I think I was thrown by the connector (looked different from the one in the Stereophile pic which looked larger) and also because of the 2 pin to barrel cable (which I was going to use on the CD2) because it didn't look thicker (from memory) than the original.
The 2 pin to 2 pin definitely looked thicker. |
My VB Ref cable as well as the ones I've seen at a local dealer all have black colored outer braids, but are noticeably a bit larger in diameter than the standard power cables. The improvement in sound that they make is quite obvious to experienced listeners and I believe well worth their cost. Please let us know your thoughts once you've had a chance to hear them after allowing for some break-in time. |
Just picked up the VB Ref cables for my DAC3.5VB II and the CD2. But am currently away from home so couldn't test them.
When I opened the package, I was a little thrown because the cables don't look at all like the ones in the Stereophile CES 2011 photo (silver braid). Mine were grey/black like the original.
Can't wait to hear the combo in my main system now that I have the MkII upgrade. |
Thanks again Bill. Received my rma from Matt and my 3.5 is on its way. Can't wait to hear the mkii upgrade. |
Thanks Bill, I still haven't heard from anyone. |
I received an RMA within a day after submitting a request on their website. I'd suggest sending an email to Matt bringing your request to his attention. Matt's email address is: mcramer {at} belcantodesign.com . Hope that this helps! |
So, how long did it take to get an RMA number from Bel Canto? I requested
an RMA for the upgrade more than a week ago and I am still waiting. |
I ordered the VB Ref for the CD2 and the DAC3.5VBII ;)
I'll have to wait for the cables. |
Yes, the VB Ref cable goes between the VBS and the DAC3.5VB in place of the standard power supply cable. The VB Ref cable is clearly identified on the heat shrink and is thicker than the standard cable. In the Stereophile review they stated that it made a more significant difference than the different digital cables they tried. I agree with your assessment of the Mk. II upgrade, it makes an already great DAC truly spectacular as it is now so musically effortless and much more engaging! |
What does the VB Ref cable look like?
Is it between the VBS and the DAC? Damn.
I just did the MkII upgrade and it's spectacular. |
I wouldn't say that the soundstage gets bigger, but more well defined with a better sense of space around all of the individual instruments. With the upgrade there is a new level of purity/clarity to the sound that is quite apparent, with an even better sense of each instrument's natural harmonic decay. |
Thanks Bill. Sounds like a better upgrade than the Ref VB power cord upgrade
for the same cost. I can't imagine the sound stage getting any bigger. It is
already huge. I am very excited to get both. |
Turnaround time for my upgrade was a couple of weeks, but I would expect that to vary with their number of commitments at any given time. I had it powered up and running for about a week before any critical listening was done so I can't really comment on changes during break in time. I find the DAC to be much more emotionally engaging and musical with the upgrade, so I would say their description of the changes were accurate. As always, YMMV. |
Thanks for the update Bill. I am excited about this upgrade. So, what was the
turnaround time for your upgrade? Also, how about run in time? Do you
find the upgrade more musical and engaging as described? Of course full
run in will be required before this aspect will be apparent. |
If I had to find one word to best describe the differences that the Mk.II upgrade of the BC DAC3.5VB has made in my system's overall performance it would have to be "stunning".
Well engineered recordings now exhibit an effortless realism that I find very rarely achieved. On acoustic recordings the reproduction of individual instruments are beautifully rendered with a much better sense of the acoustic space around and between the instruments. This greatly increases the realism of the musical performance, as it transcends the typical hi-fi sound and is now much more realistically portrayed.
I can further say that from a return on investment perspective this upgrade's sonic improvements far exceed the $500 charged for it, and I commend Bel Canto for making the upgrade available to its existing customers rather than only incorporating it into a newer model. |
The price of the Ref DAC Control System was raised accordingly once they began to package the VB Ref cable with it, I did not mean to imply otherwise and apologize for any confusion. I expect to post my impressions of the Mk. II upgrade later today. |
Thanks a million Bill. Valuable info. Wish I could find a used VB Ref cable. I hate to pay retail when latter down the road they offer the upgrade for the same
price. They now do this with the ST fiber light link. I am going to have to get
one. As for the MK II upgrade, more engaging, musical and communicative sound is exactly what I am been try to achieve with the 3.5vb. I will have to
upgrade this summer when I do much less listening.
Thanks again and let us know your impressions of the MK II once you have it
fulling run in. |
Glad to help, Scott. I do have the VB Ref cable and was very surprised at the significant improvement it made over the standard cable. It certainly does not sacrifice musicality, but just makes an across the board improvement. I now see that BC includes it in the Ref DAC Control System package when it used to be an optional upgrade.
I haven't yet heard the Mk.II upgrade so I can't comment on how the two options compare, but here's a quote from the BC product announcement at CES: John Stronczer is always thinking how he can make things better. The DAC 3.5VB MK II upgrade delivers an improved analog supply that better isolates the PCM1792 DAC and a new low-phase-noise main clock oscillator. These changes reduce the already extremely low noise of the DAC3.5VB delivering a more engaging, musical and communicative sound. John enthuses, Weve taken the DAC3.5VB to the next level of performance! |
Thanks Bill.
Say, do you have the REF VB Cable?
The big question is, which is better. The REF VB Cable
or the mk2 upgrade. They both cost the same. I am sure they additive. However, my main concern is musicality. If I have to sacrifice musicality to get better sound staging, then I do not want it. For my system a Synergistic Research Hologram D with a Galileo MPC was the ticket to get this dac to sing.
Now it is much more fluid with no digital glare. The hang time of decay trials
are like nothing I have ever heard before.
|
The Mk.II upgrade of the BC DAC3.5VB is $500 from any authorized dealer in the US, and is performed at the factory in MN. |
So, can you give us a cost of the mk2 upgrade? |
Chrissain, can you tell us if there is any difference in the
tonal balance. Thinner vs. fuller in pitch. Also, are you
using the upgraded cable between the two? |
bill, I hear greater clarity into the soundstage, a lower noise floor, and an even bigger 3d imaging . I am very happy with the upgrade, happy listening, Chris |
Chrissain - you're a step ahead of me as my DAC3.5 VBS is currently at BC getting the Mk II upgrade. I would greatly appreciate your more detailed thoughts on the type of improvements that the upgrade makes and how significant they are to the DAC's overall performance. I'm glad to hear that you're so pleased with the upgrade and thanks in advance for your time and input! |
I upgraded my bel canto dac 3.5 vbs to the mk 2 status. The wizards at bel canto just keep making an already good product better and better ! great job Bel Canto! |
Just was informed that there is a new upgrade for the power supply in the dac 3.5 . I am not that informed on what the upgrade actually is but I am going to get it and report back on any differences, stay tuned ! |
Anyone care to share their experiences with the dac3.5 and the light link?
I am in the market, but wish i could compare the Halide bridge. |
update, Recently at a friends house he had a shootout between the Belcanto dac3.5 vbs vs The Wies dac 202 and the DCS debussy, long story short, the belcanto bettered both dacs, and in some ways , by quite a bit. considering the Bel canto is the cheaper of the bunch, that says alot about the Bel canto. |
From what I can gather, the DAC 3.5vb betters the DAC3 in terms of clarity, resolution, and dynamics (better bass and treble). The computer interface -digital light link - is also significantly better than the DAC3's usb interface. I have read several user reviews that puts the DAC3's performance the equal of the DAC 2.5. I read one report that states the DAC 3.5s performance is on the same level as the Berkeley Alpha DAC but with a lower noise floor. Check out the following review from Inner Ear by a reviewer who had the DAC3. He considers the DAC 3.5 to be better. http://www.inner-magazines.com/news/250/63/BelCanto-DAC3-5VB/ |
Perhaps there is some other Dac3.5vbs owners out there that
can enlighten us on the sonic differences between the
Dac3vbs vs the Dac3.5vbs. Is it mainly more bass that
separates the two sonically? |
Chrissain, now that your 3.5 is fully run in,
care to give any final impressions and comparisons
to the dac3/vbs1? |
Firmware is upgradeable by a dealer that has access to the Bel Canto programming board and software.
For the CD2, I don't think you'd see any benefit replacing the original power supply with the LNS1. Now the VBS1, that's a different story. |
I use my BC CD2 as a transport through aes/ebu connection to a ARC DAC8, does anybody know if there is any advantage replacing the original power supply with the LNS1? |
@Chrissain,
Are you referring to CD 2 firmware?
Is the software user's upgradable?
Do you know what the features of the new firmware are? |
I talked to belcanto and they said that they are about to come out with a new software upgrade, probably next month. |
Could you please tell me which is the latest Bel Canto CD2 Firmware? |
So I have been breaking in my dac 3.5 and I could not be happier, It sounded good right out of the box, bigger soundstage and better separation, cant wait to hear what it sounds like after a couple hundred hours !!!! John said they use caddock resisters that take a while to break in , we shall see !! |
Hi scott, I am located in MPLS MN, the home town of Bel Canto, SO turn around time for me was very fast, I am not sure how long it would take elsewhere, good luck ,chris |
Thanks for your input Chrissain.
So, what is the wait time going to be
for your upgrade? I do a lot more listening
in the fall and all the way into spring.
I would hate to part with my Dac for too long. |
I read the same review , and am puzzled by it, it not been my experience at all. I have compared the stock dac three, to a dac 3 vbs, and in the systems I heard them in the dac 3vbs was better in about every way I can think of. I have lots of air and ambiance in my system, if its on the recording. |
So, according to the review in ultra audio,
the air, space and reverberation trails via
the Dac3vbs are truncated compared to the
original Dac 3.
Chrissain and Everest_audio, can you tell me if
the Dac3.5 improves upon these aspects? I have
spent a lot of money on Synergistic Research
products to vastly improve space, air and
reverberation trails. I really do not like the
idea of any compromises in these areas. |
So, according to the review in ultra audio,
the air, space and reverberation trails via
the Dac3vbs are truncated compared to the
original Dac 3.
Chrissain and Everest_audio, can you tell me if
the Dac3.5 improves upon these aspects? I have
spent a lot of money on Synergistic Research
products to vastly improve space, air and
reverberation trails. I really |
Hi , multiple questions so first off, the bass of the dac 3.5 is just tighter and more rock solid, with a good combo of weight and punch. I dont think you would have an issue with too much bass. I will let you know the upgrade price when I get it done, and the vbs 1 still needs a good power cord, I can still hear differences in power cords, its just not as dramatic as with some dacs. And I am suspicious of the post claiming bad build quality, I am nothing but impressed with the inside of mine. |
Has anyone tried plugging an upgraded power cord or
conditioner to the VBS1? I am really curious because
I have the Synergistic Research Hologram D PC on my
Dac 3 and the SR Powercell SE. The SR products have
expended the sound stage of the Dac 3 by a quantum
leap. So, it would be nice to use it elsewhere if it
is true that upgraded pc's have no effect on the VBS1. |
08-14-10: Zear
I owned a DAC 3, and though the cosmetics and faceplate were impressive, I was very unimpressed with the sloppy, substandard soldering that was evident throughout the boards. I went through the innards of my DAC3 with a fine tooth comb looking at the solder joints and pressure-fit connections. I haven't seen better construction! The layout is clean and uncluttered. The PCB boards are arranged in ideal proximity. The ribbon connectors are fit perfectly to size. The connections are unquestionably solid. I've seen plenty of good quality constructions, but the DAC3 is a step above. FWIW, I always look under the hood of components. |
Chrissain, can you tell us the cost to upgrade the 3 to 3.5?
Also, what is the cost of the VBS1?
I am also concerned with the increased bass.
My system is at the point where more bass may
overload my room. I am looking for better pitch,
more delicacy, a wider and deeper sound stage and
a maybe a little more warmth, not to mention a lower
noise floor, all without overloading my room with bass.
If this is possible, then I am really tempted to upgrade
soon. |
from my experience the bel canto will take more break in, let us know in a couple of weeks or in a month, it has caddok resisters in the output stage, which take a while to break in. then it will crush that sonic frontier dac , sorry. also by looking at your system, the focals are a bright speaker, so are your nordost cables, all your tubes are mellowing out the sound, which I would do to if I had your speakers. |
I tried to start a new post/topic but it couldn't copy the entire text from another doc.
So I'll post here for now but if someone can tell me how to start a new thread and copy my full text into it, that would be great. In the meantime...
This is my first review on Audiogon. And since this is my first new D/A converter in my system for about 13 years, I thought I'd share some initial impressions. As a disclaimer, I've only listened to the BC 3.5 for about 6 hours... although it's been powered up for 30 hours. The BC is a loaner that has been burned in and I've had my gear warmed up for 48 hours.
What really interested me with the Bel Canto was to see how a new, modern DA converter sounded up against my 13+ year old reference Sonic Frontiers SFD-2 MKII. As as optimistic audiophile always looking/hoping for for the the next audio epiphany, I wanted the Bel Canto to blow away the Sonic Frontiers D/A.
Well... good news for any SFD-2 MKII owners, you've still got a killer D/A converter... however, there are caveats... like always.
First, I'm an unabashed tube guy. I like the euphonics of tube gear. I don't need or want the sharp reality of SS gear. Understand, I've heard some SS gear that made me think twice about dumping my tubes for some Levinson, Rowland or other mega-watt performers. However, that's another discussion. Back to the Bel Canto.
One thing I can say with certainty (at least in my system), I did not like the direct-to-amp sound. The Bel Canto has a built-in pre-amp with digital volume control so you can bypass your pre. When I tried that it was way too bright and forward for my taste. So I went back to feeding the BC DAC through my Cary SLP-98 pre. Much better.
Before going further with other comments, I wanted to mention the other components in my system to give you a picture of what I'm listening through:
CEC TL1 Transport
Meridian 518 (yes, it makes a difference)
SFD-2 MKII
Cary SLP-98 (with 1950s NOS Sylvania tubes)
Cary 211AE Monoblocks
Focal Electra 926 Speakers
All nice cables, mostly Nordost with Shunyata PCs and Power Conditioner.
As a side note, I also have a VPI Scoutmaster with Outer Ring, VPI SS weight, VPI SDS, Benz H2 on a Ginko platform. This set up accounts for 70% of my listening, which at $6K is almost always more involving than my $14K (incl. cables) digital front end. But I digress.
The Bel Canto 3.5 is really, really good. In fact, I've heard some passages on tried and true CDs that made me say, "Wow, I've never heard that before... or at least not in quite the same way." There is a lot of punch with the Bel Canto. More than the Sonic Frontiers for sure but the difference is subjective. I prefer the SF.
Anyway, I'll post again after a week or so and report more. But, if you're thinking of buying the Bel Canto 3.5, you'll be thrilled... unless you have the Sonic Frontiers SFD-2 :) Again, it's all about what you like in sound qualities. |
VBS1 Features:
Low Noise Switch Mode Power Supply (SMPS) provides over 90% energy efficiency, specific control over
operating parameters of the supply, and high levels of isolation with significantly lower audio band noise
than traditional 50/60 Hertz transformer based linear supplies
Extensive input filtration, low noise rectification and high energy storage prior to the SMPS
Massive bank of LC filtration using compound inductors, parallel electrolytic capacitors and final stage
polypropylene capacitors to ensure hundreds of amperes of peak current capability and low noise across
a wide frequency spectrum
½ of a Farad of total capacitance (500,000 microfarads) and over 100 Joules of energy storage
10X to 100X lower noise floor than traditional linear power supply
Provides over 100 dB of isolation starting below 100 Hz
Compact SMPS isolation transformer for superior isolation from the power line |
So, does the VBS1 have three separate power supplies
for the three outputs, or is it just one power supply
driving three outputs? |
