Can I expect to pay full retail for a new system?

Audio dealers are desparate to make a sale, any sale. Walk away by saying, "gee all I have right now is..." Leave the guy your phone #, you'll get a call in one week/less. "Oh I've gota deal for you on that amp you wanted"
If the amp/speakers are say 2K, bid $1500. He'll end up meeting you half way. Trust me they want your money.
Now if its a product I know i wany and will keep for yrs and yrs, like a amp and speaker i have plans for, I'll pay asking price, abit below.

Steve - that's too bad about your experience. The Tall One has a dry sense of humor, but I don't think it's so dry that you wouldn't be able to tell humor from serious ragging on your equipment. I've had limited expereince with the 2 stores in Southern NH, nothing bad. Your experience is ludicrous to the point of being very funny. It was worth the experince just for the story you can tell now!!
The worst store IMHO is the snooty store in Frmaingham. They have some good stuff (Maggie, Ayre,etc), and some very good policies, but their attitude stinks - high pressure, just move a lot of very expensive boxes, and if the customer questions the owner's judgement, just yell louder.

are you talking about natural sound, my experiences have been much different

Draw - yes. Like I said, there are good things about the store, and some of the people seem ok, but I have also seen a lot of bad attitude.

As I dealer this is a discussion which I hold dear.

I love the person saying you should get a 60% discount, NOT!

The answear to your question should be not how much discount your are or are not entitled to but what is this industry about! High end audio is not about buying a "used" car or going to Best buy and buying a $100 DVD burner.

A good dealer will provide a room or rooms or equipment for you to listen to. A good dealer will help educate you to what sounds good and what you will enjoy. A good dealer will set up your gear or will help you to do it yourself.

For that service a dealer is entitled to make a profit.

We go into business because we love the industry, but we all have to stay in business. I have spend $450,000.00 in demo equipment and that is for only 3 rooms! I have two trucks and a $1,000,000.00 liability policy to protect my clients.

If I don't make money how can I afford to pay for my mortgage, and buy food, and advertise and afford to live.

High end audio is a business! I want to sell equipment and provide outstanding service but I need to make a living!

I would love to see if the tables were reversed and your boss if you have one says that your time is worth an arbitrary lower amount, how would you feel.

A 10% discount is a fair amount to give off as a compromise to your clients, if the dealer is doing a great job then even, gulp, paying full retail is not a weird or outragous transgression.

I have routinly installed big systems for free, done deliveries for free and brought components to customers houses for free, if the customer is worth it and the dealer is offering great service then both parties are doing the right thing!

People on Audiogon need to realize that a good and carring dealer is what this is supposed to be about.

As per the post of the dealer trying to sell a $10,000.00 speaker cable to a guy owning $2,000.00 speakers, this is a golden example of a scumbag dealer doing what is good for him, not you! It is transparent and obvious. Shoot the bastard. I got into my own business to serve my clients and make a living. There are many passionate dealers who will give you great service, they need to be supported and they deserve to make a living and put food on their tables and live in houses and drive cars too!

Buying audio should be like anything else in life, it should be fun and pleasurealbe and ammicable for all! Having a dealer not make money is not fair and not aimicable. This is a very expensive type of business if you are a real dealer!

Live and let live, and have fun!