2. speakers
  3. 176197-114000

Speaker Recommendation Help Please.

Hello,

I  am hoping to get some advice.

First, I'm in Canada so when I talk budgets I will use gear, not numbers, as that is probably the best way to remove the "currency" factor ($100 USD is very different than $100 CAD, but a NAD M33 is the same item on both sides of the border). 

Second, I actually have pretty minimal experience with speakers.  I was an avid headphone listener for years as I used to live in a condo so speakers, due to space and neighbours, was not an option.  I've owned most TOTL headphones - HD800, Focal Utopia, LCD4, Abyss, Code-X, SR-009/007, etc.  

Third, I'm looking at speakers for now, only.  An amp and source will come later so let's ignore it for now entirely please.  Assume whatever speaker I end up with, I will get an appropriate amp.  I am trying to keep this as focused as possible and I have to start somewhere, and I've decided the speakers are the place.  If I have a budget of $X, I am happy to spend $X on speakers and wait to buy an amp rather than spending $0.5X on speakers and $0.5X on an amp today.

Fourth, some information about my listening preferences...  People ask, "what kind of music do you like".  Well, as Justice Stewart might say, I can't define it but when I hear it, I know it.  I'm pretty varied and probably listen to much of the same stuff every audiophile does.  I don't listen to a lot of classical, chamber, techno, EDM, rap or country.  Take whatever is left, and that's probably me.  I love detail - It's what I love about the HD800 and Utopia's - there is so much nuance, air and separation.  I love that.  I also love texture, which is why I love the LCD4's.  The resonance of a guitar body, the natural tone of a voice.  And I love slam...  This is my guilty pleasure.  I used to drive my Abyss with a PassLabs INT-30A (30 watts of Class A into headphones) and you could almost feel the impact in your chest.  If you need more detail, or have specific questions about any of this, please let me know.

Fifth, my room is the biggest small room there is (well, not really).  The speakers on going on an 13 foot wall (that extends out to about 60 feet) and the room is 28 feet deep.  The speakers can only be about 12-14 inches from the back wall (I have a wife and it's our family room) and my ears are about 10 feet from the speaker wall.  Oh, and the ceilings are 12 feet high.  Here's my crummy drawing of the room.  Each square is one foot by one foot:

 

(Hopefully you can read all that).

 

The speakers are going on the left side and there is fireplace in between.  Behind the couch is the kitchen and, if you are sitting on the couch, to your left, it opens up to the font of the house.  Here's what is actually looks like and the new speaker will go where the current ones are:

 

 

(The speakers are Paradigm Active 20's for those playing at home)

To the right is the back of the home which is mostly glass.

Now, as for options.  I don't love the signature of the Paradigms.  They have a  "dark" sound and have a recessed mids.  What I call an "American sound".  I am looking for something more neutral or even slightly warm.  

Locally, there is a pair of Sophia V1's which is my current front runner.  I think they will give me everything I am after with the right amp but they are a little big.  They are also my #1 choice due to price.  I worry about placement and that being a big problem.

I am also considering Wilson SabrinaX's,.  I worry the Sabarina's may be too small sounding for the room (not that I need to fill it, and I don't listen loud), but I love the foot print of them.  Also, because they are Wilson, I again worry about placement.

Next would be Sonus Faber Guarneri Traditions.  I think I would have end up adding a sub down the road which technically makes them the biggest option (by foot print).  I LOVE the look of them.  I also would consider Serafinos if I don't need a but I feel like we are getting into next level stuff with those so everything, like the amp budget has to climb as well.  Right now, my top choice amp for all options is a Hegel H390 or H590 so you get an ideal of budget.  Tubes aren't an option.

Next would be Focal Sopra 2's.  Visually, these are the bottom the list for me personally, but I think they are a bit of a middle ground sonically between the Sabrina's and GT's...  

I am going to listen to all 4 speakers this week.  

My question is which of the 4 would work best in my room given the placement restrictions?  The Sophia's may be a no brainer here because of the price and that they are second hand so they have already depreciated so I could buy them and change to another option later.  Are their others that you would strongly suggest?  Maggies aren't an option due to looks.  Magico isn't an option either.  

Thank you for reading,

-Paul

bigfatpaulie
bigfatpaulie OP
11 posts
 

@spenav Thank you.  I tried to be as complete as possible.  I appreciate you taking the the time to read it all.  The trouble with pushing my speakers out 4 feet is that 1) they would then be 6 feet from my ears and 8 feet apart and 2) it would be a no-go with my wife :)  The reason I am starting with speakers and looking for advice is, as you have aptly pointed out, placement and the room is the biggest factor.  I am looking for guidance of what would actually work in a space like this, in this location.  I fully agree and acknowledge the challenges of my room which is why I went into as much detail as I did about.  To my earlier point about Magnepans not being an option, that's strictly because of my room and the lack of space behind the speakers.  The speakers playing well in my room, I believe, will be the biggest determining factor in the success of my stereo.  I am looking for speaker/room synergy here (if that's possible).

 

@erik_squires Excellent advice!!  Thank you.  And yes, room treatment will be essential.  You can't see it in the photo I provided so here is the other angle, facing the kitchen: 

 

 

In addition to your suggestions, I am thinking treatment will be a good idea above the cabinets on that blank wall (about 2 feet tall, to the ceiling).  I really, really appreciate the specifics!  Thank you.  I'm not sure if these are available through a dealer here, but I am pretty comfortable buying room treatments online.  I also never thought to consider a narrow dispersion speaker; this is the kind of advice I was hoping for.  

sbank's avatar
sbank
3,378 posts
 

Agree bass traps are essential, but even more so speakers designed to be close to the wall. First thought was K-horns, but not where the current speakers are. Have you considered Larsen 8 or 9? They are made for against the wall, and I was amazed when I heard the 9s how well they performed. 

If 4 ft. out is off limits, which is fine, any Wilson, Focal etc. is going to give you only a fraction of what you're paying for...and will sorely disappoint vs. if you heard them properly set up. Cheers,

Spencer

bigfatpaulie OP
11 posts
 

Hi @sbank !  Not only have I never heard Larson's, I've never heard OF Larson!  Thank you for the suggestion.  It looks like they don't have a distributor, much less a dealer in Canada, but I did just email the closest distributor to see what my options are (if any).  Thanks for the suggestion!!

I also appreciate your candor about Wilson/Focal likely not being a good option due to only having 12-14 inches behind the speaker to work with (assuming a, about, 20 inch deep speaker).  Would Sonus Faber be in the same boat?  I suspect so...  One reason I was considering the Guaneri's is that they are shallower.  The same goes for the SabrinaX's (on the top).  You bring up a good point: when I audition, I should move the speakers to where they will be in my room (ie close the walls) and not where the dealer puts them for best performance.  

sbank's avatar
sbank
3,378 posts
 

@bigfatpaulie Yes, I would say Sonus and most conventional box or dipoles would have the same concern close to the wall. 

Audio Note is very well regarded and often on long walls and close. They don't look "high tech" in terms of styling, but many rave about them when paired with the right stuff (usually tube gear and very specific cabling. They're kinda pricey too...Cheers,

Spencer

tablejockey
3,793 posts
 

"The speakers can only be about 12-14 inches from the back wall (I have a wife and it's our family room)"

The buzz kill is the lack of free space you DON"T have from the back wall.

Whatever you pick, consider a model design that doesn't mind being close to the back wall. Speakers usually sound best pushed out in the room. Keep in mind your choices will be compromised. Focal/SF optimum when out 4-6 feet.

 

More to discover