Discuss The Viv Lab Rigid Arm


I am trying to do my due diligence about this arm. I am just having a hard time getting my head around this idea of zero overhang and no offset. Does this arm really work the way it is reported to do?

neonknight

Dear @frogman  : You are rigth but the owners of that tonearm just posted that they like it and in reality no one gone in deep detail in their tonearms comparisons with selected LP tracks.

 

I even posted to intactaudio if he could share the LPs tracks that was using in his tests and his answer was:"dead silence ".

 

Such is life.

R.

I put my 9" HA arm up for sale a few easy-to-find places if anyone is interested. I’m still somewhat agnostic as to the discussion surrounding the fine details. Kind of tempting to try to put the arm to the test, but I’m mostly a 78 collector. Although I’m constantly exploring the frontiers of 78 sound engineering and restoration, I don’t have much interest in trying to break into the field of tonearm testing as a relative novice--I think I’ll stick with mysteries of the Soundsmith Strain Gauge for now along with the hot debate (in 78 circles anway) concerning digital IIR EQ curves and comparing them to their analog equivalents. That’s enough to keep me busy for months or years. For my second arm, I’m going to stick with something a bit more fixed--a few of the Viv’s adjustments were kind of troublesome with my particular plinth. I may regret selling it.

@intactaudio 

@lewm 

 

Earlier in this thread I mentioned setting the zero offset arm with 2 nulls.

What I really meant was as follows -

With a zero offset tonearm generally it is recommended to set a null point somewhere between the start and end of a typical LP.

You could set it halfway to minimise the maximum tracking angle distortion, or you could choose closer to the end of the playing area to minimise tracking angle distortion in the inner grooves for example.

What I surmise would be interesting to try would be to move the arm mounting point slightly forward so that the stylus is slightly forward of the single null point. You would then be able to reduce the maximum tracking angle distortion, the arm would be under and over hung, but you would still have the reduced skating force due to zero offset.

What say you.

 

 

 

 

 

Dover, as you know, the single null point will lie on the radius of the LP and hopefully somewhere on the playing surface. I’ve been trying to visualize the setup you propose. Seems to me if you move the pivot forward of the null point but still short of the spindle ( pivot to spindle distance still greater than pivot to stylus) you just change the location of the single null. As soon as pivot to spindle = pivot to stylus, you’ll have no null point. And when pivot to stylus is greater than P2S, also no null point. I hope I’ve understood you correctly.

@lewm

Its a bit hard without drawing a diagram -

If you draw a line from the spindle to the edge of the record.( call it line A )

Then choose a null point on that line

Now draw a line ( call it line B ) at 90 degrees to line A intersecting the null to the armboard or mounting point - so you now have a T.

Normally I assume you would position the arm mounting along that 90 degree line such that the stylus swings an arc where it touches the null, but both sides of the null are underhung.

What I am suggesting is now move the mount forward so that when the stylus is forward of the null point.

Now when the stylus swings through the arc it should intersect line A twice.

So now the arm starts off underhung, then crosses line A and goes to overhung, then crosses line A again and goes to underhung.

In this set up the maximum tracking error is reduced, but you would still have the advantage of no skating forces due to offset.

Alternative Explanation 2

Alternately if you take your existing Rigid Float move the arm across the record.

The stylus draws an arc.

Draw a line through the spindle that crosses that arc at one point.

Now with the stylus positioned at that point, move the arm mount forward along a line 90 degrees to that point..

Instead of 100% underhung either side of the null you will now have both under and overhung. You should if I have my head right have reduced the maximum tracking error - potentially you could halve it - by having a mix of underhand overhung instead of 100% underhung.

Hopefully you can follow this.

By the way here’s another example of a 0 SideForce arm. Fidelix have been around forever.

https://exclusive-audio.jp/en/products/0-sideforce