Do you trust your ears more than measurements?


I have a lot of audiophiles that say the ear test is the best. I believe them. Some of us have to do blind tests etc. I’m in the camp of trusting your own ears because no matter how something measures. Is it more pleasing to you with a particular cable, placement tweak etc. What are your thoughts everyone? 

calvinj

Ah, okay @calvinj . Thing is, DSP doesn’t really require physical space - certain modules fit the footprint of a playing cards deck, with the software run entirely from within the module or upstream in part from a standard computer. Think “desktop-to-larger old school-style DAC” footprint for any typical DSP module. You could fit at least half a dozen units in the empty spaces on the shelf in your system photo.

To the contrary of your limited space concern, the less listening space you have (and/or the more conflicting the boundaries there are), the better DSP might work for that setup, especially a bass-heavy rig like yours. Similar measurements to what AVR’s have used for calibration over two decades is an over-simplified but conceivable likeness.

 

On arguing in favor of tuning a system (1) by ear-only vs. (2) an integrative approach of listening and measuring/trying signal processing to better inform you of possibilities:

If you just don’t want to test your system with measurements and attempted corrections in the digital domain, that’s your prerogative and it’s totally fine. But it’s also choosing a stance of “ignorance is bliss.” IOW, you don’t actually know which to trust because no informed position on tuning a system (1) by ear-only vs. (2) by ear with measurements as a guide, can be held by someone who has not tried both. You cannot have an informed opinion about two things if you’ve only tried one of them. Make sense?

 

Regarding measurements for selecting kit to purchase (vs. tuning a system already had), @erik_squires  summarized potential advantages vs. pitfalls concisely and objectively.

I measured a lot in my younger years.  I got the Behringer stuff and did digital eq to get my bass response near perfect.  I built tons of bass traps and spent all kinds of time messing around in my basement.  I'm glad I did it, I got a little bit of a feel for how a graph translates to what I perceive.  I rarely do anything like that now, though.  The last time I did I set my sub level by ear and measured it and I had set it just about perfect.  I decided that in-room bass response can be pretty uneven in the deep bass and it doesn't bother me.  You can EQ it down 3-4 db and it'll help but if you eq it down 15 to get it flat it sounds weird.  

A lot of good answers here. I’ve been working with measuring and listening for the last week, listening and noticing what I don’t like, and then trying to understand how to fix it. Measurements help get me in the ballpark. I know what a really bad sounding measurement looks like. What’s harder to tell is what a really good sound measurement looks like compared to a decent sounding measurement. There are a lot of different ways a system can sound good or bad. I'm using horns that can load down to 600Hz with some eq. If I move the crossover  from 600 Hz to 1000 Hz I can get more headroom and dynamics at the price of less natural tonal character because the dispersion isn’t as smooth at the crossover. I also get better imaging in some ways with the higher crossover because the midbass horn gets beamy between 600 and 1000 Hz. The measurements show lower distortion at high volume and better in room clarity at the higher crossover. My ears tell me the tonal quality matters more. I wish I could have it both ways, but the benefit of the higher crossover really shows when I crank it up louder than I usually want to listen.

Great post with which i concur... Thanks...

 

 

A lot of good answers here. I've been working with measuring and listening for the last week, listening and noticing what I don't like, and then trying to understand how to fix it. Measurements help get me in the ballpark. I know what a really bad sounding measurement looks like. What's harder to tell is what a really good sound measurement looks like compared to a decent sounding measurement. There are a lot of different ways a system can sound good or bad. If I move my crossover for my tweeters from 600 Hz to 1000 Hz I can get more headroom and dynamics at the price of less natural tonal character because the dispersion isn't as smooth. I also get better imaging in some ways with the higher crossover because it gets beamy between 600 and 1000 Hz. The measurements show lower distortion at high volume and better in room clarity at the higher crossover. My ears tell me the tonal quality matters more.

We may not all agree but there are many ways to approach your system.  Wealth of info here.