How much will you pay for an exotic cartridge....

Actually what’s your problem? My prior thread...not post, has nothing to do with this thread. Read my OP again, this time without your preconceived idea.

This thread and your previous thread have something in common.

It is obvious that for some reason you don’t like to buy this Japanese cartridge from the distributor in your area. But you can’t even tell us what cartridge do you mean, you told us it’s $8k cartridge. Do you think all distributors are the same (bad) ? This is why i’m asking what is your problem, because it is clearly your problem. Sometimes the problem is the customer, not the distributor. I’ve met great distributors as i said earlier.

I’m pretty sure any legit seller will do his best for the customer who willing to spend money, especially $8k on a cartridge. If you think the seller/dealer is not an expert, i think he is a business man anyway, i believe you can appreciate discount when you will tell him that grey market dealer can offer the same cartridge cheaper (but without any further support by the manufacturer for sure). Based on my own experience with US distributor (as a foreigner) i can confirm that discount even for $5k cartridge from the official distributor can be up to 20% and that’s god damn serious discount. Instead of dealing with grey market seller you (or anyone else) could communicate with the official distributor to get the best deal. Most of them can offer trade-in program to upgrade used cartridge purchased from them to a brand new next model with huge discount, grey market dealers can’t do that. This is another reason to deal with the official distributor, but for me it doesn’t really matter in which country if i can manage shipping address in the same country, because they can not ship to another country where the company have another distributor (it’s fair).

If your reference price is the price from grey market dealer i don’t think it’s fair, normally they are selling prolonged storage items or overstock, not the latest models.

The reference point is the retail price in various countries, if you can save 20-30% buyin’ it from grey market dealer (but you lose all the benefits for upgrade, service, support) then it’s probably not enough, but if you can save up to 50% then you play with the devil (on your own risk). Some buyers prefer to save 50% and rebuild their cartridges with people like SoundSmith (not the original designer, not the original parts, different sound as the result), some people prefer to insure themselves and to stay with original designer (via distributor) who can change or rebuild their cart to original specs.

In my opinion it’s so stupid to buy $8k cartridge to save 30-50% from the grey market dealer if you’re not sure this cartridge is the best and exactly what you need. And if you know it, then what’s the reason to deal with grey market seller who will never be able to send it to the manufacturer for service/upgrade/retip by original designer when it time to. And it’s even more stupidity to deal with grey market dealer when official distributor can privately offer same 30% discount and all the benefits for the future.

You’re talking about EXOTIC cartridges as i can see in your post.
Exotic cartridge = exotic parts, patented and exclusively made for the manufacturer only (imo).

I’m very confident the Japanese could deal with USA buyers direct. I do that with one manufacturer now and the service is impeccable.

This is fine, but it’s an exception. Also you can tell us what manufacturer dealing directly with you or it’s a top secret ? Do you mean they are selling cartridges directly or do you mean that you can ship something to Japan for expensive service like Ikeda tonearm for rewire for example. Regarding the cartridges i'm pretty sure direct deal is possible only if there is no official distributor in your area. For example i can deal with manufacturers in USA because they do not have a distributor in my country, but if they have their own distributor in my country it will be dishonest for them to deal with a private customer in the same country where they got distributor.   

I am just curious, how do you know the grey market sellers are Chinese?

2juki is the biggest grey market dealer on ebay, he’s from Hong Kong. You don’t know this ?

This is about the Etsuro Gold cartridge which is $21k USD retail through the USA dealer. It’s about $8500 USD less (retail pricing) through a legit Europe or Japan dealer for someone living in the US.

@chakster no secret, it’s Audio Tekne. I’m just making the point that it’s possible to buy direct from the Japanese without logistical issues. You will likely get far better service than any other dealer, which has been my experience.  No PayPal, money is wired at a fixed low cost. English is not an issue. How do you think USA distributors are dealing with Japanese manufacturers?  You think they can read and write Japanese?

This is about the Etsuro Gold cartridge which is $21k USD retail through the USA dealer. It’s about $8500 USD less (retail pricing) through a legit Europe or Japan dealer for someone living in the US.

@vortrex

All Etsuro models manufactured by Excel Sound Inc.

This is your Etsuro Gold with $21k retail price in USA ?

A bit off-topic, but I will tell you more:

The current $8000 Excel Sound’s Etsuro Urushi MC looks very similar compared to the stylish and very rare Argent MC110 made in the 80’s in Japan for US market. They are both have unique sapphire base, similar specs and they came from the same manufacturer after all, just in different time. I have this Argent MC110 in my collection, one of the reason i prefer NOS vintage cartridges is the price, top of the line Argent DIAMOND (with Diamond cantilever) is no more than $3000 today, while the Etsuro Urushi is $8k and i am shocked that Etsuro Gold is $21k in USA.

The retail of Argent MC110 (the predecessor of Etsuro) from the same manufacturer in the mid 80’s was $385 in USA and Argent Diamond was $1200 in USA. Here is the document with prices and specs.

Hard to believe they can sell nearly the same cartridges, designed in the 80’s, but in better finishing for $21k in 2020.

Prices goes crazy nowadays in my opinion, not sure the quality goes up with the price, sorry.

After Mr.Fremer visited Excel Sound in they garage i was a bit disappointed, here is the video.

no secret, it’s Audio Tekne. I’m just making the point that it’s possible to buy direct from the Japanese without logistical issues. You will likely get far better service than any other dealer, which has been my experience. No PayPal, money is wired at a fixed low cost. English is not an issue. How do you think USA distributors are dealing with Japanese manufacturers? You think they can read and write Japanese?

Only if they do not have a distributor in USA, because if they have a distributor and still selling direct from Japan to USA then it’s dishonest to their own distributor. This is an exception, i can recall maybe 10 well known Japanese cartridge manufacturer that no one can buy from the manufacturer or even from the Japanese shops because they do not ship abroad. Someone at the company must speak English, but only to communicate with their distributor.

Also i remember @lewn comments after he returned from Japan, that retail price in Japanese shops for new High-End cartridges is the same or even higher than in USA. There is a tax in the Japanese shops on top of the retail price. 

@chakster no I do not own an Etsuro Gold.  Just pointing out what a scam dealers are, especially in the USA.

Like I said, I was merely pointing out that it is easy to buy direct from Japan IF the manufacturer allows it.  There are no language or payment issues as you pointed out.  My comments had nothing to do with whether they had USA distribution or not.

I don't believe the cartridges in Japan are more expensive.  You can see the retail pricing online if you search Japanese sites.