Wilson Sabrina X ... oh my God! and Jadis... or?


Well, I’ve been a sucker for high efficiency and low powered tube amps, but the other day was visiting a good store and they had several Wilson speakers; the man offered me to sit and relax enjoying the Sabrina X, with a Jadis DA-50s and... BIG MISTAKE! Cannot stop thinking in such beautiful, full, complete, non fatiguing sound, I had 2 hours of pure enjoyment, seriously Didn’t want to leave room.

So here I am sending all my stuff and getting what I really think is the final game? At the end, I’ve never listened to such expensive and fantastic speakers. Fed by the aforementioned Jadis, a Prima Luna DAC and a Innuos Zenith, a shame I couldn’t play some records, but He said He was even better with vinyl reproduction.

I started with Isaac Hayes - Close to You from Black Moses... the voice was spread everywhere the room and just came from the amp, which was in the middle of the rack, just amazing, also played some flamenco, funk, classical, Jazz, Blues, Bossanova, Samba, everything was just spot on and sounded far beyond the speakers, without losing presence in front of me, hard to explain.

Now that I’m in, and pulled the trigger for an Ivory ones, need a proper amp for a few months till my wallet recover or sell the stuff I have.

I have a Goldmund Telos 7, which is beautiful Swiss made small amp, 175wpc Class AB with a fantastic DAC inside. But wondering if going Tube path is the right thing, cause I heard such airiness, full bodied, non fatiguing and relaxed sound with Jadis that was awesome!

Thought about these ones:

-Jadis DA-50S
-Mastersound Duetrenta
-Audio Research GSI75 (someone sells to me at good price)
-VAC Sigma iq170
-EAR Yoshino 834
-Lyric Ti200
-Octave V70 Class A
-Any of RAVEN tube amps?

Solid State: (Thinking from the "most analog sound"):
-Pass Labs INT-60
-Mark Levinson 5805 
-Krell k-300i
-Boulder 866
-Coda (dunno much)
-ModWright (dunno much)
-Moon (dunno much)
-Kinki EX-M1PLUS

Not sure going Class D, although reading lately a lot about GanFet Class D amps like AGD, Java, Gato, Aavik...

I’m going integrated for now and for a few years, if it got a DAC or Phono inside, better, but can live without them inside.

What I don’t want to lose is that 3D, great body sound that valves used to give me, more into musical pure joy than High End nowadays.

Btw, speakers cables were Nordost and Crystal Cable, being the later one maybe more open and higher volume but maybe less controlled if I remember well.

Much appreciated, these Wilson left me in shock.

superelmar

Showing 2 responses by bdp24

 

@daveyf: Did you mean to say "MF" (which to me means Musical Fidelity), or rather "MR" (for Music Reference)? If MR, do you remember which model? The RM-9 is pure tube, the RM-200 a hybrid (solid state input stage, tube output). The RM-9 is a classic unbalanced tube amp, the RM-200 balanced, with only XLR input jacks. Both are push-pull designs, though Roger also made single ended tube amps, which at the end of his life he was quite enthusiastic about. He also offered his own version of an OTL amp.

Modjeski thought highly of the Acoustat ESL panels themselves (I recently learned that Roger Sanders was involved in their design), but not their transformers. He actually deigned a replacement for them, and iirc even a tube version to replace the stock ss one.

Roger’s death was a great loss to hi-fi, but his talks at the annual Burning Amp Festival in San Francisco are available for viewing on YouTube.

 

Here’s his 2015 talk, misspelled name and all:

 

 

The first viewer comment below the video is well worth reading.

 

 

 

Brooks Berdan Ltd. sold Jadis when Brooks was still living, as well as Wilson speakers. But he also sold Music Reference electronics, which he held in very high regard. Brooks had some customers who bought with their eyes, others with their ears. He carried Music Reference for the latter group. Sure, he would happily sell you a Jadis if you wanted one, but he recommended Music Reference to his friends (one of which I was proud to be. His wife Sheila hired my band to play at his 50th birthday party).

 

The thing about mating a Wilson with a Jadis is:

1- Jadis amps (in fact most tube amps in general) don’t "like" low impedance loads. Tube amps produce their highest distortion at low frequencies.

2- Wilson speakers present amplifiers with a very low impedance load, especially at some frequencies.

3- Perhaps worst of all, Jadis amps have a pretty high output impedance (low damping factor), which makes the frequency response of the amp react to the varying impedance of the speaker load. The Result? The amp changes the sound of the speaker in terms of frequency response. John Atkinson’s Stereophile test bench results on this issue are included in all his amplifier reports.

 

The above is why---contrary to the common wisdom that an OTL amp is the best for use with the original QUAD ESL, the exact opposite is true. The QUAD has one of the most wildly-varying modulus-of-impedance curves in the history of hi-fi (from below 2 ohms to over 100, depending on frequency!). Used with a high output impedance amp like all OTL’s, the frequency response of the QUAD is drastically effected. Not good, obviously. I originally used a Bedini 25/25 (solid state) with my QUADS, a classic combination.

 

Roger Modjeski was a big fan of the QUAD ESL, and used that classic speaker in the development process of designing his RM-10 amplifier, which is THE amp for driving the QUAD. I replaced my pair of OTL’s with an RM-10 Mk.2, and learned first hand that Roger was correct and the common wisdom was not.

 

But the 35w/ch RM-10 is certainly not appropriate for a Wilson loudspeaker. Roger had already designed and marketed a classic 100w/ch tube amp using EL34 tubes (four per channel)---the RM-9, still in use in many fine systems. But he knew there was a need for a tube amp designed to be a better match for low impedance speakers.

His answer was the RM-200. You can read the review by Michael Fremer of both the original version and the revised Mk.2 in Stereophile. Fremer declared the RM-200 to be his choice for the best "reasonably-priced" tube amp available, keeping it in his reference system and giving it an A grade in the mag’s recommended components list, where it remained for twenty years. Twenty years!

But Roger didn’t stop there. He was (RIP) a tube expert, and came up with a way of using just a single pair of KT-88’s and/or 6550’s to produce 100 watts. EVERYONE else uses a quartet of those tubes to produce 100 watts. So what, he runs the tubes hard to produce more power (a common tactic)? No, with clever design. The pair of output tubes (in each channel) last between 5,000 and 10,000 hours!

Atkinson’s tests revealed that the RM-200 produces more power at 4 ohms that at 8---unique amongst tube amps, and that it has an unusually low output impedance (for a tube amp). These two facts make the RM-200 an excellent choice for use with Wilson’s. No, the amp doesn’t carry the cache of a Jadis, but you can’t hear cache.

Roger left Music Reference in the hands of a trusted and knowledgeable associate, who continues to provide product support. If I just had to have a Wilson speaker (or one like it), and wanted to run a pair with a tube power amp, my first choice would be a Music Reference RM-200 Mk.2. They occasionally appear used for around $3,000, a true bargain.