2. amps-preamps
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Our we Lazy?

I want to start this thread by clearly stating that the purpose of this question was not to fight or rehash the battle of tube vs. solidstate as one being ultimately superior or better than the other one.I hope that besides personnal taste and the different "flavors" listeners enjoy, along with system matching, there is agreement that in the last ten to fifteen years that reference tube and solidstate amps sound very much alike and more like real music. The days of euphonic warm or detailed but harsh-bright sonic signatures are gone when it comes to world class amps.When my audiofile friends and I discuss power amps we always come back to these questions;1}With the finest solidstate amps[Pass Labs,Rowland,Ayre,Edge,etc.]sounding so terrific, why put up with the hassle of re-tubing,getting the right tubes NOS etc.,and the expense of re-tubing on a on going basis?I guess one man's "tube rolling" for pleasure is another man's pain in the butt.2}The sound of a tube amp changes over time as the tubes age, why put up with this hassle when it can be avoided? We like the fact that a solidstate amp will preform at its optimial level everytime we listen to our systems. Please you all, these questions are sincere and not an attack on tube amps or their owners.As stated already the goal was not to fight over something that is obvious ,world class amps are world class amps regardless if there tube or solidstate! We have listened to wonderful sounding tube amps[VTL,LAMM,ARC,CJ,etc.]and thought they were great, however they offered no special virtues that would lead us to put up with what we regard as "hassles" compared with solidstate amps. We would love to hear from our fellow GON members regarding this topic and what has been your experience regarding this topic.Let's not fight but have FUN sharing our opinions and viewpionts on this topic. Remember we might just be "Lazy" audiofiles who rationalize our own position on this matter!
teajay
nsgarch's avatar
nsgarch
2,524 posts
 
For all the above reasons (as always, stated most concisely by Elizabeth) and one more, I finally gave up my beloved toobies.

The "one more"? I live in Tucson, Arizona!
Anybody know of an amp that produces COOL?
jafox
1,447 posts
 
Unfortunately this thread is becoming a tube vs. SS debate rather than posts by people who have heard and owned many of the great solid state and tube amps and know very well the strengths of each. I thought the point of this thread was to determine why us tube amp owners put up with the "hassles" and not just abandon ship to SS.

Pure and simple, I have yet to hear a SS amp that portrays the decay of notes in such a realistic fashion as do some tube amps. And even more so, this is true for a SS preamp. And no, please don't blame this decay characterization as "tube distortion".

Elizabeth: 100 million dollars before you're willing to try a tube amp? Geez, I'd be willing to try a SS amp if I won only $10. Ok ok, I own SS amps too. 8-) Trying a tube amp is not like getting the measles.

As for hassles with tube amps, I have had my share of problems with solid state amps as well....those darn caps shorting now and then! As for tube replacement hassles, well yes, it can be a few hundred $$ every 4-5 years, but all you do is take the "dirty" tube out of the socket and put in a "clean" one - it's sort of like doing your laundry.

Keeping an amp on for years and years says a lot about its reliability. But I suspect the Forte does not even come close to the performance of the great solid state amps of today. So how anyone can say they are not willing to try one of the great tube amps in their system when they do not have a SOTA SS in their system does not seem to be giving the tube world a fair shake. It's all about musical enjoyment. Why does this have to be such a polar issue?

Unless I was willing to pay at least $1k for an amp on the used market, I would stick with solid state myself. For music-only, I use an all-tubed system. For a HT based system in another room, it is all solid state. This allows me to experience what I feel are the best of both worlds for two different but equally enjoyable applications.

John
ucmgr
173 posts
 
Boy, you've opened up a jumbo can of worms. I've run the gauntlet, starting with all ss equipment and ultimately ended up with all ss with the exception of my tube phono pre. I've owned some pretty nice ss gear over the years(Spectral & Rowland) progressing to a combination of ss and tube(Rowland & Lamm & BAT) and gradually trading up to what some consider to be some of the best tube OTLs(Tenors). Each step was enlightening, moving me closer to what I thought would be my idea of real music should sound like. God those Tenors sure were pretty to look at and sounded magnificent, but unfortunately I had previously purchased speakers that were meant to be driven by more powerful amps. Let's go buy some speakers that offered a better impedence curve and were more efficient and see what happens. Done! But what if I want to buy another pair of less efficient speakers? I ultimately didn't want my choice of speaker to be dictated by my choice of amps so I traded my beloved Tenors for a 300 watt ss Boulder 1060. Does it sound as romantic or look as pretty? Hell no! It just sits there in all it's simple teutonic beauty waiting to be fired up. Does it sound as good? It's really difficult to directly compare the two, but when all is said and done, it sounds great to me. Do I miss my Tenors..yes I do, but not enough to go back. Take the journey yourself and see where it leads you. You might just end up on the other side of the fence just as happy as I am today.
chadnliz
3,736 posts
 
1markr had a great point, too many people here dont have fun with music anymore, its a constant battle with the "Ghost in the machine"...trying to achieve audio nirvana and get so caught up in thinking it can be better...it can be better, that I wonder why some even bother, it cant be fun to think you system is never "right" and to be in such competition with nobody but some imaginary audio demon is kinda sad, I know I can do better, and I applaud those who can and do get better, but along the way alot seem to have forgotten to enjoy the music, well im outta here, gonna go listen to "Steely Dan"
danlib1
819 posts
 
I owned a Pass X-250 for a good while. It was without doubt one of the finest purchases I ever made.

I now own a Cary SLI-80 Signature Integrated, driving the same speakers- Revel F-30's.

The Pass plumbed the depths with more authority, and had a crystal clear tonality, but the Cary sounds so "real" and engaging that I can't ditch it. I found biasing tubes easy, the amp doesn't get any hotter than the Pass, and like the Pass is beautiful to behold.

I'd sum it up this way. One isn't really qualitatively better than the other- they're just different. The tube gear delivers a visceral musical joy that I really dig at this time in my audio evolution.
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