Evolution Acoustics MM2/MM3

I must admit, the addition of a pair of subwoofers has improved the scale quite a bit bringing the performance closer to large floor standers, which only leaves the issue of adjustability unaddressed.

Thanks Marco and jwm.

clearly, I am making no move without an audition. At this level, it does come down to personal taste.
I agree with jwm that it's not just about bass integration, though my original point was that I would like the flexibility to adjust the bass in case of and when I move residence. Having said this, I have heard quite a few speakers and the way the Aviors integrate is probably second to none. Reiterating my original point, the only two areas worth consideration and more scoping would be adjustability and scale.

thanks!!

sujay

Sujay I would not just be worried about a speakers bass integrating well into a listening room. You need to hear every speaker before you buy. MM speakers I believe use ceramic drivers which have a certain sound just as carbon fiber and other drivers. You may not like the mids compared to what you have. I think tonality and true to life dynamics are important as well as bass.

I can only add my experience in 30 years' audio (and... love for music... obviously) just ended in 2016 with a purchase of EA MM3's speakers.
I came from Kharma Grand Ceramique and I know very well all the higher actual Kharma production; furthermore I currently listen to a few high systems of my friends with Wilson Maxx3/Alexandria; Rockport Ankaa, YG Anat and before making my choice I visited two editions of Munchen high-end fair with many interesting rooms and speakers.
My preference goes to EA MM3's that shows great detail through all spectrum and have an exceptional the ability to adapt to relatively small spaces and also to sound great in large rooms. The option of tuning the bass is very useful and the integration bass-mid-highs is excellent.
One caveat? weight! 575 lbs are not easy to deal with.
my two cents
Marco

@audiotroy Everyone with a commercial interest should disclose it in a signature at the bottom of every post. That is if you want to appear professional and well meaning. So far, you aren't looking too good. Time to say "Lesson learned, I'll do better next time" and move along. 

@jtinn goes out of his way on many threads to make his business interests clear.

Where is @audiofeil,  our long lost official posting cop when we need him? Cheers,
Spencer 

Astrotoy: You are ridiculous. You have no idea what you’re talking about and are bordering on libel.

I certainly disclosed that I am the manufacturer of the Evolution Acoustics loudspeakers. Mike Lavigne is a customer and friend. Absolutely not a partner in any way in any of my companies.

Very unprofessional 

Hey Melb guy dude you are so way off base it isn't even funny.

Compare the size of Magico in gross sales and net revenue to Paradigm, Paradigm has been making great speakers for many years using some quite superb drivers. Their factory is 250,000 sq feet.

Why is this relevant Paradigm makes money, a lot of money, with vast resources you can build anything you want and easily out spend a smaller competitor. If B&W wanted to build a 10 million dollar speaker they could, they are about a $300 million dollar a year company, for that matter so could Bose, they are about $3.4 billion dollar a year company.

It is talent and resources and desire that determines what a company can do. 

Paradigm was always a conservative company, that always built a good but not earth shattering product with Persona they are producing a world class speaker that can compare with a $70k or more Magico easily and in terms of driver technology the Persona drivers are right up there with the best drivers on the planet, perhaps only the heinously expensive pure Diamond drivers of Acuton may be better.

Beryillium for years has been considered the best if not one of the best materials to build a loudspeaker cone out of it is self damping, extremely rigid and very light. No one uses it as it is extremely expensive and nearly impossible to source, as well as extremely toxic and difficult to work with. 

Stop drinking the Magico cool aid, to think that a layer of diamond dust over a Beryillium alloy is even close to a pure Beryillium driver you got another thing coming, and Graphene is another way of saying fancy carbon fiber composite driver, again something that has been done many times before so don't start throwing stones at Paradigm engineering that have a boat load of patents on driver design.

Magico makes superb drivers but to honestly believe that their drivers are superior to any other superb set of drivers is just silly.

Magico makes a very fine speaker if you like them great, many people find Magico's boring, I visited a very famous retailer and heard the $170k pair and was hardly moved by them, they did many things well, one of our clients has the Rockport Arakis and quite frankly not even in the same ballpark as the Magico.

As per Jtinn's comments, I know exactly what is inside an  Evolution speaker we did a repair job to replace a blown tweeter in a guy's house in CT, so yes I know intimately what is inside and how the speaker is constructed. 

I have also been inside a Rockport as well so you have no idea to whom you speak I have been building speakers for close to 40 years and into this hobby since the 60's, my first system was all Dynaco hand built, Tandberg Reel to Reel and Ar3A loudspeakers, so experience I got a plenty. 

Did Jtinn disclose duh that he is the manufacturer of Evolution Acoustics or Mike Lavigne is a partner in their venture?  I  work  doing  repairs and do occasional installation work so it is more of a fun part time thing,so it is pretty clear that I am affiliated with a dealer. 

Thanks, Mike. Yes, Kedar had only good things to say about your set up and your hospitality, to boot!

if I am ever in your part of the world, I will readily take you up on the offer.

i need to now look at ways in which I can probably get a MM2 to start with without losing too much on my Aviors. Given that I am not in a hurry, helps!!

I started with a MM2 and really enjoyed it.  I upgraded to the MM3 and couldn't be happier.

if you gonna spend $$$ then imho it's great to have bass and treble control to adjust to diff room acoustic.

I think even though expensive the MM3 with powered woofer is a better value than the Magico.  

Sujay, well horses for courses. Though you'll need deep pockets to move up the Rockport line...the next model is $62,500US (the same price as the Magico S7, and $20k more than the S5 Mk2 in premium gloss finish). FWIW, I think 'adjustability' is overrated. If you have bass issues, look at your room or change speakers. Room acoustics are a better way to resolve nasty room nodes. It's funny you mentioned scale...that is one of the distinct improvements in the S1 & S5 mk2. Good luck to you, but i'd rather put my $20k into better amps, a/c power & isolation.

Hi melbguy1,

thanks for your thoughts. I like magico S series more than the Q. Having said this, I clearly preferred the Avior to the S5. I'm sure the mark II S5 should be better in all respects but I wouldn't want to move just for that reason. As mentioned, the only aspects that the Avior probably lack, to an extent, are scale and adjustability both of which I will not be able to obtain by moving to another passive design. Of course, this is my opinion

cheers

sujay

@jtinn, I agree it’s not cool to talk down a competitor’s products without disclosing your own commercial interests. Rockport make some very well put together speakers & use some of the best composite cabinets in the business.

As far as the Paradigm Persona 9H speakers go, they use mostly car audio technology (eg: small diameter opposed active subs, ice amps, dual VC woofers etc). Dual VC woofers are 30 year old technology abandoned by Watkins Stereo almost 20 years ago. Today, no serious high end speaker manufacturer uses dual VC woofers.

I own Magico S5 Mk2 speakers. There is a reason why Magico don’t use Beryllium midrange driver cones and pure Beryllium tweeters (anymore). The S5 Mk2’s feature diamond-coated beryllium tweeters which provide an ideal balance between mass and stiffness. And the new robust motor system and long-throw voice coil design have lower distortion which allowed the breakup to be moved beyond the band pass, allowing seamless integration with the midrange driver.

The S5 Mk2’s use the exact same midrange drivers as the new $75k M3. From Magico’s press release - " The newly designed Magico six-inch midrange and seven-inch bass driver cones found in the M3 are both manufactured from Multi-Wall carbon XG Nanographene and a new proprietary ultra-stiff carbon weave which is 20% lighter and 300% stiffer than the cone material used in previous Magico loudspeaker offerings. The underhung neodymium base motor system provides an ultra-stabilized magnetic field for the pure Titanium voice coil to operate within. This radical new driver design offers the lowest THD in the industry and sets the performance benchmark for others to aspire to."

In the bass department, the S5 Mk2’s use all new 10" bass drivers with modified motor systems, extremely powerful magnets and ultra stiff aluminium cones & Nanographene dust caps which extend down to 20Hz and keep pace with the mid and high frequencies for a seamless whole. The big improvement in the S5 Mk2 is their lower distortion, greater coherency & improved sound staging. Off-axis performance is excellent; the mark of well engineered drivers, crossovers and cabinets.

If I were contemplating spending $35k on a pair of those Paradigm speakers, for the sake of an extra $3k, I would include the S5 Mk2s or new S3 Mk2’s (due soon) on my audition list. That’s the difference between high end, and aspiring high end speakers. Disclosure: I am not a dealer or distributor, just a happy end user.

 Audiotroy,
I'm really wondering how you feel you can make a statement like you did with a clear conscience. You have no idea what we use or what rockport uses inside our respective speakers. I think it is in very bad taste that you responded the way you did.
If you want to promote speakers that you sell, no one is going to give you a hard time about that as long as you disclose properly. But when you denigrate a competitor's speakers without knowing anything about them, you lose all credibility.

Rockport makes a musical sounding well built speaker with good quality drivers. I certainly think our Evolution Acoustics go further in absolutely every way sonically, but I have nothing negative to say about Rockport.

Thanks, Soix. The reasons I need adjustability is that I might move into a smaller living space in a larger city soon, where I may not have the luxury of space. Also, in my current set up, I do feel there are room modes that bother me sometimes and I want to minimize their impact. I do have a couple of subs currently which help. 

I dont necessarily want to tinker around with DRC and while I do have some absorption and diffusion set up in the room, I don't want to overdo it. Today I have a dedicated listening room, tomorrow I may not and all the bass traps and paraphernalia just spoil the get up of the living room if it's not dedicated to music.

as to scale, I do agree that there is no substitute to a large multi driver floor stander and yes I can move up the Rockport family but it gets really expensive!

thanks again

sujay

Don't know if you can really go wrong with the EAs, but there are so many options out there at these price points.  The thing that really puzzles me most is why you feel the need for bass/treble controls, which will greatly limit your options.  My recommendation would be to get the speakers that do what you're looking for and deal with frequency issues with room treatments and/or digital speaker and room correction.  Then your options become unlimited. 

That said, and if scale and impact are what you're looking for, I'd take a hard look at some multi-driver line source type speakers.  I've never forgotten hearing speakers like Nola Grand Reference, Pipedreams, and Genesis 2 at shows.  I think it's the combination of all those drivers and surface area combined with speaker height that produces an effortless majesty that is just harder for shorter speakers with fewer drivers to match.  I'd even consider looking at the Carver ALS or Gallo Reference with a couple good subs if the others are out of the price ballpark new or used.  Those line source presentations at shows have always stuck with me as truly special in what they do, and if I had the scratch and the space that's the way I'd go.  Just another option and FWIW.  The larger ribbon and electrostatic speakers produce something similar in my experience, but they seem to lack some of the oomph and thrust of more conventional drivers.  Again, just my impression and experience.  In any event, best of luck. 

Hi guys, many thanks for your responses. I was traveling hence the delay in response. I will be in Miami next week and I am trying to see if I can listen to the EA and the paradigm. Any idea who are the dealers in Miami?

audiotroy, is it possible to correspond offline? I want to know more about the persona.

thanks

sujay

I was in the same position a few months ago with Aerial 7Ts. I have a relatively large room and I wanted speakers with a bigger sound, more dynamic, but still imaged well and disappeared. I changed to Monitor Audio PL500's and couldn't be happier. I would listen to MM2's and 3's and let your own ears decide. The other question is will they play well in your room? The Aerials are great speakers, but not for a relatively large room.

Quite frankly I would not put any Evolution speakers in the uber class with Rockport, Rockport uses way better everything.

The only issue is scale with the Rockports you have, the Avior which doesn't have thunderous bass.

If you are looking for probably the best buy in high end loudspeakers right now, I would look at the new Paradigm Persona 9H $35,000.00 they are amazing, they use even better drivers then Rockport, the Persona uses a 1 inch pure Beryllium tweeter and a 7 inch pure Beryllium midrange, so the sound is very transparent and completely coherent, the bass is a real stand out with four 8.5 inch long throw bass drivers with 2 inch linear throw coupled to 1400 watts of amplification and active room correction.  

They sound huge with unbelievable dynamics! If you are in the New York metro area we have them on display and they are the best overall high performance speaker on the market today!

I don't see your virtual system - very hard to comment without any idea of your setup. Sounds like your Rockports are not working for your needs if you desire adjusting woofer and tweeter.