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New TT ideas please

I'm doing a major upgrade to my system with the new electronics likely to be Audio Research REF3/110/PH7 (though may be PH5 in the interim)/Verity Parsifals. My Roksan Radius 5 is going to find a loving home, but I need some ideas of what to look at. Here are a few that appeal to me visually and reputationally, and a few that I've heard (all similar $$ roughly, budget seems to be about $6-$7.5k for table and arm):

1. Clearaudio Ambient (looks simple to setup and use), unify arm
2. Rega P9 with the 1000 arm (again, simple setup)
3. Michell Gyrodec or Orb (with the acrylic platform and cover)
4. Transrotor Atlantis with Origin Live tonearm
5. Redpoint turntable (a long shot) - looking for opinions

Excluding VPI, what else should I consider? I would like a company with a long standing history (Redpoint is questionable on this front), excellent build quality, not too finicky, sounds lively, involving, quiet background, controlled and detailed. I don't mind a touch forward, as I think the rest of the system could use a slightly forward source. Simplicity is preferred - I don't want to have to adjust things too often or it won't be used.

I have a fascination with Koetsu cartridges, so I want a TT that would suit an Urushi / Rosewood Signature cartridge. I also think transrotor is interesting, but their web site confuses me (only 3 models? I thought they had many more).

I will try my very best to hear them so what I'm asking is your best ideas and a little brain storming. I will only buy what sounds best to me and works with my system - no question about that.
hatari
dan_ed
2,451 posts
 
Hatari,

A musician friend of mine introduced me to some of the African jazz music. Abdullah Ibrahim, Dudu Pukwana, Louis Moholo, Chris Mcgregor, Wintson Mankunku, Sipho Mabuse. Really enjoyable music. I think much of it would be hard to find here in the states.

Good luck with your table search.
hatari OP
94 posts
 
Dan_ed: Addullah Ibrahim used to be known as "Luck Brand" in the early days I believe, and I have but one CD of his (bought in Cape Town some years ago). I don't have anything from the other names, so I'm adding them to my shopping list.

Westside_music: I will take a look at the brand you recommend. I'm in Toronto.

Thanks
uktel
60 posts
 
Hatari
just looking at the classifieds and there is an oracle mkv with turbo power supply for $2500
add to this a graham phantom and you will have a first class front end that will work very well with a koetsu.
imho the oracle is very underrated.
this combo will play any kind of music due to its neutrality and also sounds very fast and 3 dimensional
surface noise will also be quite low.
highly reccomended.
good luck
dougdeacon
3,338 posts
 
Here's what I'm looking for: Clarity, detail, accurate timbre, clear and realistic imaging, quickness, depth, neutral, pitch black quietness, beauty and musicality. I don't want any darkness or anything that is laid back. I want something that can work with detailed cartridges (dynavector etc.) and with gorgeous cartridges (koetsu etc.).
Good list.

What you're seeking is a TT that will "always" spin at at exactly the chosen speed while simultaneously sinking as much resonance energy as possible away from the vinyl/stylus interface. Therefore, there are some turntable "features" you should avoid:

- suspended tables (unless very expensive); they sap speed and bass energy, soften dynamics and raise the noise floor by feeding false (non-musical) energy back into the cartridge

- belt drives that use stretchy (rubber) or slippery (thread) belts; TT makers normally chose such belts to "protect" the platter from motor noise, which tells you they prefer bandaids to applying good engineering to minimizing the problem at the source; elastic and slippery belts are invariably vulnerable to stylus drag, which slews transient leading edges and robs the music of lifelike speed, snap and energy; even the rotational inertia of my 35 lb. platter is not enough to make belts like those sound acceptable

- low mass plinths that can't sink lots of resonance energy; resonances raise the noise floor and this masks the low level details which deliver realistic timbre, sharp images and realistic soundspaces

"Beauty and musicality" are in the ear of the beholder of course. Neither I nor anyone else knows what those terms mean to you. Your technical requirements are easier to address, as above.

Spend some time researching and thinking about these approaches, which avoid the above pitfalls better than most:
- Galibier
- Teres
- Redpoint
- modded Lenco or similar

Happy hunting!
Doug
pauly
1,012 posts
 
Woah there Doug.

+++ [Avoid ] suspended tables (unless very expensive); they sap speed and bass energy, soften dynamics and raise the noise floor by feeding false (non-musical) energy back into the cartridge +++

How does my suspension do all these things?

I had an unsuspended table not to long ago and it was less dynamic, had less bass impact and had a much higher noise floor than my Oracle. (It also cost more than my Oracle).

I suspect the sonic shortcomings were directly related to the fact that each and every micro vibration was dumped straight into the cart, something not happening with my Oracle.

+++ elastic and slippery belts are invariably vulnerable to stylus drag, which slews transient leading edges and robs the music of lifelike speed, snap and energy; even the rotational inertia of my 35 lb. platter is not enough to make belts like those sound acceptable +++

I tried both stretchy and zero compliant belts on a couple of DC motored tables. In both cases (stretchy and non compliant) I could detect the same noticeable drift. It has little to do with the motor to platter coupling, but everything to do with a puny DC motor that cannot cope with stylus drag.

Rotational inertia the most capable way of keep consistent speed without introducing noise. It is most certainly more capable than a puny DC motor trying to chase its tail in a closed loop system.

Regards
Paul
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