in the sound are startling and thrilling to hear. Strings, cymbals, brass, guitars... I hear things I’ve never heard before in most of my recordings. The Holo May KTE does this in a very natural way... not artificially highlighting detail, but when you hear it, your natural response is to mouth the words "Wow." Bass is very solid, and particularly acoustic bass is lifelike and thrilling to hear. Very fast, tight, and natural. The sustain and decay of cymbals, strings, piano notes, bells are delightful to hear. Echoes and soundstage of the halls of live events are also the best I have ever heard in my system. When I say I am hearing things I haven’t heard before in recordings, it’s not hyperbole. Fresh new details come out that were simply not audible before. Soundstage detail and depth provide a fresh perspective on recordings. You will quickly be able to discern which are good recordings in your library vs. bad recordings. Good recordings will really pop with lifelike details and soundstage. Mediocre and poor recordings stand out as such. You may be surprised which of your old standby’s end up falling into which category. Such is the resolution and realism of the Holo May KTE. DSD recordings come across as softer at a given volume level than PCM, but are equally beautiful to listen to... just turn up the volume as needed. BTW... YMMV, but I personally found that the DSD sound quality improved in a noteworthy way after playing 50-100 hours of DSD-only recordings as part of the burn-in. If DSD is part of your music library, dedicate 100-200 hours of your 500-600 hour burnin to playing just DSD. DSD goes down a different path of resistors than PCM which probably explains the effect I’ve heard. Don’t judge DSD sound quality with just a few minutes of play time, even if you already have hundreds of hours of burnin on the PCM side of things. If you just listen to FLAC/PCM, none of the above will matter. I am feeding my Holo May KTE with an Auralic Aries G2 streamer via USB with a Shunyata Sigma USB cable (arguably one of the very best USB cables on the market). I also have a Shunyata Sigma power cord plugged into it fed from a Shunyata Denali 6000T power conditioner, so cabling and streaming source is very good. I have a SOtM Audiophile network switch feeding the Auralic Aries G2 from my NAS and ISP (gigabit Verizon FiOS fiber). Amplification is a combination of the Conrad Johnson ET-7 series 2 pre-amp and Conrad Johnson Premier 350 amplifier. Speakers are the YG Acoustics Carmel. The Carmels are amazingly resolving and seem to scale upwards forever as I make improvements in my electronics chain and cabling. Shunyata Sigma RCA IC’s and biwire speaker cables feed amplification and speakers. Music is streamed from Qobuz, Tidal or my local NAS running minimserver. Almost all listening is in NOS mode. I feel like there is still 100-200 hours of break in left, despite closing in on 500. That said, in the past 50 hours a lot of magic has come together. This DAC upgrade has really unchained a lot of tremendous resolution in my downstream components, cabling, and speakers. It really does come back to the source... a lot of expense and quality components downstream in my system were all being held back until I introduced the Holo May KTE DAC in my system. I’ll give another update after another week or so of burnin. -Jeff |
@jtrimm Congrats, that all sounds exceptional. I wish I'd been able to hang onto mine longer to ride out the burn in process a bit more. Damn forced moves. Everything's about to go into storage for 3 months or so. Because of that, I likely wouldn't have been able to get up to 500 until after the pandemic was over (god willing) and at that point the resale market is going to be dead as everyone shifts their surplus income from equipment to travel. |
@jtrimm Nice write-up! As I wrote previously, the digital end of my system has taken a back seat to my analog set up, so I really haven't focused on burn time. I think I should maybe leave my system running while I'm not around to give it the time required. Great to hear that it has made a difference for you. Cheers, Peter |
@snackeyp FWIW I’ve kept mine running 24x7 for 3 weeks, even when my preamp is off and no sound is coming through the speakers- DAC is still playing music 24x7. Also, I’ve noticed multiple regressions in sound quality along the 500 hour burnin path... ie. sound is improving, and then takes a step back, sometimes for a few days. It’s frustrating and makes you doubt everything about the process. However, when it all comes together towards the end of burn-in, the transformation in sound is not subtle, and completely transformative. Also, I suspect, and will confirm with a few hundred more hours of play, that 500 hours is not a hard and fast rule on when things reach their pinnacle... |
Another break-in tip for those slower to ‘get there’ materials, like teflon... This may seem unconventional or even weird to some, but I got this from a designer years ago... During the break-in process, every two or three day power the unit down for 5 hours +/-. Evidently letting the caps discharge for a time like this can actually speed up the process some and even out the rollercoaster some. |
just read through this whole thread. very interesting. I am in the market for a new DAC upgrading from my Resolution Audio Cantata 2.0. I have the option of upgrading to the 3.0, but I am curious about the options out there. the absolute best DAC that I recall listening to was the Light Harmonic DaVinci, but that is unobtainium used and the new one is beyond my budget anyway. I had my current DAC thoroughly crushed by a Lampizator GG, which showed me how much of a bottleneck my DAC is at the moment. However, I am still very resistant of going the tube DAC route. I am just moving back from a Gryphon Class A back to my Gryphon Diablo (orginal) so I am very interested in @phastm3 ever got to do his comparison. |
Another update on my burn-in experience on my Holo May KTE edition. I hit a noticeable amazing transformation in sound at around 900 hours. I know that sounds nuts, but even after 500 hours of burn-in I’ve had multiple swings and even temporary regressions in sound quality and sound staging. The soundstage I am hearing now at 900 hours is awe-inspiring. It is not a subtle transformation. I’ve basically run it 24x7 for 35 days. YMMV with your own Holo May KTE or with the non-KTE versions of this DAC, but this has been my experience. If you are questioning the sound you are getting, run 1000 hours through it first. The transformation in soundstage width/depth, realism, and lifelike imaging is truly spellbinding. These guys giving reviews of units with only 200-300 hours of time on them are likely only hearing a facsimile of how a fully broken in model truly sounds. |
@snopro I'm not good at describing sound, but in this case it is not at all thin sounding. I meant to say that the music just flows effortlessly and refreshingly. As far as natural tonality, it has it in spades. I've written this before but this DAC is the closest thing to analog that I have heard, so much so that I often forget that I'm not listening to my analog rig. @jjss49 This DAC does not function as a preamp, meaning there is no volume control feature. |
