Why HiFi Gear Measurements Are Misleading (yes ASR talking to you…)
About 25 years ago I was inside a large room with an A-frame ceiling and large skylights, during the Perseid Meteor Shower that happens every August. This one time was like no other, for two reasons: 1) There were large, red, fragmenting streaks multiple times a minute with illuminated smoke trails, and 2) I could hear them.
Yes, each meteor produced a sizzling sound, like the sound of a frying pan.
Amazed, I Googled this phenomena and found that many people reported hearing this same sizzling sound associated with meteors streaking across the sky. In response, scientists and astrophysicists said it was all in our heads. That, it was totally impossible. Why? Because of the distance between the meteor and the observer. Physics does not allow sound to travel fast enough to hear the sound at the same time that the meteor streaks across the sky. Case closed.
ASR would have agreed with this sound reasoning based in elementary science.
Fast forward a few decades. The scientists were wrong. Turns out, the sound was caused by radiation emitted by the meteors, traveling at the speed of light, and interacting with metallic objects near the observer, even if the observer is indoors. Producing a sizzling sound. This was actually recorded audibly by researchers along with the recording of the radiation. You can look this up easily and listen to the recordings.
Takeaway - trust your senses! Science doesn’t always measure the right things, in the right ways, to fully explain what we are sensing. Therefore your sensory input comes first. You can try to figure out the science later.
I’m not trying to start an argument or make people upset. Just sharing an experience that reinforces my personal way of thinking. Others of course are free to trust the science over their senses. I know this bothers some but I really couldn’t be bothered by that. The folks at ASR are smart people too.
How can you know? Objective proof? Check Ali Express. Available to your business friendly US market place. Ali express. App. There is a thread here in Audiogon. Did you send your Nordost cable to the company for authentication?
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If I were a Chinese, I would find this very insulting. And dare I say, racist. But I am not Chinese, but are you? If you are of Chinese descent, even if one of your one of your great great parents, you are absolutely excused
@amir_asr please change the wording before time runs out. I am very curious, what happened with your initial measurements of Vinnie Rossi linear power supply and his subsequent success later on with his power amps and highly priced integrated amps? He “fixed” it?
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@amir_asr great and dandy but why anyone would pay thousands of dollars for a Mola Mola DAC if a $50 CCP DAC can measure just as good within humans’ audible thresholds of hearing? Aesthetics? Explain this to me.
Do all Competent DACs sound the same? Amps? Preamps?
Thanks! |
I think ASR is a great service to community. Here is why:
Imagine a young dude with no money still in parents’ payroll. How would he base the decision on what to buy? He has no idea what good sound is, and no local audio stores. And he has no money, remember.
That’s where ASR comes in play. Bingo! Cheap China stuff that measures best. Numbers don’t lie. Parents HAVE to open their wallet based on proof from a highly regarded scientist. Beat it! |
Oh Cin Dyment @thespeakerdude : I thought you were limited to that one thread. But just like your previous 17+ usernames here (see list of your prior usernames below) you are proliferating everywhere, like you always have done. This time, slowly but surely. Sad bad creature…. ———- thespeakerdude
cindyment2
oddioboy
crymeanaudioriver
theaudiomaniac
theaudioamp
deludedaudiophile
thynamesinnervoice
cindyment
snratio
yesiamjohn
sugabooger
dletch2
audio2design
dannad
roberttdid
roberttcan
heaudio123
audiozenology
atdavid ———————
This time around you are pretending to be a speaker manufacturer. Which we both know it’s a made up fantasy. Post your credentials here, or even a list of your current stereo equipment (no need to post pictures or proof of what you play music with, I will take your word), and I will eat crow, no matter how many times you hate audiophiles here |
@prof : so, you mean you own the Devore speakers? And I am very curious: why do you pretend to be something / someone you are not? Everyone knows where you belong in the Great Debate. Do you have the testicular fortitude to say it? there is no shame. Let’s say it together: Amir. is. my. master.God.Holiness |
@prof : Matt Hooper. I am curious, with all the defending and Good Samaritan ASR work you do here, did Master Amir and his lieutenants forgive you for what you did on ARS? Just curious. He loves you again? No broken heart bad feelings?
For the below: please point to one single “subjective aspect of audio” thread you still enjoy and participate in. I am genuinely curious. In my humble opinion, all Bs. You know where you belong. What you say is just pure BS, to make people see you seriously for what you are NOT. See your subsequent posts below I am sure are coming, more Catholics than the Pope (Read more Amir than Amir)
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@prof : I would appreciate it if you answered my few questions. If you forgot them , just ask me. I understand |
@prof : don’t be shocked. We both know what I mean. Are you still in good terms with master? All the good work you are doing here must pay dividends and must not go unnoticed by master 😉 ‘Oh:
please describe your test protocols you conducted in choosing your current speakers vs. the Devore speakers you must surely conducted when choosing your current speakers
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What does that have to do with what I asked. A “member “ can send you a bunch of stuff for various reasons. Does that make you feel happy and accomplished with your life?
Also, if he spent so much money on a cable (assuming not a $20 Ali fake), don’t you think he is NOT your audience?
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@prof :
So, you admit this, but, at the same time, you questioned someone’s findings without posting proof of blind test? I call this hypocrisy. Please correct me if I misunderstood
prof3,276 posts @ other Anecdotes are not that evidence BTW, you say you’ve distinguished all sorts of things in blind tests, including USB and AC cables? Can you describe your test protocol?
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True. People who have no idea, and don’t know how good sound is like. There are many people like that. See my Original Post.
My camp? You have no clue what “my camp” is. Clue… just my experience. Good enough for me. Again, you do you. There is value on what you do. I am not stupid not to admit this.
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@prof : I am giving you points. Many points. A chance to redeem yourself with Master Amir. You are welcome! |
@prof I will not pretend I read your reply. I did not. Unlike you, I will not be a hypocrite.
‘’My question is: I thought you bid me farewell? No? It hurts? |
@prof : why do you selectively quote only a small portion of my answers? It reminds of the doctored Big Lie stuff. You are certainly learning from Putin And why you don’t answer my questions? Inconvenient for you? |
@prof : I thought you bid me farewell’s many posts ago? No? It hurts? P.s. I don’t read your posts. I know exactly what you would say. I am not a hypocrite. Kindest regards |
@amir_asr : thanks for replying to me. I understand your post, and I get your point. Regardless of what this exchange sounds like, I do appreciate what you do, and I mean it. You do you. There is definitely value on what you do |
@prof :
Vs, Devore speakers? That thread you had 78,000+ views on? Based on ABX blind test between the two I presume? If so, please do what you asked another member here:
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I doubt it. Wait for the next commercial blitzkrieg here shortly. Besides, even if he is gone, it’s OK. Cin Dyment (aka The Speaker Dude nowadays) can handle the entire forum single handedly
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That’s an observation that is spot on. I have observed it over and over again since the beginning of my involvement in the hobby some twenty years ago. The explanation is pretty simple, and can be tied to centuries/ millennia of human history: religion. Once one becomes converted to a religion, a believer, it does not stop there, they are heavily encouraged to become preachers, spread the newly acquired belief. That involves going different places, where the non-believers stay, in an attempt to convert them, make them believers. So that those “ignorants”pagans can see the Light too. Colonization, conquering, call it what you want. Thus the term “missionary”
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Cin Dyment @thespeakerdude :
How do YOU know? Also,
Who is “we”?
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Propaganda…. More Missionary work….
I am fully aware you are not writing this for me. I cannot be “saved”. And admittedly I won’t read it anyway. Hopefully you are saving a “poor soul” today. One poor soul saved at a time. Good luck
P.S. I know what you are doing, and why you are doing it. And YOU know what you are doing, and why you are doing it. Please stop playing the innocent/ generous card. Anyone with average IQ can see what you do. |
@thespeakerdude Cin Dyment:
How ironic. You play the victim here, holier than thou card, yet, you have violated the Audiogon rules at least 16-17 times by coming here over and over again with different usernames, after repeatedly being banned. Are you insane?
Here is a partial list of your previous Audiogon usernames:
thespeakerdude
cindyment2
oddioboy
crymeanaudioriver
theaudiomaniac
theaudioamp
deludedaudiophile
thynamesinnervoice
cindyment
snratio
yesiamjohn
sugabooger
dletch2
audio2design
dannad
roberttdid
roberttcan
heaudio123
audiozenology
atdavid
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I am 100% sure it’s Cin Dyment. Wait until he creates a brand new username here, and posts a bunch of screenshots of my posts. 😂😉🤦♂️, on this very thread.
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