I am impressed with your choice of 6SN7s. I really like the Brimar CV1988 GTY. See if you can get some Sylvania GTs or Ws as well for 6SN7s. Given your choices with them I would definately recommend that you look into 5751s.
I find 5751s to be more defined and yield better soundstage in my applications. I agree that there are more good ones floating around than most NOS 12AX7s. I also say you should look into it- as no one can assert with certainty what you will like. I have a hunch you will like them. Sylvania triple mica BP are prolly the best but failing that, try some TM BP RCA white lable, Raytheon in general, (yes windmill getter but they are rare) then perhaps lastly GE with some special GE vintage exceptions. The militery versions of all are good. |
I have tried 7025s only briefly. I found them to lack the delicacy transparency and detail the 5751s gave me. I didn't try many because they seem to be a favorite of the Guitar amp guys who drive up price and make good ones quite scarce. I know I tried RCA but don't recall others. The major differences in Telefunkens are smooth vs ribbed plate and early vs later. Also the holy grail of 12AX7s is the ECC803S by TFKN. I own some 802 and 801S but sadly never lucked into or afforded the 803S.The early smooth plate 12AX7s seem to be the preferred tube but not by everyone. |
Mcpherson
I own Focal JM Lab 936 non Berylium tweeter speakers and it took a combination of things to get the tone I wanted. You have to ignore all the negative crap you will read about trying to adjust the tone of your system. In my mind it is my system and I want it to sound the way I like, not the way some one else delares is correct.
The tubes you want to warm up that tweeter is most likely going to be a good old stock 12AX7 Mullards from the 50s or 60s that you put into the pre amp. The Blackburn long plate in particular. I think Brent Jesse at Audiotubes.com may have them. These are warm tubes, but be aware that almost any British tube is going to lean towards the warm side. If you can roll input tubes into the HK again look to Mullard for the best results.
The other things you want to do- although this will cost quite a bit of money- is to get Cardas "Golden" whatever interconnects, I have the Golden Refs. These copper interconnects really make the Focals sound great. I also suggest good copper speaker cables. Again ideally Cardas or Jena Lab but both do cost a lot even used . I would never the less look for them to show up. I lucked into some used Jena Labs and the sound is fabulous.
I happen to have an AE-3 Pre Amp by AES a Cary brand which uses 6SN7s which are delightful tubes for smooth and rich tone, it made a world of difference in my system. Good Luck! |
Yes Mcpherson, I found the Focals very bright and somewhat over analytical when I first bought them. In the store, I was dazzled by all that detail and transparency. Wouldn't you know, it I had auditioned them by letting the store choose the amplification and source, of course it was all tube! Well, I got them and I had a really nice Musical Fidelity SS integrated amp, and was I in for a surprise. It took a complete system overhaul, but I stuck with them tinkering until I got them to sound the way I knew they could. Now they astonish and delight me ever single time I hear them.
I disagree with those who think that any high caliber equipment, when well implemented, works with all speakers. The real trick BTW was the use of tube power amps, not just the tube pre. Together the all tube system is incredible. The quick fix is prolly using Mullard NOS/OS tubes and getting Cardas cabling. However, I almost guarantee that you will find tube power amplification to be the ultimate answer and I bet you will be deeply pleased with the result. |
Mcpherson,
Thor has a very very good reputation. If you can get the British tubes into the pre it will make an obvious improvement. I happen to use a highly Modded AE-3 by AES a sub brand of Cary. It is a simple pre which uses 6SN7s, they have great, mellow tone, and are highly linear. It doesn't hurt that I put some very fine, metal base Sylvania 6SN7 "Ws" in it. Thor power amps use EL 34s and would appear to be a really good choice. I have a variant of EL-34s in my power amps, the tetrode 6CA7 fat bottle by EH, which sound really big and powerful. My amps, BTW, are Opera Consonance Cyber 800 monoblocks. The inputs tubes are OS Tung Sol 5687s and Mullard 2493s a 6922 variant. My speaker cables are Jena Labs entry level, which are an all copper braid. The combination is magical. |
I can't answer for Frogman but I certainly think for the most part that a warm tube sounds warm where ever they are with a few exceptions. there is no doubt though, that certain tubes just don't work in all circuits. For me as a rule I tend to like 5751s in most situations. I did try 5751s in the output section of a Jolida CD player and it simply did not function. The sound was dreadful enough to make me think the tube had failed but it hadn't. The circuit for some reason was intolerant. Another exception was a highly modded ARC SP-6B which didn't change it's tone no matter what I put in it. It was brutally frustrating and a terrible combination with my speakers.
There are cases where the lower mu doesn't seem to work either. I have some real old unmodded vintage integrateds that used 12AX7s in the preamp section and frankly need the extra umph. A couple of them came loaded with Teles before tube rape was common. Curiuosly they respond quite well to current production in many instances where I have replaced the old tubes. The old tubes I then put into new amps and many sound fine go figure! |
Grayf,
I have a hunch that given your current delight with the Tele 12AX7s that you might really like the Raytheon windmill getter 5751s. Since those are very rare and costly, you can almost approximate them with Raytheon mid 60s 2 mica regular getter BPs. They have a red painted label and some are yellow label. I was fortunate to aquire some WNDMills a while back and have some of the 2 mica non WNDMills as well. They have the strong presence you seem to prefer with excellent articulation but have a noteable increase in soundstage IME.
No I am not selling. BTW allways snatch up Sylvania TMBPs when avail at a low price- some might be only "OK" but you eventually hit on some good ones and then you are in for a treat. I can give you a little tube hunting hint. In the long run it is worth buying singles at a very reduced prices and collecting enough to match or approximate pairs. I was able to put together several different tube sets this way I couldn't find in pairs at least not at a price I could pay. Good Luck |
Mikirob,
Amperex made a 12AU7 variant in the early sixties called 7316. When I tell you they do what the other Amperex do only a lot better, believe me. The problem is that a lot of people other than myself really like them and the price is quite high. As if the regular Amperex 12AU7s didn't cost enough already.
@ Grayf and Mcpherson. Shuguang made a 12AX7 a couple of years ago that I actually liked. It was called the 12AX7 C9 or 9th edition it was clean and accurate with a good strong signal, not warm but really very good. Then they stopped making them for some reason and now you can only seem to get the 12AX7 B8. I never understood what happened, but if you can find them (C9s) buy them you'll prolly like them. |
I have often wondered about his very short descriptions which indicate to me a person who is not prone to using the laguage well to express themselves either. So I am not totally surprised. It is good to know his tubes are good. The tubes look like pulls, very often and price wise are not exactly a bargain. He certainly seems to know how to market his wares though, look at the numbers of sales. I just can't believe all of his tubes are the "best" as he often advertizes. I wonder if this post will make it beyond the sensors?? |
There is an acid etched code on the tube that will tell you where the tubes were really made. Phillips owned both Amperex and Mullard brands and cross labled many of their tubes. If they were made by Phillips they will flash upon start up and have typical cross molding marks in the glass on top of the tube. In any event if made in Great Britain it should sound rich and mellow like the Mullard tubes do. The Amperex Holland tubes have a cleaner and 3d imaging with better detail in the top end. All the comments on sonics are IMHO of course. |
