Curious How These Nordost Speaker Cables Do What They Do


For a day and a half I’ve been listening to Nordost Red Dawn Rev.II cables in my system(Quad VA-One and Dynaudio Excite X14),courtesy of a friend who is in turn demo’ing some ungodly expensive upgrade...My reference are the Acoustic Zen Epoch..What these cables have brought to my system are:
The first thing I noticed is the music seems to come easier,ie:a touch louder than normal at low levels and it’s so clean I find I’m listening louder..
wider,deeper,and sharper defined imaging and staging...deeper,better defined and tonally richer bass...increased low level detail retrieval...a treble that is not as easy on the ears but seems better defined,almost sharp and I can see where some systems could move way to far into bright with these cables...
So I attribute the cleaner/sharper tone to the addition of high purity silver to the cable but I wonder what it is about the materials and construction that allow the bass,imaging and staging changes and especially the ease which music seems to come now?Any comments(from those who have found cables do matter)and NOT from those who believe they are snake oil PLEASE!!!
freediver

Showing 5 responses by ieales

@freediver If you want to know why, see https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/it-s-simple 

Your initial comments are entirely consistent with what one would expect from Acoustic Zen Epoch to a Nordost. The AZE have a poor PVC dielectric relative to the Nordost FEP. The AZE inductance is probably higher. The Proximity Effect will be radically different between the two geometries.

What I can’t wrap my head around, especially as an electrician, is how it’s possible for an electrical signal conductor to effectively change the regeneration of the signal between the amp and the speakers...
The signal is not 'between' the amp and speakers. The whole kit and caboodle is a system. The LRC of your amp, cable and speakers interact dynamically.

Do not be in a rush to choose.

@jmcgrogan2 +1, twice

@soix  Agreed an initial patina can wear off rapidly. Price has little to do with performance. Some components are very sensitive to cables and others are not. An inexpensive cable may function better for any given component depending on said component parameters.
@williewonka 
factors in cable performance is the "geometry" and "size" of the conductors
geometry trumps material
size affects resistance which is almost negligible

People, Electronics 101: Ohms Law : An amplifier / loudspeaker is a series circuit and the same current flows through all of the components.

Ergo the same current flows in both the plus and minus wire.

A wire configured differently for each leg may sound different but it sure ain't due to the signal contaminating the neutral.

Weird geometry will change the Proximity Effect and thus the cable eq.
@williewonka 
sorry you thought my post bombastic :-$ perhaps I get a bit carried away when fundamental laws are ignored.

the current (i.e. energy), or maybe even the voltage, in the neutral (i.e. minus) conductor cannot possibly be the same as the signal conductor.
It cannot be otherwise. As you state, energy cannot be created or destroyed. It changes state in the load.

The work is done by V pushing I through the load. If you measure a loudspeaker circuit, very little V is lost from either amplifier terminal to the speaker. Almost all V is across the load. Power is V x I. If the current were different in each leg of the cable, energy would either be gained or lost.

Apply a steady 1kHz 1V signal to a speaker. Regardless of where an ammeter is inserted in the circuit, the RMS current is the same.

In a DC circuit, V and I are in phase. In an AC circuit, V and I are not in phase if there is any L or C.  Cable LRC change the phase and relative amplitude in combination with amplifier and loudspeaker LRC.

Phase angle is dependent on the difference between L reactance XL and C reactance XC, which vary with frequency. In cables like zip cord XL & XC may vary by a factor of 100 to 1. Some exotic cables XL & XC may vary by a billion to 1. XL can vary by a factor of 10,000 and more between zip cord and exotic cables. Exotic cables should endeavor to have less inductance, but some are worse than zip cord.

Asymmetric cables have a different L & C relative to parallel or woven and as such affect the current phase differently. These phase changes may be euphonious with some amplifier / loudspeaker combinations, not so much with others.

Some put sugar in coffee and prefer the 'sweetened' result.

One cannot, in absolute terms, say it is better [more accurate].

One can only say it is more accurate if one compares the source wave form to the resulting sound at your ear!

@ethiessen1 
@jmcgrogan2 +1, squared.
1² = 1. Sorry, couldn't resist, but it illustrates some of the noise here that does not say anything.

Systems with no onboard tone controls in my experience, have seemed to be more responsive to cable changes than those with.
Absolutely! Many devices have the Tone Control in circuit all the time. Seldom are they flat. Stepped controls may be better if they use discrete matched parts. MidFi units may use stepped continuous pots and standard ±10% RC.

I use a passive control 0 to -22db in 1 ±0.05db steps of my own design. BTW, anybody thinking of buying a stepped passive, unless it is made for your system, the steps may not be even.

An advantage of a stepped external control is that it is not subject to the vagaries of component internal temperature. Continuous controls can vary audibly with temperature change and dual controls seldom track as well as high quality individual resistors. Throw in a balance control for good measure and it's never gonna be the same twice! Some device buffer gain, tone and balance controls, adding yet another three amplifier stages.

Digital controls can be very good if properly implemented.

FWIW, I note the reference step level on every disc so that if I evaluate another component I can match the level exactly. OK, < 0.5db.
Some might find this Cable Snake Oil Antidote interesting with respect to LRC, the signal and the system.

Cables affect the sound and the effect is system dependent.

Another's opinion on a cable in a vastly different system may not be valid.