Good read: why comparing specifications is pointless

Sounds just like those idiots in DC. 

This is not a thread about my room.  Or any room for that matter.  It is about audio gear specs/measurements

  

@kota1 

@ghdprentice , he doesn’t have the goods, he is deceptive because he has to be, if he had the goods he would post them. He wrote a full page boasting about his creds and not even one mention of his own gear?

My system and link to it including measurements was has been posted multiple times.  Here it is again:

 

If he had even a halfway decent system he would be just as braggadocious.

No, I am a private person and don't want to walk around bragging about my own system.  I only post it out of necessity where a test requires it as it did here: 

I let you go on thinking I don't want to post it to see how far you go with it.  Boy did you go far even though so often the answer was given!  You truly lack common sense and skills to have debates like this.

@kota1

I think he is just jealous of my "nodes" :)

Once again, you have no idea of how your room measures. You post this:

 

This is the output of Audyssey Pro. You made no measurements of your own so have no idea what this represents so let me explain.

On the left in black are what Audyssey measured as your room response. This shows the usual room modes and other response errors. Alas, there are no scales. You have no ideal how big or small those variations are. Further, you don’t know how much smoothing is applied which again, can hide issues.

Audyssey proceeds to create its correction filters. Those filters are based on what is shown in red on the right. It however, NEVER shows you the response after applying those targets!!! That’s right. Your room response is not remotely like that. Those red curves are the "targets" used, not what is achieved.

Don’t believe me? Here is a test of Auddyssey I performed with my system/room where I show what it says it did versus reality:

 

Black is the response with no EQ. Light pink is what Audyssey claims to have done. The reality/measured response is in red. As you see, they are NOT at all the same. And that is with me applying a lot of smoothing to actual measurements to help make it look similar.

Most importantly here, you have screwed up and did not create the proper target curve. Audyssey by default makes two major mistakes:

1. Uses a flat target curve. This is perceptually wrong and will make your system very bass light post correction. The proper target curve is what I show in my measurement above. It has increased bass response to make it sound more balanced and natural. Formal research shows that without this fix, Audyssey actually makes the system sound worse, not better:

 

This is the result of listening tests from that study:

 

Audyssey using the same target curve you did is #6 all the way to the right. It produced lower listener preference than no EQ!!!

2. You left the so called "BBC dip" in the target. This is that little notch in mid-frequencies. It is a mistaken belief that speakers in general are too hot in that region and so response should be pulled down. This is completely wrong. You need to override it and make that flat like the target I created (light pink).

Net, net, your system is improperly equalized. And you do NOT have any kind of measurements for you to understand it. Learn the topic for heaven’s sake.

@amir_asr , congratulations on posting something, it took a while but you stepped up. I look forward to comparing notes.

If you want to share your thoughts about my system, great. I’ll do same about yours later.

As for Audyssey I don’t think you are accurate about the software. You are using the app from the phone, that isn’t what I use at all. My software is PC based. As for Audyssey Pro there are different versions of the software and maybe you used one of the older versions. The version I am using was just updated this year. The chart I printed is before (black) and actual after (red), red is not some random target curve.
(I knew you were jealous of my "nodes").

You are thinking of ARC where the red is indeed just a target. Look at the graphs on my front height speakers, that red after curve wouldn’t be a desired target, that is what it is, the actual FR.

Now, why did you blow that big wad of cash on a golf swing panther speaker and stick them in that headless panther room with hard flat surfaces? Why not save money if you knew you couldn’t treat the room and just get one of the less expensive models?

As for the amps are they broken as a member here mentioned? They look great anyway.

Unless you step up your room I think you will never get a truly excellent result, just serviceable.

Next question, why are your speakers at that particular angle from the MLP? I set my front L-R speakers at the dolby specs of within 22 to 30 degrees. I moved the MLP forward in the room and have the same distance from the speakers in front of the room as the ones in back.

As for goals as you see in my overview I am primarily a MCH listener for music and movies, 2 channel only about 10% of the time in that system.

How did you position your MLP and why? It looks too far back from the pic.

 

 

 

 

@amir_asr , one more thing, if that is the setup you use to review MCH processors and receivers you need to stop reviewing them. You should review gear after using it as it was designed to be used, as well as measure it. If you want to review MCH gear use a MCH setup.

You spent $100K to measure a speaker in a way no one will ever use it. Now spend $1000 on the room that you use your speakers in every day. (I recommend Auralex, YMMV, they have specs and measurements on their website for all their products)

Audiogon Forum 1- ASR 1

(you get a point for showing up and sharing)