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Can anyone hear the difference when you add REL subwoofers when playing two channel

I wonder if anyone else has had problems hearing a difference when adding REL subwoofers to their two channel systems?  I have gone back to a reputable dealer in town to listen to a pair of Vienna Acoustic Mozart's paired with a REL S3 and I couldn't detect a difference when they added and subtracted the REL.  I wonder if this was because the Vienna Acoustic Mozart's are already can extend down to 30 Hz.  I have also read reviews on the Mozart's and they said one of their criticisms was they felt the Mozart's to be too boomy in the bass.  

The dealer keeps telling me I am expecting to hear a more punchy pounding bass sound and that is not what I should be listening to.  He keeps saying I should be listening for greater depth and space to create a larger sound stage.  He went on to say if I had a subwoofer that delivered too much bass, they would eventually drive me out of the room and spoil my enjoyment of listening to music.  I thought I had sensitive ears to sound, but in this case I wonder if I am tone deaf.  My fear is getting a pair of T/9i's in my home and my wife telling me I wasted our money because she could not hear a difference. 

There must be a reason why so many dealers have told me their first pick would be a REL because they are so musical.

I also question why REL manufactures their subs with such low wattage?  For example, their S3 delivers only 400 watts and their T/9i's deliver just 300 watts.  When comparing them to  subwoofers like JL, which deliver 750 watts to $1500 watts, maybe REL subwoofers are just too wimpy.
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Showing 3 responses by erik_squires

erik_squires
15,803 posts
 
I was not bashing REL. All I can say I just could not hear much of a difference when adding a REL to the mix. I was expecting to go wow when I heard the REL, but they sure didn't immediately think they were worth the money. If you can't hear a difference, why waste the money.



This is a great attitude, but I do want to say this: There are many great subs that when well integrated will knock your knickers off.  From everything you have described, these subs were not well integrated/
erik_squires
15,803 posts
 
See my post which is directly related:
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/kal-on-sub-integration-and-antimode
erik_squires
15,803 posts
 
Kind of agree with the dealer, but it also sounds like the subs aren’t well integrated. I mean, no, you should not be getting chest thumps, but well done, subs are GLORIOUS!! The effects he feels you should be getting you aren’t.

If you can’t hear a difference, it’s not worth money to you, then don’t buy it. :)
To integrate a sub well into most spaces you need a pair of bass traps and DSP EQ.

Without this, you are forced to cut corners, and often that means leaving the sub at too low a level to really do it’s thing. Turn it up, and the room modes wake up and destroy the sound.

The thing JL does better than almost any sub maker is the DSP/ room correction. This lets them contribute more, and go deeper.  Often a "Musical" sub means it can't go deep, so the dragons stay slumbering.

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