Why Isnt Techincs 1200 Considered Audiophile?


Technics is known for its rock solid build quality low wow flutter, low noise rock steady speed, great torque and powerful motor so why isnt it given the accolades as a musical turntable?
vinny55
I am not trying to take sides here (although I do have a Technics DD that is not even 1200), but is the jitter that theoretically or maybe even practically exist in these Technics turntables really that much worse than a stretching belt or some other reason (speed inaccuracy?) that made people invent direct drive in the first place?

Is the fact that DD usually reaches the speed, jittery or not, sooner than the belt drive important to anyone? It is to me, but I am curious what others feel.

To add a bit to arguments about the history, Technics 1200 was embraced by the DJing community because it made DJing possible. It was built fairly tough and it was direct drive. It was invented for everybody's music reproduction, but had advantages that DJs of the era liked. Initially, there was no conspiracy or a secret plot. Try scratching with your fancy non-jittery belt drive and see how far you will get.

It may be, I am quite sure it actually is, that SP 10 etc. is better than 1200, but buying one today for those mentioned $1200 gets you a motor with included platter. It is no problem for those who do not mind tweaks, combinations of parts, and so on. However, if you are not too keen on setting it by trial and error, Technics 1200 may give you simpler solution you will be able to live with from the moment you bring it home. Sound may be different, if everything said so far is true, but may be good enough to enjoy without waiting to achieve the right combination of parts involved.

Disco I went to in the 1980s had Thorens 126 Mk III, two of them. They were bulletproof according to the DJ who played them. Still, he never pushed the platter back and forth quickly.

Michael Fremer has established himself as some kind of a turntable guru of the world and, no doubt, he is deeper into it than most of us. He has his fans and I often read his writings despite being far from his fan. However, I wonder if an alternative guru would agree with him most of the time.

Beauty is in the eye of the buyer so some will find that Audiomods arm pretty. My first reaction was "how do you clean dust from all those holes?" It may not be important for the sound, or does it add something to compliance etc., but it would surely annoy me to oblivion.
@glubson, Jeff drills holes in his Audiomods arm tube as part of his efforts to remove the resonances inherent in the stock Rega tube. He also removes the black paint, and adds three internal stiffening discs. He then wires the arm with the customers choice of pure silver or Cardas copper, and installs the great KLE Innovations RCA plugs. He machines all the other parts (of his own design, far better than the stock Rega’s) out of aircraft-quality aluminum and stainless steel. Two models available, both bargain priced (495 and 645 British with copper wire, about 50 more with silver).
I've had the  SL-1600MK2 since the early 80's.  I bought it while stationed in Germany and paid $249. This thing is built like a tank; it is not a "DJ" turntable and cost more than the SL-1200 even thought they look and function about the same.  It's still going strong and sounds "audiophile" enough for my ears - and budget.  

Based on my research and comments on this site, I do plan to buy an Ortofon 2M Black cart to replace my Pickering XV-15 cart.  Not sure what to expect in sound improvement, but for the price difference alone I'm sure it will be better.  
Quote,   
"A true bargain (under $1200) is Technics EPA-100 and many more vintage Japanese tonearms made by SONY, JVC Victor, Denon, Micro Seiki, Audio Craft, SME etc, but people love to talk about some new ugly arms made in garage by some enthusiasts, seriously, the Audiomods is one of the ugliest tonearms ever made, do you think it’s better sonically than EPA-100 for example or better engineered than producsts from Victor Laboratory? Rega is another example of the ugly tonearms on the market. And why do you think the Audiomods is better than new Technics tonearms that comes with GAE?


Yes , as a matter of fact I most certainly do. Better isn't always a complexity or just highest cost thing, its how effective it is vs the cost input used to do the job. In this case, yes , clearly the Audiomod arm is a better performer at a better value , period. It has solid engineering in its design to reduce many issues that effect all arms and offers great adjustability for the price of most static entry level arms. The fact you feel the need to belittle something by calling it "made in a garage by some enthusiast", in a negative shade or base its ability on your subjective opinion of looks , like it or not shows a child like bias with no experience to back it up. Its about performance and value when it comes to this end of market, and some , this being one of them embarrasses some pricier arms and competes with many of the prettier, known and accepted better arms.
Some of the better sounding no bs products have often been designed and built by enthusiasts out of the garage fed up with price and performance levels. The popularity and praise the Audiomod arm receives from not only professional reviewers but a sea of happy owners, well kind of makes your view less on experience and more a blind bias.  Its nice to see the appreciation for some of the engineering of the past when sales justified investment by manufacturer ( and many with large losses in a brand name war, something many fail to recognize its impact) and then passed on to higher end consumers,  but, reality speaks a different view in the era we now live in. Looks are a very subjective thing and I'm pretty confident given the choice of looks or performance but not both , here, all would choose performance . 
To remind you , this is exactly what I did say about the new SL 1200 GLE...

"I have seen and heard the new SL 1200GAE , and other than being made to look like a MK11, it ends with the looks. Substantially better table in *all regards*"

Looks were used as a comparative to the original, not a slight to appearance. Most vinyl users I know always consider looks an added bonus, certainly not  mandatory because it is after all in the eye of each. Its humorous in my view when products and companies not made in decades by companies no longer around  in an era likely never to be repeated are brought up to support belittling the products of today. Always the cost of today's being "overpriced". The irony or humor , for me is , most that float that dream, is they have no idea just how much it would cost to remanufacture those yesteryear units today. The same prices for the better tables scoffed as overpriced, now!  Add,  a fraction of interested consumers to buy them in this century,and no brand wars going on to pour money into them at a loss as most are owned under a few umbrellas of "name brands".
That and most who tout the bygone vintage units never bought them when current because they were "too expensive and not worth it" , then.  But now , alas , they are better and far cheaper than what's new currently. The argument never changes, just what side people land on over time it would seem.  Sorry , its irony and hypocrisy makes me smile being one who owned the units of old when current. They were very good then, now in my opinion , very overpriced used and unless fully refurbed both mechanically and electronically they are not anywhere near their capability or reliability and many one chip away from the waste bin. When they are, properly done,  the price puts them against current, slightly used offerings that can outperform them. I like the fact that some have really taken the effort to keep some vintage units working to spec and also modified, isolated  , and bettered these units. Those enthusiasts eh, out in their garages and basements, the guys mocked and belittled when its not something that pro bias of ownership would change ones view with actual experience, or so it seems. Lets not forget, it was those same "garage enthusiasts" that brought mods forward to the table in title here taking out much of the weakness's possible making it a better option for some looking for Direct Drive and reasonable performance at a very reasonable price and ease of use to own. Like the Audiomod arm brings to the table. These two mated are actually pretty reasonable sounding at costs less than some mid level entry tables.
Why knock effort, value and undeniable performance for a segment of the hobby you likely are in at yourself..............Options that bring value and performance are a good thing especially when its not just a perceived or biased thing that a section of consumers seem quite happy to own and happily use. You don't have to be biased by ownership or preference to appreciate value and effort as an option as one more choice for those looking now, or belittling those that are and who's experience trumps ones  opinion based on of all things, looks...............

Kudos to all the "garage enthusiasts" who bring products to market that bring value and performance forward. Many of the best products in audio started out just like that...................  

The drive method argument is an old tired one. All methods have their virtues and their faults and their own sound. Its a preference as to what sounds best to the owner and what faults can be overlooked, not heard by some or massaged out and what faults will be over embellished from non ownership bias......

bdp24,

I suspected that holes on Audiomod arm were there for some purpose, but I have no real technical knowledge to even start speculating what the purpose could be. Before, I took it for granted that holes are there to make something better. Now, I know what the intention is. I do not doubt it is a fine arm and my comment about dust in the holes was more about being annoyed by the dust I could have a hard time getting out than it was about dust impacting the sound. However, I did stretch my imagination to the minuscle levels I sometimes read discussed in the audiophile press and, although I do not believe it matters, thought of someone some day for some reason saying that after two years of use the dust that collected in the deepest corner (are there corners in those holes?) changed some weight/resonance/another property of the arm and impacted the sound on the level previously unimagined. Again, I doubt it matters at all, but science of these things gets so finicky that it seems like anything could fly and be taken seriously. Audiomod arm got enough praises in this thread alone that, if I were looking for an arm and I did not dislike the overall look of it (in fact, I do not care about holes that much), I would seriously consider buying it. Regardless of if the person making it does it from pure enthusiasm or because his only intent is to make a lots of money. Is it done in garage, living room, or sterile environment of an operating room, would not influence my choice.

Thanks for your quick, but helpful, explanation of the arm and thinking behind it. I really appreciate it.