Building my 'first' system - Advice on Phono preamp please


Hi all,

I'm in the process of building out my first proper 2-channel system. I'm now looking to build a good analog front end.

Question:
What should I spend on a phono preamp?

My thought process:
a) Schiit mani for now, then upgrade later
b) Used Pro-ject Tube Boxc) New Space-Tech-Labs phono preamp (I live close to store)

Current Setup:
Speakers: Nola Boxer 3
Integrated Amp: Tsakiridis Aeolos
Dac: Schiit Bifrost 2
Streamer: Allo digi One signstureTurntable: Rega Planar 2 (2m blue cartridge)
Cables: Audioquest Golden Gate



dynamic_driven

Showing 4 responses by millercarbon

This might be a little steep, but considering what you have might be a pretty good fit- Decware ZP3 https://www.decware.com/newsite/ZP3.htm  Not a lot of gain but should be fine with your MM Blue at 5.5mV output. 

Couple nice things about the ZP3- it is triode, so rich and captivating presentation. Should be a nice combination with your integrated amp. Decware only sell direct. Retail margins are typically around 60% so companies like Tekton and Decware selling direct typically get you at least twice the quality for your money compared to retail distribution. Decware comes with a lifetime warranty to the original purchaser. 

The main downside is they are around 3 months out. oldhvymec just got one, or should be getting it very soon, his order time was around 2-3 months.   

Unlike most other companies Decware has a sort of modular philosophy or approach. Instead of building a phono stage with a lot of gain and MC/MM inputs they build what is basically a MM phono stage and then have their own optional step up transformers to allow you to select the right one should you upgrade to MC at some point. Check them out, they are very interesting design and come with the same lifetime warranty plus an exchange program making it easy and affordable to change should you go to MC with different output levels. 

This is another way you get more for your money, not paying for RCA connectors, wiring and circuits you won't use. Haven't heard one yet, don't expect it will be in the league of Herron but all things considered bet it is a lot of bang for the buck. Like I said oldhvymec should be getting one soon so won't have long to wait if you want feedback from him. He is the guy who turned me onto Decware in the first place, so will be good to hear what he thinks. 
Been a while since I did that, technology seems to have elevated what can be achieved at a low price. But back then the differences were staggering staggering. Some very well regarded ones like Lehman Black Cube were awful. Even EAR 834P was awfully colored. Some of the much more expensive ones weren't all that much better. As it turned out even the ARC was colored, it just took 16 years and a Herron VTPH2A to reveal this. It was so much better than anything else I tried, it was by comparison very neutral!

The phono stage when you think about it has the hardest job of anything in all of audio. Because of RIAA it amplifies absolute minimum 20dB, more than just about any power amplifier. And it does this starting with the smallest weakest signal in all of audio, measured not in volts but millivolts- in many cases fractions of a millivolt! So really it is 45-65dB. Then it also has to perform equalization to a precision far greater than any room EQ ever done anywhere. Finally, because the input is so weak it has to accomplish all this with incredible attention to noise, shielding, grounding, and vibration control.

No surprise then I guess it really pays to stretch to buy as good a one as you can possibly afford.
I did NOT want to spend $2500 on a phono stage. And remember this was back in 1995 or thereabouts, back when $2500 was real money! I tried Lehman Black Cube, EAR 834P, on and on, at least 8-10 different phono stages- all home auditioned. Several months if not a year of this until finally broke down and tried the ARC. Thus I learned in one fell swoop both just how critically important a phono stage is, and how unimportant and misguided it is to give the common advice of having all components around the same level of cost/performance. 
Two similar but somewhat different approaches. Right now you and everyone else is on the approach of the common wisdom (aka stuck in a rut, running a treadmill, etc) approach of finding a phono stage that is about as good in price or performance as the rest of your system. Perfectly natural if misplaced assumption approach.  

This approach only works if you are contemplating a static system, one where seldom if ever will anything be upgraded. One and done, run it till it don't run no more. In that case follow their advice. Might as well. Won't matter much either way.

The other approach is if you plan on gradually over time upgrading one thing after another. It can be very slow and gradual so it takes years to do the whole system. Still this merits a considerably different approach.  

In the first you can buy any of the mid level things recommended above. In the second you might want to stretch a bit for something quite a bit above average. Phono stages, turntables, analog in general is a completely different animal than digital. A good phono stage can last you many many years. It did me. The ARC PH3SE lasted me 16 years through multiple CDP, amps, even turntables, arms and cartridges. When new it cost more than my speakers. For years it was the most expensive component in my system. But that whole system grew up around it, so by the time it was replaced with a Herron it was a completely different system.

Little bit more strategic planning than you were expecting, I bet. But there it is.