Why do most phono preamps lack XLR input even thought cartridges are naturally balanced?


Seems to me XLR input is the way to go for phono preamps.  Pros and cons for XLR vs RCA phono input?
dracule1
Thanks for the mention, Kijanki. To add further technical elaboration to this erudite discussion of esoteric matters, IMO the main reason "most phono preamps lack XLR input even though cartridges are naturally balanced" (quoting from the subject line of this thread) is simply what Lew said earlier:

... it’s a longstanding tradition to offer only RCA inputs.

:-)

And of course traditions often tend to be self-perpetuating.

It’s perhaps also relevant that not too many decades ago I believe a considerable majority of high quality turntables had pendant (non-detachable) phono cables terminated with RCA plugs.

Finally, regarding RIAA equalization Ralph’s (Atmasphere’s) MP-1 and MP-3 preamps are of course fully balanced, provide transformerless balanced XLR inputs for their built-in phono stages (RCAs can be added as an option), and are spec’d as having RIAA accuracies of 0.07 db and 0.1 db respectively! And given especially that it is Ralph who has provided those specs, I have no reason to doubt them. I’m not in a position to elaborate on how he accomplishes those numbers, of course, other than pointing out that he uses triode-based differential stages rather than separate signal paths for the two legs. But as far as purely technical considerations are concerned his designs certainly speak to the practicability of accomplishing what the OP has asked about.

Best regards,
-- Al

one would have to introduce a true balanced phono circuit internally.


While the idea of duplicated, bridged, or fully balanced (whichever term you like) is sexy, the idea that this is the only advantage is really not correct.  Professional gear has been using balanced signals long before audiophiles got it into their heads to duplicate circuits.

Having a differential input which is not referenced to ground has a lot of benefits for noise.  And while I don't think we need full-sized XLR plugs, there are mini-XLR plugs which would work a treat for this.  I've often wondered this myself.
Phono cartridges are floating sources rather than balanced, and unless there is a low-impedance connection between phono amplifier ground and both sides of the cartridge signal coil, and/or the common mode rejection of the phono stage input stage is extremely high across a wide bandwidth, there most likely will be substantial pickup of electrical noise from the environment (i.e., connecting the phono cartridge in balanced mode will probably yield worse noise performance than an unbalanced connection).

An input transformer magnetically isolates common mode noise, and is a good solution to building a quiet balanced phono stage.
It's common mode. By definition the currents must be matched. If they are not matched, they are not common mode, they are differential and then you cannot tell them apart from the signal. The coil in the cartridge also completes the loop. It is by analogy the isolated end of the transformer.

If it is a powered microphone that has an active ground connection, power and signal, then yes, the benefit is there. The benefit is mainly in better shielding for a non powered microphone.

That is true, as long as currents flow in the loop only. If one of the wires go to input while the other goes to GND (unbalanced input), currents in both wires are not even anymore. Perhaps, that's why floating (for audio frequencies) balanced output, like transformer is not enough and has to be connected to balanced input (not single ended). Microphones also benefit from balanced input.  

The differential input of an op-amp does not have a gain of 1. It's a current source into a differential pair, that will share current based on the transistors being perfectly matched, and it will convert that current into a voltage by the load resistors ... who's matching also impacts the common mode rejection of this stage.
As for Instrumentation amps, yes they have laser trimmed resistors, but front (two amp) differential section has always gain of 1 for common mode signal independently of resistor tolerance.

That's not how it works. I think you are confusing something. For a 40db CMRR, you must have gain matching of gain matching between the two channels to +/- 0.5% (1% total), and you must have perfect transistor matching (which they never are).

If you set gain of 100 for this section you get automatically 40dB CMRR independent of resistors tolerance. It happens because each of two amps is referenced to input of another (instead of the GND).


Typically you use op-amps with laser trimmed resistors and/or you calibrate. You of course need tight temperature tolerance matching which is easier at the IC level, since with low power draw, temp will be very consistent between the temperature co-efficient.

That is the only way I can see, for truly balanced amps, to function without converting common mode noise to normal mode signal. Otherwise matching resistors and keeping them matched to some sensible number (like 60dB=0.1%) is not practical, while adding RIAA frequency correction and matching capacitors to 0.1% is next to impossible.

Which would probably be pointless as you pointed out, you are not going to get capacitors to that tolerance.
I perceive this would only be of benefit at frequencies outside the audio range, as within the audio range, effectively the cartridge completes the loop and common mode noise would be rejected.  Do you have examples of commercial products that use this technique and are they measureably quieter?

An input transformer magnetically isolates common mode noise, and is a good solution to building a quiet balanced phono stage.