Classical Music for Aficionados
I dont understand why it is your "hate" that must dictate my musical choices HERE in this thread...This is my reality: a musical thread about different cultures... Now, not only you speak your mind but you want to bully people... i dont think i am the only one who love music from Russia HERE or any other countries you may decide you dont like.....By the way i listen music from China too.... One thing is sure, i despise censorship and propaganda of any kind... If you dont like my musical choices stay where you are yourself... Are you a concious being? Accusing others is not my way of communication and bullying them either... You are NOTHING more than me HERE... You dont have to decide where i will go...Nor deciding like some policeman who will say what or who will be silent about ANY composers from any country... Is it clearer? Banning Rachmaninov or Stravinsky is not a solution to political problem or a solution to war especially in a musical thread... But i am stupid to speak to you it seems about common sense... BUT I DONT ACCEPT TO BE BULLIED.... But i am a democrat: take a referendum and i will go out of this thread if the majority of contributors here are formed in the same mold as you , and if they all want to ban Russia from musical history...If not, you MUST go out yourself if you are a man of your words...
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This is my last discovery... Very surprising synthesis of orient and occident cultural trends.. This composer Tan Dun is very gifted because he integrated, china and classical european musical influence with Nature and musical discourse exploration... I am very glad and enthusiastic about this quatuor... No "deja vu" here.... He present his work and after near 7 minutes it begins....
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Right after the Orange Revolution (2005) in Ukraine, I arrived in Odessa along the Black Sea. I stayed for three weeks with a girlfriend. I saw the Ukrainian State Ballet perform Giselle and Sleeping Beauty. The beautiful thing was that they used a sizable pit orchestra rather than recorded music to accompany the ballet. I also saw a variety show featuring different classical pianists along with a female Bandura ensemble at the Philharmonic Hall. There is great pride in Ukrainian culture and it is very upsetting to see what is happening. No longer being in contact with friends and loved ones is very difficult. However, Dimitri Shostakovich has nothing to do with Vladimir Putin or the Russian invasion, so I opt to listen to Russian music as an act of defiance if nothing else. If there is a contemporary Russian composer who sides politically with Vladimir Putin, then I will refuse to listen to that composers work. |
Americans seem to think that history starts when they arrive, or become aware of, or have some interest in an area of the world. As I have said before, there are no good guys in Eastern Europe. Stalin created a man-made famine in the early 30's that killed around 6 million in Ukraine. I can see why there is no love lost there. In the early part of the invasion by Hitler, the folks in Ukraine greeted the Nazi as heroes / liberators. Helped in the round-up of the Jews. Even the SS complained about their brutality being 'messy'. Ukrainians provided a significant percentage of guards at Nazi concentration / death camps. Goggle "John Demjanjuk". Quite a few Ukrainians were captured fighting for the Germans in Normandy during D-Day. My point is, things are complicated. Americans don't like complicated or shades of gray. We like everything in Black and white. Of course it's always good to see the Russians getting their rear ends kicked. Again, Ain't no good guys in eastern Europe. Certainly no one worth the life of even one American solider.
Cheers
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On the opposite i like discussion...but you never answer to my musical choices post... you wanted to BULLY me and BAN my posts...And bully everyone who are not a fanatic... But we cannot discuss with someone who throw one sentence insinuations , for example: pacifism as synonym to be a traitor... Then truth is the opposite of what you say , it is you who insinuate or bully in one line sentence instead of discussing...Anyway stupid assertion like the ban of an entire culture cannot be discussed rationally for sure...Then insinuations are your tool... And here it is a MUSICAL thread...Like i said ask others people and if they think like you two about me and Russian composers i will be glad to go out DEFINITIVELY of this thread... But speaking is easier than walking the words...Insinuating easier than speaking rationally... Then i will correct YOU.. SOMEONE HERE DONT LIKE TO BE BULLY...for the stupidest reason especially... The nusic of Scriabin or Feinberg has nothing to do with this war at all... Any children can understand that... Why not you? Dont answer, any mature mind can also know why.... I am polite and i like to discuss but bully me and i will answer...
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@mahgister I certainly do not insinuate I tell it as it is and if that is in one sentence then that is the way I am so please do not chide me for that. I do not partake in your musical contributions because I do not like You Tube clips because the quality is awful and also because some of the people the people you choose to highlight are not the type of people I care to listen to and if I did respond you would then be saying that I am getting at you for listing it. So be aware I list the truth as I see it and if you do not like it then as they say over here in Scotland "That's tough" |
Dont put the pathetic claim you wrote what you wrote because you dont listen youtube here where you haunted all youtube suggestions and comment them ... Dont put excuse and pretense in the place of apology and dont claim to the " truth" for yourself and everyone ... And dont excuse yourself or someone like the other Jim about an act which is irrational like bannning Russian music and promoting hate ... "so be aware i list the truth as i see it and if you dont like it then as they say in Quebec "that’s EASY"....Swallow it... No more comment...
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Because we need peace and reason, and not hate or propaganda... I will suggest an interesting piece of choral music... He was the first Russian composer appointed to the Tsar court in 1779 for music after studying in Italia... His music is an ocean of grace and novelty , a perfect cross between italian splendour and Orthodox interiority.... I put the version here i like the most:
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I am glad that you agree with me about peace and reason which are the most necessary things we must wish for... I will agree totally with your observation about GREED and will add thirst for power to the mix ... I accept what you say with your words that nobody tried to bully me... I cannot apologize for Russian music links though because i love Russian music and culture like i love Charles Ives the contemporary of Scriabin... This was my first post above, about these two contemporary geniuses which are expression of pure freedom in their two musical journey, before this "malentendu".... Charles Ives the american and Scriabin the Russian were brothers who dont know oner another separated by an ocean, but their art exploring the frontier between tonal/atonal among other common factors was their common endeavour... I wish you the best....
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I love Russian music but most of it was written in terrible times and made little to the culture of Russia . Out of 350 millions in US perhaps 2 % even know Ives's name . I like music because it lifts me , Bach made me a different man but did nothing to stop Hitler even though he got only 28% vote in Berlin . The same is close to here , very close .
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You are right about that, because geniuses are the one that pointed to the direction of love and freedom...it takes time but i am optimist even now in desesperate times... my best to you....
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The ears /brain know not much about music, the heart/body know more... Music is a social integration of all individuals in some rythmic union with Nature... Language comes from music in this sense... Furtwangler know that because his direction infaillibly express this eternal TEMPO flying over all smaller one beat in any musical work he ever directed... Alain Connes Fields medal in mathematics just registered a sequence of the imprevisible beat of the creation manifested through the prime numbers distributions... Time obey music not the reverse...Connes say studying Hilbert spaces that the source of an irrepressible flows of variations and novelty richer than time and at the source of time is this UNIVERSAL potential BEAT related to the prime distribution... Why do you think american Indian and pygmys dance to call for the rain? Superstition or higher consciousness ? Guess what is the right answer... 😁😊 Furtwangler music call for the soul like some call for the rain, it is the same UNIVERSAL beat for the rain and the soul......
«My soul flow with the rain»-Anonymus poet «There is only one beat for love and it is the right one each time »-Anonymus poet «Musical discourse is infallible all around the earth, be it european or a pygmies dance , because music is God speak at the origin of language itself» -Anonymus poet
Thanks to the work in non commutative geometry of alain Connes we can guess now how music and numbers can be related to God spoken language... thanks to pygmies or Furtwangler we can feel it without studying mathematics... 😁😊
the relation between these 2 extreme apparent different musical expression is this: TIME OBEY MUSIC not the reverse... In any music feel the universal tempo behind all beats...It is God spoken words... Music is about cosmos secret not about taste... Our various tastes are like the various religions only a road to the same peak experience: love and unity... |
When the beat circle and progress at the same time it is a SPIRALLING ENCOMPASSING movement... An increasing irrepressible beat and pulse growing which command time itself... Life is this increasing pulse... it is the reason why time obey music and music dont obey time but command it... We can listen to it in one of the most powerful piece of music ever written OR like in the pygmies songs...Or like in the yoruba talking drums under this post... Music is not sound but what is behind sound: Life asciension itself....
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This same spiralling moving beat is for me the life of jazz too... Musical genres matter less than the way this flowing oceanic tempo command even time... This is what i listen too...Not mere sound... This beating heart is the origin of music and time and life itself and even of numbers primes distribution... |
For Alain Connes and for Roger Penrose too the distribution of prime numbers express a musical universal memory beat that comes from BEFORE this universe and INFORM it... We reincarnated probably to add something new to "the music score"...Pygmies and Yoruba drummers get it more easily than us thats all...They have not waited for geometer like Connes to teach them... 😁😊 And the first humans creating language too... Furtwangler never directed symphonies with an EXTERNAL beat but with an INTERNAL pulse emerging with the music itself... Valery Gergiev explain it well... «Valery Gergiev: The most difficult thing in conducting is to avoid a mechanical beat. This endless search for a true tempo, the right tempo for every bar of music, and not just a single tempo for the whole movement, is something few conductors ever master. Few leaders will recognize, perhaps, that it is something difficult for them, but they will try to do it and compete with Furtwängler, and most likely they will fail.» This also explain why some jazz musicians are so great, like the youruba drummers, they are not handicapped by the burden of INTERPRETATING with the right beat written music and more easily access to this spontaneous spiralling waves expressed in pygmies songs or Amerindian or Indian drummers...Spiralling waves of the cosmic primes or divine heart itself...
By the way Connes admitted he was inspired by palindromic rythm studies of Olivier Messiaen and discovered a relation between palindromic beats and some non commutative operators in Hilbert Space that described genesis of time itself... This is why MUSIC COMMAND TIME not the reverse...... I will stop here... i hope to have convinced some that music is not about our taste only and is not only a hobby but a key to the heart and to the cosmos.... My best to all
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i cannot resist to post that...
«Furtwängler has always been Bruckner’s great protagonist. In 1942, the Telefunken firm persuaded Furtwängler to experiment with improvements in recording technique. Having consented, he opted for the famous Adagio from the 7th symphony, and later for Gluck’s Alceste Overture, in order to verify, as he said himself, whether the microphones were capable of restoring the breadth of his orchestra, and particularly the famous double basses of Berlin. The results were amazing. This interpretation of Bruckner by Furtwängler is the slowest and yet the most sustained with its striking tension. Once again the tragic element and the grandeur of the speech are unmatched. It is indeed a recording for a desert island, happily restored to the delight of music lovers everywhere, to be kept and cherished for a lifetime. Ironically, its tragic grandeur did not deter the Nazis from playing this recording on Radio Berlin to announce Hitler’s death, long after Furtwängler had fled Germany. Suffice it to say simply that no man, however great, or a fortiori vile, is worthy of the dimensions of this work.»
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But because this universal internal beat and rythm precede TIME itself it can accomadate many manifestation at the same time... Compare the adagio version from Furtwangler to the Celibidache version...The Bohm version and the Giulini version also...Karajan,Wand and some others... it is impossible to choose really...There is many different roads that come from the same peak and go back to it....
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Celibidache always made me see things with his tempos of his mighty Munich men, .This great Brahm’s made me jump out of my chair , as good as any music I ever heard ! All the greatness that Brahms alone used was there in all his glory .
The use of Harmony devlop, minor 3rd.7minor balance, dotted semi-quarter16, the melodic 3 note idea.And on and on to heaven . |
My favorite piano concerto is his second... 😁😊 And his requiem is so great ... His vocal compostion mastery is equal to Schubert... I cannot contradict you about Brahms.. When i listen to him he appear like you say no doubt...
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Lately I’ve been cruising Idagio and have just randomly pressed the play button for composer Paul Wranitzky, a contemporary of both Beethoven and Mozart. His Symphony Opus 31, "La Paix", is currently streaming my way. It’s bright, happy, tuneful, and beautifully recorded, I don’t know about you guys, but streaming has gained me entrance into Aladdin’s cave. See you on the flip side, if streams do indeed have flip sides. |
