I just put my third, too expensive but wonderful, Halcyonic active isolation base under my Shindo Labs tt and am just overwhelmed by what I am hearing. I doubt if I will sleep tonight having 50 LPs that I "must" hear.
The ambient detail and realism is just shocking.
It is one of the great tragedies of audio that this device cannot be made somewhere for under $2000; I think they would sell hundreds. I know I would have one for every componnent. Mine was used.
Hi TBG...unfortunately, when i was at my friends place the system with the Zanden and Halcyonics was not working. We listened to his other SOTA system (DCS, Genesis 1.1, all Kondo electronics...remarkable). But we were unable to play with the Halcyonics and Stillpoints.
In my system, i have found [almost] no bad places to uses a Stillpoints. I think someone at WBF has put Stillpoints Ultra 5 under his SME30 and absolutely did not like it...and bear in mind, he uses Ultra 5 under EVERY SINGLE other component in his system. But not under the SME.
Stillpoints posted some questions to help out and see why that was the case. Just an FYI.
Lloydelee21 Look up the thread, "Why will no other turntable beat the EMT 927?" I just wrote about the Halcyonics versus StillPoints. Of course, I never had the SP Ultra when I had my two Halcyonics.
Big fan of Stillpoints Ultra 5s...just put 8 under my old Wilson X1s...stunning. Then put 3 on top of Velodyne DD18 which already is on Auralex Isolation platform. Plus one on top of preamp and Stillpoints LPI on transport...all great.
PS the improvement by adding Wave Kinetic footers is very noticeable but not to the same scale as adding Minus K to my turntable set up but we are not exactly comparing the same thing though. So take this for what it's worth.
Metralla, Kinetic Wave footers work really well for me under Playback MPS-5. I prefer it over Rollerblock and Symposium Ultra platform. The background is blacker with Kinetic Wave. There is a bit more detail, a bit more focus with Symposium Ultra platform but I feel that the clarity comes with a slight trade off in hardening of midrange on voice and piano in comparison. I probably would not have notice the slight hardening of the midrange if I did not compare Symposium to Wave Kinetic though.
Thg, thanks for your input. I recently just got a Minus K for my turntable and I was amazed at the improvement. Now that my components are pretty much settled, I am working on shelves and isolation device next and Steelpoints definitely is on the list of things I would like to try. So far, I only experimented with Kinetic Wave footers, Symposium Ultra, rollerblock and that's about it.
Suteetat, my only experience has been with the Halcyonics active isolation bases. I thought they had to be the maximum benefit isolation devices. I had two of these and used one under the turntable and one under my stereo amp. A StillPoints Component stand under both was their equal. I also got a SP Rack for under other components replacing my many and multiple level Mana stands. It was far superior.
Later I added SP Ultra SSs for under the speakers. They were dramatically better than the Townshend speaker cradles. I got some more for under the amp that was already on the SP Component stand. I was shocked. I tried them on the SP Component stand under the Bergman tt, and again was shocked. I put them under components on the SP Rack and again thought them an improvement. Then I bought the Exemplar XP-2 preamp with SP SSs as feet allowing it to be directly mounted on the rails of the SP Rack. It was strikingly better, causing me to believe the acrylic shelves were harming the SP Rack.
Then came the SPs Ultra Fives. I know that on SP Component stands 4 Ultra Fives if carefully adjusted to have all four equally tight against the amp or turntable is just fantastic. Never have I heard anything even approaching it.
I grant that the Minus K platform are a different technology than the Halcyonics but neither I would believe could have the magic I hear with the SP Ultra Fives. I should say that the Ultra Fives are difficult to use under component that have large built in feet. They are so big that for them to avoid the existing feet you have to go into the center of the component. I use SP Ultra SSs on a replacement of the acrylic shelves on the SP Rack called the Grid. I have not really tried to use the Fives on the Grids.
Wow, I saw the price of Stillpoints Ultra Fives. I wonder, a set of 4 would be pretty close to a Minus K platform. Granted you cannot use Minus K easily in a rack except for the top one but for amps or anything that sit on the topshelf, wouldn't Minus K make better sense?
Himiguel, I wish I could say that there is no benefit of them under your speakers and amps, but I cannot deny that they are amazing. I know a guy with more than 60 of them! The problem under components such as a phono stage is that the Fives are so big, you have difficulty getting them under them.
If you have a StillPoints Rack, there is a replacement coming for their acrylic shelves that allows using the SP Ultra SSs that is every bit as good as the Fives and way better than the acrylic shelves which hide the real benefit of the SP Rack.
Tbg: I do not own a TT at this time, and while I have thought about buying a TT quite seriously.., at this point with my digital at its current state I am not interested.
I have listened to the StillPoints component stands (the one that looks like an adjustable X in the large form factor) with the StillPoint feet in place. I have also used the StillPoint feet without the stand.
I find that they can work well with some items, but I am not enamored of them. I will say that in my situation they absolutely can not touch the Silencer in any form factor or way... they simply do not do what that thing is capable of under digital gear. Now under amps, I think in my case they do less harm than the Silencer in active mode, but I still would not use them under my amps (Graaf GM 200 and Modena) as they impart a sound I'm not partial too.
I do have one SS amp which sounds stunning when used with the StillPoints amps stands (the one that looks like a X) when used with the SP feet... this is on a carpeted floor. Again...YMMV there is no Panacea for vibration control in my opinion.
I own two Accurion Silencers and I can tell you first hand that they do work! CAVEAT under some things :) I have found that my AMR DP777 Dac loves the Silencer. It is a match made in Heaven figuratively speaking and the benefit it brings to the AMR is considerable. I also noted that the Ayon CD5s sounds MUCH better when atop the Silencer. I have tried 2 of my amplifiers on it, the Graaf GM200 and the Graaf Modena, it absolutely sucked the life out of both of them in Active isolation mode. Passively the amps sound wonderful on the unit but when active, it has a negative effect. It seem to rob the music of it's harmonic content, all notes which used to hang and float in the air like live music are abruptly truncated. It is not a subtle effect. I also noted that my MFA Reference TVC Pre does not sound good on the unit when it is in Active mode.
So my experience with them shows that YMMV is very true. When it works with a product it is spectacularly good. When it does not work well with a product it is equally spectacularly bad.
Some have claimed that everything they put on was made to sound better. I absolutely do not dispute their claim as I do not have their equipment/ears...etc, but in my case it just aint so :)
Reidwhitney, it has been several years since I sold my two Halcyonic bases for the StillPoints Rack. I don't know what having everything on Halcyonics, but having everything on the StillPoints Rack was better than having two on Halcyonics and the remainder on Mana stands.
I understand this is an old thread, but I am still very curious as to how active vibration isolation systems have benefitted the audible clarity of your equipment. I do work for Herzan and wish I was with the company during your original inquiry to provide assistance to your vibration noise issues. This by no means is a solicitation, moreover, I am simply curious with your experience active vibration isolation systems and their effect on your equipment.
In forty years I have had only one component failure and that was an ARC SP10. The unit flamed out, the fuse didn't blow and the breaker didn't trip. I was there in the room when this happened. I tripped the breaker myself in the closet where the gear was located..and put the fire out in the unit. So much for protection devices. To me its all about the sound. Tom
I once wire ac directly from the wall outlet the component's ac transformer. It was dramatically better but quite unsafe. I also once tried wiring across the fuse holder, which is what the Virtual Dynamics magnets are doing. Again it was superior but unsafe. I do draw the line, however, with requiring all components with ac grounds to be used. One only is far superior sonically and safe enough.
You need to try the non fuse repalacements from Rick at Virtual Dynamics. They are high power magnets.. They are 3d and sound as if you have an entirely new amp. Tom
Elberoth2, I have yet to get back to Herzan as I have reason to believe they think I am running a lab as I used to be a professor.
I do have an experience yesterday that might interest you. I was putting new IsoClean fuses into my H-Cat amp. The amp is on one of my Micro40s. It keeps trying to relevel itself if you are twisting fuse holders, so I turned it off.
I installed the IsoCleans and turned the amp on for a listen. The sound was not as good as it had been, causing me to think maybe the fuses needed breakin. After about an hour and still little improvement, I was disappointed. Suddenly I remembered that I had not turned the Halcyonics back on. When i did and returned to my seat, the sound was spectacular. The fuses added a lot but the Halcyonics added more.
I would urge you at some point to try the amp again. Clement Perry of Soundstage strongly urged me to do this. This all means, of course, that you too will be on the slippery slope to needing more Halcyonics or Herzans.
I tried The Silencer under my ARC CD-7 CDP, ARC Ref-3 pre and ARC Ref 110 amp. When I put my pre and power amp on the Silencer, the changes were minimal. A bit like changing the tube dampers. There were there, and were positive, but they not warranted extra $11.500 IMO.
CDP was a different story. Here the changes were very substantial, in terms or removing grain, improving stage depth, resolution, HF-air and decays. It is like the noise leven in the system had dropped -20dB. Here it actually represents a reasonable value. Not good, but reasonable. I think that If I had a spare $11500 burning my pocket (which I do not have right now - the unit was on dealer loan) I would keep it. Oh well - maybe one day !
Thank you Tbg for bringing my attention to this innovative product.
PS. I borrowed The Silencer to a friend who owns VPI Aries 3 turn table. I will report back on his findings as well.
I did get an answer to some of my questions from Herzan. Apparently, the Stable Table people and those at Halcyonic once worked together. The focus of Herzan has become improving sensors and communications to correction focusing on corrections in the 10-100Hz region.
TS-300LT costs $10,200 but is comparable to the Micro 80, so it is a very large unit. I would love to be able to compare the two in several applications.
No. I end an email to Herzan asking about the retail for TS-140, but never got any reply.
BTW - does Micro 40 has auto leveling feature ? The Silencer has to be readjusted every time you put a different component on it (for different weight).
Elberoth2, I really don't understand this pricing. As I understand it, the Silencer was a Micro without the self leveling feature built to sell at a lower cost than the Micro 40. I don't think you will be able to compare it with a Micro 40, will you?
Elberoth2, lucky you being able to buy in Euros. Does the Silencer only come in one size? I don't know whether the ARC Ref 110 is too heavy, but my Shindo Labs overlaps the Micro 40 by about 2" on each side.
Tbg - no, I'm sourcing it from Germany (I live in Europe) with the help of Sam Laufer. I will try it under my ARC CD-7 and ARC Ref 3 preamp. My ARC Ref 110 power amp is prolly too big and will not fit.
Elberoth2, congratulations! I assume you are in the US and are getting it from Laufer. What are you going to put the Silencer on? And what are you planning to put on the Silencer? I would be hard put to make a recommendation for which component to try.
I am using a Micro 40 in a Finite Elemente Pagode Master Reference stand underneathe an Esoteric X-01D2 with stunning results and can only mirror Norm's comments.
I should have the Silencer in the next couple of days/weeks. I will post my impressions vs my Finite Elemente Pagode Master Reference racks/stands in this thread.
Thomasheisig, I think these are cartridges, right? If so, your question is one that I cannot answer. I have no idea whether investing $8000 plus in a Halcyonics and $2000 in a turntable, arm, and cartridge can rival a $10,000 turntable, arm, and cartridge. I do think it is saying a lot that I won't speculate, however.
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