Guys. Guess what? I'm the original poster. Thanks for all your comments. Lugnuts was my favorite - with the cost between cartridges because of the Lyra discount, that's probably the way to go unless price is unimportant. I've yet to offer an opinion by Raul but here goes - let him sonically masturbate all he wants. It's usually a solo activity, anyway. |
Dear Richard: +++++ " I've yet to offer an opinion by Raul but here goes - let him sonically masturbate all he wants. " +++++
This is very unfair from you, if you read my first post in your thread you can " see " that I posted what I think could help to you for what you are asking for.
If you don't like it what I posted there you only have to say so, but why you attack?
Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul. |
Richardmr,
I won't get into the debate on which is better, because I have not attempted anything close to a controlled comparison -- I can't even offer an opinion based on my own taste, complement of equipment, etc.
I can say that I was a long-time satisfied user of a Helikon. The Helikon is now in a friends system and still going strong after several years of relatively heavy use. By a large margin, the Helikon is the most durable cartridge I have used.
I am currently using a Titan. This is a much better sounding cartridge than the Helikon. It delivers a bit more of everything that is special about the Helikon (terrific rendering of subtle harmonic relationships, lack of murky/muddled sound (not a Grado!), decent dynamics, etc.), and it significantly bettered the Helikon in terms of a seamless quality from the bottom-to-top of its frequency range (the deep bass sounded a touch disembodied from the lower midrange with the Helikon, in my system). I like a cartridge that delivers a lively, vibrant sound, and this is something the Titan provides while not being overbearing and strident.
As a point of reference, I also have heard and liked a Transfiguration Temper V (very smooth and natural), the top-of-the-line-insanely-expensive Allaerte (warm and extremely seductive and musical without being muddled and inarticulate), and the VDH Colibre (I am not sure I could live with the Colibre, but once you have experienced its incredibly dynamic and energetic presentation of music, one is tempted to take a chance). |
Gmorris,
.
I am sorry that you are non-plussed and that my behavior could be to blame. I do hope you get your plus back.
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In order to remove any confusion, I am not a dealer, just a person who is more than tired of Raul's inane arguments, sanctimonious attitude and mean spirited comments. I do have a UNIverse that I paid for and have strongly recommended the cartridge to others. I felt like I was doing them and ZYX a favor. I have yet to know anyone that has bought a UNIverse that was less than thrilled with the results in their system.
.
I had sworn off responding / reacting to Raul about 6 months ago, but I was really got tired of his recent bashing of people & components with which he was not in a position to make those comments or the comments were just plain stupid/ignorant. There are people that can be influenced by those comments and it is not fair to them.
.
There are plenty of good/great cartridges available and I have certainly not heard all of them and more importantly not in my system. I do recognize that there are a goodly number of people that are quite happy/delighted with the more recent version of the Titan.
.
If you have the time and are inclined, you can go back and read through the threads where Raul has visited and posted and you might come to understand the reactions his comments elicit. Perhaps the individual comments he makes on their own dont warrant such a strong reaction from us, but when taken in whole from the many postings he has made, people just get sick of his B.S. He is consistently offensive amongst a group of wonderful people that I feel quite fortunate to know and interact with.
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I have not heard the Titan in any system and can not comment with how it sounds as compared to the UNIverse. I have heard the Olympus in my system and felt that it was only slightly better than the Universe (the Olympus was mounted on a Schroder Reference and the Universe was on a Schroder DPS, so it was not a perfectly controlled comparison).
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At some point when I am fortunate enough to hear a Titan in my system, I would be happy to share my experience / opinion of the Titan as compared with the UNIverse.
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You will forgive me if I have seemed a bit zealous or over the top about the ZYX products, it is just me being defensive with regards to Rauls ridiculous and ignorant postings. I understand his lack of full command of English (he speaks two languages where most here only speak one), but that does not excuse his crassness and willingness to stretch the facts to win an argument (that he started) at all costs. He is just a Royal pain in the ass that seems to be more concerned with his own aggrandizement rather than helping people. I have zero patience with him or his behavior.
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I hope my repsonse clarifies your confusion or bewilderment.
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Rgds,
Larry
. |
Cello:
It's good to see that you have retained some sense of humor.
I am in the process of considering the auditioning of the Titan and the ZYX Universe. I tend to use these threads not to make final decisions on likely future purchases but as a source of information on possible contenders for consideration. Ultimately, I rely on my own ears whenever possible.
Maybe Raul's style appears confrontational because of his lack of mastery of the nuances of English. To wit: by using the wrong word or using direct prose he may seem to be in an attack mode when it may not be the case. Having said all of that, I must admit that in spite of his perceived tone, Raul has made many legitimate arguments that cannot be dismissed easily by derision. It is apparent that he has exposure to a wide range of arms/cartridges and is quite knowledgeable. This is also true for some of the posters on these threads.
The bottom line: we should all respect each others opinions. |
Dear larry: +++++ " . I have zero patience with him or his behavior. " +++++
Please don't read and don't refer to any of my post and if you don't want to " hear " on me: change of forum.
You was one of the members of this forum that told us that the " Universe was the best on the world ": this statement is stupid and ignorant, no question about.
+++++ " . There are people that can be influenced by those comments and it is not fair to them. " +++++
So you think that that Universe statement is fair for them?, come on !!!! wake up.
I can remember when I start at this forum: all of you attack me because I don't agree with you and I have differents opinions . No one of you ( others people did ) care about that.
The problem with your club is that any one has to agree with you and when some one like me disagree then you react in a negative way. I'm telling you stupid/ignorant only because you use that words with me but I don't usually insult to any body in this forum like many of you and other peoples do with me.
What is all about: I think that all of you an me have more things in common that differences.
I always try to hrlp and be honest: I always post what I think and what is my experiencies. I know that you don't like it but that is up to you: I can't do nothing about.
My advise is that many of you have to break with those old audio paradigms that are out of today reality. I already do and that's why our differences.
Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul. |
Folks,
Your individual positions seem clear and it doesn't seem like there will be any resolution this way and with the choice of words. Remember, two wrongs don't make a right. Why don't you all call it quits on the rancour and move on to more constructive comments, albeit varying in opionions. As a new reader and contributor to Audiogon, it's sad to see threads turn out this way. I'm seeing it more and more. Let's face it; we are proud of the purchase decisions we make and we try to stand by them. But we also have heard the usual saying "this is the best" before. Please take this with a grain of salt. As we also all know, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. When we hear "the best", don't always take it in absolute terms. It might so happen to be the best the person has heard in the configurations they've tried.
Come on, let's be resonable.
Andrew |
Dear Gmorris: Tks for your understanding. I really appreciate that.
Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul. |
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Gmorris,
.
I continue to smile in spite of my reactions to Raul.
.
I think that auditioning a cartridge in your own system is absolutely the only way to make a decision on what to buy. Everything is so system dependant down to the tonearm cable, loading and phono stage or step ups. All can make a monumental differences.
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Since I last posted, a friend informed me that I had in fact heard a Titan in another friends system and I have to say that his system sounded glorious. I hope that at some point I am able to get a UNIverse in his system so that I can compare the Titan and the UNIverse.
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I think you are kind to give Raul the benefit of the doubt, but language is not at the root of his problems. He flat out misquotes other peoples postings and or exaggerates to win an argument or prove a point. I just can't stomach that behavior.
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I am not saying that Raul does not have valid points at times, but a good percentage of the time he is way off base and argues as vehemently when he does not know what is talking about as when he does. The newbie read his bravado and think Raul knows what he is talking about in all cases and that is my major problem along with bashing products that do not deserve the bad rap.
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I do respect opinions that are well thought out or from people that have sense of what the frontier of their knowledge is. Raul speaks in absolutes that he can't possibly know and it is wearisome.
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Do spend more quality time with Raul and see if you still feel the urge to rise to his defense.
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Rgds,
Larry
. |
Raul, I must make a confession. I have spoken extensively with both Cello and Vetterone, on the phone and in person. Both of them are considerably more intelligent than I, so neither of them need me to manage their arguements, but I still do laundry better than them.
Regards, and enjoy the music... |
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Nrchy,
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Please do not mix the whites and colors on me again and no starch in the collars this time.
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Rgds,
Larry
. |
Sorry Cello my notes said starch the boxers and no starch in the shirts... my bad. |
|
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Raul,
.
It has been almost year since I swore off responding to you out of frustration. After this post, I am guessing it will be a long, long time before I waste any of my time responding to any more of your ignorant or rude posts.
.
I went back over all the threads to check and I never said that the UNIverse was the best cartridge as you stated that I said. Here are my two quotes:
On 1-28-05 It might be the best cartridge out there at any price.....
On 5-08-05 The UNIverse is just one of the best cartridges available by a clear margin.
Those quotes are not me saying that it is the best cartridge as you quoted me. This is a typical example of you twisting or mis-stating the facts. This is why I have no patience or respect for your opinions.
.
Telling me to sell my UNIverse when you have never had a UNIverse in your own system: what is wrong with you and where do you get off giving such advice when you have no idea how my system sounds or how the UNIverse sounds in my system or yours (this is rhetorical, please do not respond) ?
. |
Cello, perhaps Raul wants to buy a Universe cheap and he is just trying to depress the s/h market :>) |
Well, I don't think, that Raul wants to influence the 2. hand market, it's his opinion. Others think different and some are sad, that the rest of the world does not follow their "experience".
Even Mr. Schroeder ( just for example, because he is always here to write a comment ) is V-E-R-Y thin skinned, when there is a comment about his arms which is not in awe. I understand it, he lives from it and the other ones ( like me ) are unexperienced listeners, have bad systems or whatever.
Good analog Reproduction depends from quality from a few factors, like Turntable, Phonostage, Interaction with the Tonearm and the wire in it and the rest of it.
A Forum is a platform to share interests and to share own experiences, a good chance for a "User" to think about a few things, which are probably not written in a magazine.
But is all true ? Well, don't know, a Forum is also a super platform to create a hype or to sell things easier. |
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Thomas,
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I have seen you and Frank Schroder bo back and forth a few times over the last year or so.
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It would be nice if you and Frank could meet each other at some point in the future. I think some of your conecptions of him would disappear and you would find a very special human being that you would be happy to know. He is not at all near the defensive/overly sensitive image that you might have come to believe through the Audiogon postings.
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Rgds,
Larry |
I missed all the action from the posts.My connection is down and I'll reestablish in about 2 weeks.Here I am at the public library reading the posts after several days not seeing the flame wars going on.
Yes I must clarify that possibly the system as a whole may have contributed somewhat to what I was hearing,But from my experiences with other systems I have heard in the past.,I still am sticking to my guns with what notes and impressions I came out of from the show.
I will make sure I go next year and will register with my user name and make my presense be known.I will also make sure I bring live recordings I've done of our symphony as well to hear what is really going on.I did have him put on an LP I am intimately familiar with Linda Ronstadt Whats New,and was extremely dissapointed with what I did not hear ,as opposed to what I did hear.Just no ambience retrevial at all.The sound was so shut down and closed in.
But I'm willing to give it another try next year.
I look forward too seeing all your smiling faces next year,
Best regards and enjoy the music.
I have a live concert to play Oct.22nd in Mt.Vernon WA.
featuring An American In Paris.
Log into Skagit Symphony and maybe a few of you will fly out and listen to the live concert.It will save you money on buying a new ZYX instead.
Bye for now
Don |
The Universe is a top quality cartridge, but in the room Chris Brady had the misfortune of setting up his Teres 360 NO cartridge would have sounded good. I couldn't stay in that room for more than a few minutes without getting a headache. Chris felt the same way and will return with a vengeance next year.
Does that mean the Schroeder sounded bad ?
Or is the Schroeder very hard to setup ?
Or is the Schroeder not a good match for the Teres 360 ? |
Hi Kha
I think if you call either Frank Schroeder or Chris Brady they will tell you what was wrong with that room.
It is certainly not a true reflection of either of those gent's products.
Paul |
Hi Paul,
why does Schroeder everytime someone post that the
system with his Tonearm sound awfull, he replies
that this is due to the setup, or mismatch of other
components in the system or the room etc....
As with other Tonearm, there are less responce from
the designer.
This gives me as a potential buyer an unsatisfied view
of the Schroeder Tonearm, as I am not willing to modify
the setting each time I hear an LP.
Regards KHA |
Hi Kha
I think Mr.Schroeder likes to "watch from the sideline" about what others are writing about the arm he makes because he knows them best. Like a parent looking out for his kids.
I was not at the show but having spoken the Mr.Schroeder he did the setup of his arm and Chris as a dealer and owner is probably more than capable of doing a adequate setup. WHen you are put in a show setting like that, with your doors open to the public "have to run what you brung". So I would attribute it to something else in the room, but a public forum like this I will not repeat what was thought to be wrong with the sound of that room.
I know someone who has is using a Schroeder Ref one and he cannot say enough good things about the sound it produces. It is not like any other pivoted arm he uses, but some may not like it and will be more than willing to state it a public forum like this. |
Hello Paul, dear KHA,
KHA, all I try to do is offer advice to (potential)customers on how to get the best out of what I consider a serious investment. If someone doesn't like what he hears even after perfecting his setup, then so be it. Other parents have beautiful children too...
Paul, I didn't setup the table in the room for which Chris Brady had provided his turntable as the analog frontend. Any attempt to improve upon the sound by readjusting the arm would have meant compensating for other flaws. This isn't meant to be an excuse, but as you said, if a hitchhiker gets a free ride, he can hardly complain about the poor suspension on that car(particularly if he's never met the driver). What I'd like to do is bring an entire system to the show, but this is rather impossible(distance, cost...).
Back to the original topic:
I did compare the Universe(copper coils, 2.4mV) with the Titan i for an extended period this summer.
The Universe has a very coherent and more "fleshed out" midrange(very seductive!), the highs appear to be ever so slightly rolled off, the low bass is a smidgeon soft, but extremely natural sounding(yes, this sounds like a contradiction...). It means, that the leading edge is slower than on the Titan, but the harmonic envelope, the "bloom" of, say, a bowed double bass comes a cross as less "hifi", more like the real thing.
The soundstage is vast(very deep too, when called for), imaging very "3D". Mid and high frequency detail rendering is exceptional, but not of the "in your face" type.
The Titan has a more "matter of fact" sound, very revealing, seemingly limitless extension at the frequency extremes. It's perceived speed and punch could be attributed to the "louder" highs and/or the leaner(some will call it more neutral) lower midrange. The soundstage is very wide and images within are "bold", with the images reaching not quite as far back as with the Universe(still very,very good).
My take on this is that the Titan i will appeal more to the engineer and the Universe more to the poet. They both serve the music equally well, only in different ways...
Impressions valid on my system only, ymmv off course.
Cheerio,
Frank Schröder |
Pcosta
Are you referring to the recent RMAF show at Denver?
If yes, I would agree that the setup was err... "less than ideal".
I did get a chance to listen to the Titan/VPI in another room demoing the Audiospace amps driving Harbeths and I was truely impressed by what I heard, certainly one of the better analog setups. |
Kha, these comments about the Schroeder/Teres sound at RMAF are foolish at best, or possibly borne of the desire to trash a great product purely out of malice.
The electronics in the room where mid-fi at best, and the speakers were unimpressive. Based on these facts, how can you determine that the arm and cartridge were to blame.
I will concur that the sound in that room was not real good, but to place the blame on the best two componants makes the reader question the wisdom of the writer, or perhaps their absolute intelligence!?! |
Nrchy:
In your most recent post you wrote:
these comments about the Schroeder/Teres sound at RMAF are foolish at best, or possibly borne of the desire to trash a great product purely out of malice
I took the time to re-read all of the responses on this thread. No one disparaged the Schroeder/Teres combination. The negative comments were specifically about the ZXY Universe cartridge low bass performance and perceived brightness. Your statement puzzles me. Your posture is typical of a shill or propagandist who deflects comments from the main issues and focuses instead on an issue that is more defensible and trumpets that issue to create a predictable emotional response.
Presumably, it is acceptable to write negative comments based on spurious data points about the Graham 2.2 but it is sacrilegious to say anything that could be construed as negative about the Schroeder et. al.
Your statement reeks of bias and dishonesty and portrays someone who is hell bent on ingratiating himself with the manufacturer |
gmorris please forgive my error. I meant to write Teres/Schroeder/Zyx combination. The purpose of these comments is clear, and has been stated plainly a number of times already. It is simply impossible to determine that the Zyx cartridge is the ONE item in the entire chain that caused the poor quality sound in that room. There were many products of questionable quality, the Zyx was not one of them, but even if it was how would you isolate it?
How much time did you spend in that room listening to other cartridges on the Teres table with the Schroeder arm, that you were able to determine the Zyx was to blame???
Gmorris you are right again! I am a shill for Schroeder arms. I sell them out of my trunk, or the saddlebags of my bike!!!
Actually I had never seen or heard a Schroeder arm before attending the RMAF, and knew nothing about the arms or Herr Schroeder.
To the best of my knowledge (do I sound like Clinton???) I have never spoken a negetive word about the Graham 2.2, or another other Graham arm. My comments were based on what I heard, and the salacious attack on the componants in the room under discussion.
My statements are based on the obvious facts in evidence in the room, that were available to anyone with two ears and an unbiased opinion.
I have no motivation to speak good or ill of Mr Schroeder, Mehran, or Chris Brady. To which one of them am I trying to ingraciate myself?
I own a Zyx cartridge, not the UniVerse since I cannot afford it, I just bought a Sota Cosmos, and a TriPlanar arm. I have no intention of buying a Schroeder arm, or anything else shown in that room.
My intention with my comments was to reveal your unsubstantiated bias against a product about which you know nothing! Am I being clear enough about my intention?!? |
George,I will tell you one thing,for sure.If I ever run for any elected office,and must debate you,I will absolutely drop out of the race.Your language command,and tenacity are too much for me!BTW--that was an off colored compliment,so have a little humor,this time!
Nrchy---What happened with the Cosmos/arm/cable(PURIST P.C./umbilical) issue?My wine is aging fast,and I want to crack open the bottle already! |
A call for peace and an opportunity to learn from each other ...
Like many of you, I grow tired of touchy personality issues on web forums. I'd love to see a fresh start with the slate being wiped clean. Perhaps I'm missing something here, and frankly, I don't have the time to surf back to trace this "pattern of abuse" which Raul has been accused of in this and other threads.
If individuals consider Raul's transgressions to be intolerable, then my comments are meaningless. Never mind ... OTOH, we can learn much from each other.
I'd love to focus on Raul's approach to system building. If you look at his system, you'll find an eclectic mix of gear which quite obviously did not come about by accident.
Raul is coming from a technical space that might be strange to some of you here, but it constitutes viable approach to reproducing music. I have not heard much in the solid-state realm that appeals to me on a long-term basis, but recently, I heard an effort by a denizen of Portland by the name of Gary Pimm (http://www.pacifier.net/~gpimm/) that turned my head around.
Gary brought an amplifier to the Rocky Mountain Audiofest that was in effect a tube amplifier with solid state devices plugged in where the tubes would normally be. The amplifier has interstage coupling transformers along with output transformers! After an audition with Robert Bastanis, the amplifier took center stage in his main room with his Apollo speakers.
If you look at the gear on Raul's system page, the only conclusion to be drawn is that Raul worked long and hard to get a sound he likes. I would expect it to be likely extremely musical, dynamic, and to scale extraordinarily well.
The best audio system I have ever heard was assembled by a local Denver area manic named Orey Block - a fellow who Ron Welborne lovingly calls "Danger Audio". Frank Schröder had the "Orey experience" while in Denver, but I won't ask him to comment ... he needs to build some tonearms for me :-)))
If you look at the voltages Orey typically works with, you'll understand the "Danger Audio" moniker - 2KV to 4KV is typical for him. Orey has designed and built amplifiers around rare transmitting tubes like the 450 TL, and is currently powering Raul's speaker of choice (ADS L 2030) with a push-pull pair of 150 TL's. Orey turns write around and throws a garden variety 6SN7 into the mix ...
Orey's system does it all ... It goes well beyond the normal categorizations of horn/electrostat/closed box, single-ended/push-pull /OTL and such. His system is the standard by which all of us in Colorado judge our systems. You don't buy this kind of stuff, but it's still instructive - even for those who don't know or care which end of a soldering iron to hold.
Back to Raul, systems in general, and analog in particular ...
I realize that this is an analog (turntable) based list, and will refrain from further comments about downstream components, other than to note that looking at Raul's rig with the above perspective will give you a good idea about his listening biases. I think that it's important to consider the whole (system), in order to better understand the person behind the post.
That Raul owns a very fine Micro Seiki turntable is further corroborative evidence of what he's about.
Let's not all be lawyers about this ... having to parse our words so carefully that we don't have the energy to get our message across. Sometimes, casualy thinking out loud can be productive - stimulating conversation and creative discourse.
We don't have to eat our young.
Peace,
Thom @ Galibier |
Frankly I think we should all give ourselves collectively a big thank you that LP's and TT's are still being made and available. Does not matter what brand of TT, arm or cartridge we own.
The reality is that the BIG electronic/hifi companies would prefer vinyl no longer existed, but due to our luv of music and the way all turntables play music we all collectively (consumers and manufacturers) have a format that will surely outlast CD and give us many many more decades of pleasure.
If analogue did not sound better why would we go thru all the hassle of setting up and playing records. I would just burn all my LP's to CD and sell off my records and TT.
kind of makes our petty arguing about what sounds better seemingly pointless in the larger scale.
Still good fun arguing thou :)
cheers |
I think it's time for a group hug ...
Some interesting statistics: this year, sales of new vinyl exceeded the combined sales of SACD and DVA.
Did anyone attend the seminar at this year's Rocky Mountain Audiofest on the future of analog? I'd be interested in the condensed summary.
Unfortunately for me, when I exhibit at shows, I don't get to attend any of the seminars. Heck! If I didn't have a second turntable located in the Artemis Labs room, I wouldn't have even left my floor.
Apparently, in the follow-up seminar moderated by Robert Harley, the future of high definition digital was discussed. I understand that Harley was dismissive of analog ... poor soul.
Blows against the empire ...
Cheers,
Thom @ Galibier |
