Why the hate for mcintosh amps?

The puppy would be cheaper unless it's a French Bulldog.

I have no idea mozart fan. That's your invention. I wrote widebanders.

"Their design language is hideous." 

And your written language is pretentious.

Whatever that means...

That's mildly amusing is a grade school way.

emergingsoul,
Shame on you. Obviously a provocative troll of a subject covered a hundred times before. To each his own.

Well emergingsoul, you got what you wanted. Happy now? Like most trolls, you start a fire and walk away.

Thank you runboy. Finally a well reasoned comparison from a listener who actually has experience with the brand as compared to others.

fsmrz18 said:
"They just don't sound good by today's standards."

Just out of curiosity, what are "today's standards"?

If it was that stupid unsound, they wouldn't still be doing it after 50 years.

unsound,
Just because other manufacturers of SS amps don't use it doesn't make it wrong. It has practical advantages, and to some people, like myself, it sounds better than Mac amps that don't have autoformers.
There are many technologies that aren't widely used. It doesn't make them any less valid.

I understand your point unsound, but I would like to ask if you have been able to listen to a Mac with and without autoformers.

unsound,
I don't think that you were dumping on them, it was just your opinion. I am still curious about the comment about the autoformers though.

Unsound, you said:
"Autoformers in ss amps for the last 50 years only serve to compromise one of the advantages of ss amps with typical dynamic speakers, that of adapting power requirements with impedance load."
I didn't understand that comment, as the autoformers do exactly that; that is, they allow the amplifier to deliver full power into any impedance. 

gg107,
Your first reason may have been true in the past, but I think it hasn't been so in a long time. Number two is right on; they are looked at as old fashioned by some audiophiles who are dazzled by the latest technological twists.
Finally, they are as you say voiced (as all amps are) in a certain way that doesn't appeal to all listeners, although that voicing, in their SS gear has changed over the years.
I also think that their brand has been hurt somewhat in the minds of audiophiles who have no real experience with them by parrots who perpetually compare them to Harley Davidson and Rolex. 
That's really just a lot of nonsense, and I think is strikes a positive note to some who like to buy American (HarleyDavidson) and others who value good resale (Rolex)

Yes, about a million as you must be aware. Why would you even ask?

"If the MAC "fanboys" would admit they purchase MAC for resale value and aesthetics over sound quality the brand would become much less polarizing."
Another stupid comment that is just repeating what others have wrongly said many times before. "SOTA" sound is in the ear of the listener, no matter what the box it comes from looks like, or what the cost was. 
There are actually many people dayglow who buy Mac gear because they like the way it sounds.

Unsound,
You made some good points and no hard feelings. I have owned several Macs, MC300 for about 5 years, a MC2105 for about 45 years interestingly, a MC402 for a few short months. I also had a non autoformer Mac for a very short time that I didn't like at all. I just didn't really like the sound of either of those as much as my somewhat modified MC2105, so I really don't have blinders on about Mac gear.
That said, I also owned a wonderful ANK 300b Anniversary amp for 5 years, and I have to be honest and say that the MC2105 was not embarrassed in its company. Same for a Pass Labs 250.5 which sounded terrible in comparison to the MC2105 to my ears.
I also think that you may be right in thinking that part of the reason that they stay with the autoformer technology is that it is a strong part of their identity.
Thanks for your thoughts, John  

If only that was a joke...

Compared to CH Precision, Mac gear is dirt cheap.

"I would definitely up my game plan if I was attempting to drive a pair of MOABs."

Why? They are very efficient, more so than the Harbeths.
 Rep

starwarrior,
I don't mean to be argumentative, but regardless of the number of drivers a speaker has, the efficiency is what it is. The MOAB was designed to be used with lower power tube amplifiers or higher power solid state amplifiers if the user chooses that, but it is not required.

starwarrior,
I guess we're back to where we started. As I said, regardless of the size or number of woofers in the MOAB, they were designed to be driven more than adequately by lower power amplifiers, and many of their owners do just that. I myself own speakers which are large and have (2) 12 inch woofers each in a huge cabinet. I have driven them very successfully with an 8 watt tube amplifier, but also used higher power solid state.
I guess it's a case where we'll have to agree to disagree.    

Your opinion...

  "Imo, you are paying for the pretty blue meters....😄"

You're so original audioguy85. I never heard that one before.

I guess that the different speaker binding posts connect to different windings within the Autoformers.

Here you go again mozartfan. No one hates widebanders. No one is even thinking about widebanders, and as long as you like them, why would you care if they did hate widebanders? 

Who told you to use the 4 ohm tap? Users do experiment. There is no 2 ohm tap, so what did you mean "is 2 lower than 8?"

Is that supposed to be "funny?"

"Wildbang, speaker term?"

That's what I'm talking about mozartfan.

Your generalization is scary. Maybe one or more Audio Research owners can chime in.

I guess that he means that tubes don't last long in their gear, whether that's true or not.
Hey mozartfan, I don't think that you're a teenager texting anymore, so are you in too much of a rush to type "you" instead of "U"?

One silly semi-literate post after another...

It's spelled McIntosh emailists.

sricha20530,
What does your post have to do with McIntosh?

runwell,
Neither the MC352 nor the MC2100 have tubes in them. They're both solid state.

Different isn't always better, just different.

limomangus,

You must be kidding. There are many brands priced far higher. 

You didn't answer my question runwell. What amp are you using? 

walkertm,

I think that is a fair assessment of the brand.

Oh really runwell?...and what are you using?