CSPort vs TechDAS

Dear @chauncey  :  Mike is rigth with him and his targets when said: " overall i would not buy or buy a tt due to vacuum. more just the overall performance. "

In the other side the vacuum hold down TT characteristics is a important " plus " in any TT at any price level. We have to remember that at the micro levels where the cartridge stylus tip is working during play exist micro-warps that puts an additional not desired " coloration " to what we are listening. The vaccum helps a lot too in the LP parts recorded at high velocities helping the stylus tip to track with more applomb and pick up better MUSIC signal from those groove modulations. Vacuum due a lot more for the quality level performance of what we are listening . No, it's not true that the vacuum can be to much effect damping as Mike said because what any one of us in any room/system need is the best damping we can achieve precisely between the LP and the TT platter/mat because is the first step in the playback overall proccess where we need try to " stop " the present feedback between that platter/LP surface developed by the stylus tip tracking and other developed micro noise/vibration down there: NEVER is to much damping down there. What we need down there is that the cartridge cantilever movements came with only the movements developed by the groove modulations ( MUSIC signal ) where this is imposible to can happens. Vacuum permit lot lower " fake MUSIC " movements in the cantilever because those overall movements are what the cartridge/transducer transform and that transducer does not knows if all those cantilever movements are only MUSIC signal modulartions but proccess all movements as if all were MUSIC signal.

R.

@chauncey

this box set is very good, all analog reissue of 4 symphonies. very good sound. quiet pressings. worth finding. one of my frequent choices.

https://store.acousticsounds.com/d/126823/Herbert_von_Karajan-Brahms_The_Four_Symphonies-Vinyl_Box_Sets

yesterday this is the one i was listening to;

https://www.discogs.com/release/18626440-Johannes-Brahms-Concertgebouw-Orchestra-Amsterdam-Bernard-Haitink-Serenade-No-1

on the CS Port was a pleasure.

note that i am no classical expert, but a constant Lp classical consumer and lover. which the CS Port perfectly compliments.

@chauncey

for 8 years (2002--2011) i owned the Rockport Sirius III with vacuum hold down. very high level of execution. but it does add a level of complication to the design. fabulous turntable. i wish i still owned it.

i am neutral about the effect of vacuum; it does flatten warps, but the actual times when it helps are very few. it’s very rare when i notice a warp effect in my listening, and not had vacuum since 2011. and when i compared the Rockport to the NVS and other turntables i owned at that time i did not really hear much difference in that regard.

and it’s possible a record weight has advantages. and vacuum can be too much of a damping effect too.

overall i would not buy or buy a tt due to vacuum. more just the overall performance.

i do own a flattener, but have never used it.

@mikelavigne 

Have you ever had a turntable with vacuum hold down?  I'm worried my Sota table now has a vacuum hold down and I would miss getting that record perfectly flat held into place?  I assume at a micro level the air under the record and the pulling down of the record varies with the pump action?  I guess the same could be true of the air holding up the platter.

Dear @chauncey  : By design seems to me that the Premium S is a little superior to the CS Port and real measurements confirm it where the speed stability of the PS is really superior that the CS Port. Both units use a quarz oscelator on its motot ps better implemented in the TecgDAS.

@sksos  posted: " is a far more neutral sound .. ". I respect his opinion but almost has not a good foundation and not only because the measurements says can't be that way but because the resonance frequency between the MSL Platinum and the Safir tonearm ( that's the combination he shows in his virtual system. ) is to low at 5hz and we have to remember that the Safir is a four point unipivoted design.

This is the review and true/real measurements not did it by TechDas as the CS Port manufacturer specs but measurements by a third " hand " and this speaks a lot about that comparison between TTs. The other issue is that the TecgDAS is the Premium model where the Premium S is even better:

TechDAS Air Force III Premium Turntable | Hi-Fi News (hifinews.com)

Btw, servo in TT if it's well designed and with good quality excecution never is a problem with the sound we listen through it and we have to remember that all the cutting machines in the recording proccess comes with DD motors and all those motors control its speed by servo. That means that if we can't be aware of the recording used servo then it's no trouble at all. In several TTs the servo is only one characteristic of several other more important parts/characteristics in the TT designs: quality level in the excecution design could be the name of the game down there. Just my opinion but as with sksos y heavily respect the @mikelavigne  opinion about.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,

R.

@mikelavigne 

Thank you Mike.  Yes your system was one of the reason's I'm leaning toward CSPort.  Any Brahms album recommendations?  I don't have a lot of classical!  

not owned any Techdas turntables, but they are certainly fine products. heard them at shows. i have owned the CS Port LFT1 now for almost 5 years and to my ears prefer it’s music making presentation to the Techdas. greater ease and less of a mechanical sense. the music seems to be more embracing and have greater emotive content. the CS Port does not use any servo feedback for it’s speed control. which is part of that difference in presentation.

listening to some Brahms right now on the CS Port with a smile on my face, and my body relaxed into the music.

i hear these attributes not only on my LFT1, but also on the TAT1 when i’ve heard it. the 'zen' look and feel of the CS Port does not hurt. beautiful pieces.

there are no bad choices in the turntables you are considering. good luck.

@mijostyn you are right that a good table "should" not have a sound but I can confirm, without a doubt, that the CS Port TAT1M2 is a far more neutral sound that let’s the music just flow with more detail and better dynamics than the Kuzma Stabi R it replaced. Both tables were/are on a Vibraplane of course. I can’t say anything about the OP question regarding any differences between CSPort vs TechDAS, TAT1M2 vs AF3PS since I’ve not heard them in "my system".

(Dealer disclaimer)

@chauncey , good turntables do not sound or rather, they have no sound. If you want to spend that much money on a turntable look at the Dohmann Helix 1 or 2.

Dohmann also keeps in stock the arms he feels are well designed and match his table and will mount on for you.