Bowers & Wilkins - B&W

Blackmsport, Elizabeth is spot on. I think over the years I've put together an enjoyable system, but I haven't bought anything brand new at a hi-end audio store.

My concern about buying from hi-end audio stores is that they try to sell what they have or the brands they are authorized to sell. So the problem is, IMO, that if you are looking for a particular model and your favorite audio store doesn't carry it, what are you going to do; what do you think the store is going to try and sell you??

Suppose after doing research and/or listening to a couple of models at friends' houses, you've narrowed your choices down to two models, but your favoriate audio store only carries one model, how are you going to A/B the two models you're interested in??

OK . . . another problem I have is spending hours of time in a store listening to equipment. On principle, it's really a great way to listen to equipment. My concern is that if I spend a lot of time in a store, I feel uncomfortable because I've taken up a salesperson's time, I've picked their brains, and if their product is carried by other stores that are willing to discount, I might be compelled to buy for price.

So, given my personal buying biases, I read as much as I can on line and in places like A'gon. Then, as Elizabeth says, I'll buy a equipment used, generally on A'gon. As I said before on other posts, I'm pretty careful about what I buy and who I buy it from. So far, I've been lucky.

A real advantage of buying used is that if your dealing in top end equipment, there's generally a good resale market. So, in the case of preamps, I bought and sold 3 pre amps before I settled on my current model. In the case of my amp, I flipped only one model before settling on what I have now. Did I take a hit on the flips?? Yes . . . but not that much.

One other variation is that I will also buy either dealer or factory demos. My current line stage is a demo from a hi-end audio store. I paid $5800 for the unit 2 years ago. Guess what -- I can sell it on A'gon for the same money today. My amp is a factory demo unit that was refurbished and sold as new. I bought the amp about two years ago and it works great, and I can sell it for maybe $500 less than I paid for it. Not too shabby.

And finally, I agree with Elizabeth that I don't consider a 10 to 15% discount a deal. But if I buy used, maybe I'm one model back from what is ccurrently the top model, so what. I bought my stuff for 40% less than MSRP retail.

FWIW -- good luck in whatever you decide.

Magfan, I hear ya and I appreciate what you're saying. That's why in my post above, at least I'm honorable enough NOT to be a schnorer and have the chutzpadic to take up the valuable time of an audio salesperson and then go elsewhere to buy for price.

I am also sympathetic about the tough marketplace, especially when equipment as a stand-alone item is fungible. Let's face it, an ARC Ref 5 is the same Ref 5 regardless of where you buy it. However, as you said, and I agree, a good store supports their customers. And part and parcel is the service and advice.

Unfortunately, I have Cadillac tastes but can't afford the latest and newest best stuff coming out. For example, all of my electronic gear is late model ARC, from Phono Pre to amp. The stuff sounds great! Believe me, if I could, I would love it if I could swap out my current stuff and drop in a Ref 5, Ref Phono 2 and new Ref 150.

So . . . what I do, as I said above, is pick the pre owned and demos of the next to most recent top of the line models, like the Ref 3, PH-7 Phono Pre, CD-7 Ref CDP, and so forth. Through careful shopping, I estimate that I'm able to source my gear for about 40% off original list.

In short, the gear sounds great. And, because it's high quality stuff, so far I've been very lucky as far as reliability and sonic performance. Well, at least I have a method to my madeness.

BTW, sorry to wax philosophical, but IMHO, people who buy like me DO support high end RETAIL audio stores. Think about it -- because of people who share my buying appraoch, there is an active secondary market for used equipment. Heck, I've bought and sold 3 preamp before settling on my Ref 3. I was only able to do that because of on line forums like A'gon.

The same applies to retail. If I was inclined to pay retail or maybe retail, minus 10%, I personally would be incentivized to take the leap knowing that if I wanted to bail and move up to something else, there's a secondary market created and supported by people like me to help that retail customer effect the next sale. So, both the customer and the high end audio store benefit.

My 2 cents worth.