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Long ICs - A'gon versus Audiocircle

Here on Audiogon there have been many discussions about long vs. short ICs, with (to my recollection) no real bias for one or other other. I happen to fall into the long IC camp (given that I have to choose one or the other), because I've tried them both in my system and long ICs seem to work better.

I've just been noticing, however, that on Audiocircle there appears (again, to me) to be a real bias against long ICs. The prevailing justification seems to be that of high frequency roll off. Now I like AC as an alternate place to discuss things audio, but I get the sense that this subject will be less likely to turn into a holy war here.

What is the viability of this argument against long ICs? How long does a low capacitance (figure around 12-16 pf/ft) single ended IC have to get before there is any hit on the upper end of the audio band?
tonyptony
serus
93 posts
 
Tony, it depends on the output impedance of the source. You will have roll-off issues only with high impedance output drivers.
There are other issues with long wires, which have mainly to do with noise pickup, as you know... The noise issues are much less severe with speaker cables. That is because noise in interconnects gets amplified and noise in speaker cables just loads the speakers, possibly interacting with the amp, but in general it does not get amplified by the electronics.
Short interconnects rarely need shielding for noise/hum reduction. Long ones rarely get away without proper shielding. So, lots of reasons to go with a "traditional" short IC/long SC.
BTW 12-16 pF/ft is not typical. Check specs more carefuly!
tonyptony OP
614 posts
 
Yes, I know that is on the low side for ICs, but that is consistent with types that I've tried. The issue I have with long speaker cables is when do you go so far as to have to consider the use of a Zobel network? And doesn't that have its own shortcomings?
nsgarch's avatar
nsgarch
2,524 posts
 
The MAIN reason for going with shorter speaker cables (under 10 feet) and longer ICs, is that amplifiers have a hard time excercising control over the woofer (providing good transient response/clean bass) when their damping ability is diminished by longer speaker cables. This is especially true for tube amps with output transformers (and therefore inherently limited damping ability)

ICs on the other hand can be quite long before their per-foot (possibly detrimental) electrical characteristics add up to anything significant. Using balanced ICs (XLR) pretty much elimninates the noise/hum pickup problems.

If you need proof of the above two principles, you need look no further than the pro sound world (theatres, concerts, recording studios, rtc) where these methods have been standard operating procedure for decades now.
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