Everything matters... That said, I believe a lot of folks get caught up in the PR (b*llsh*t) techno-speak or theory, and often the bling. Yet, good sounding cabling inescapably, has research, materials, and labor associated with its cost.
In any highly resolving system and most situations, I find the choices of good cabling to be a critical part of the HiFi puzzle.
To what Tonykay just queried, Yes really. Yes, seriously. Melbguy1 is sooo spot on! |
dvavc
56 posts
01-02-2016 8:29pm
"The point is that all "hi-end"(for whatever it means)) prices are totally baseless B.S., and rip-off. They never justified by any cost of materials or any other logical way or common sense, it never makes any sense at all and sooner or later each of us will confront the fact that $1000 component might sound on par or even better than one for $10,000 and moreover might use same or even better parts. People picking on cables just because it is so obvious to everyone that piece of wire can’t cost $$$$$$). However, components are no different, i.e. parts cost can’t ever justify the hi-end prices. A "trick" of "know how" that’s what sells, let alone those who doesn’t even have any tricks and sell overpriced fancy aluminum boxes, LED lights, fancy shrinks, etc.))). For some reason people, in their mind, identify better looking box with better sounding, without any regard whatsoever to what electronic parts are inside of that box. Bottom line - all this "hi-end" stuff, whether it is a cable or a component, is ridiculously overpriced, no, not "expansive" - OVERPRICED. I think manufacturers, when they sticking those ridiculous price tags on their goods are anticipating that it will be sold for 50%-75% less, however, lately prices went sooo out of hands that even that doesn’t help.)) And it doesn’t even matter how much one making, or what is the economy outside of your listening room, it just ridiculous in a relative term, i.e. how for example DAC can cost $40.000 (let alone speakers and/or turntables for $120,000)? A car cost that much requires plants, thousands of employees insurances, steel etc, etc., i.e. cost about 100 times more to build. One of my favorites is when something which in real life worth $50 priced about $10,000 but to add some credibility to that bogus, out of blue tag, they make it like $10, 015.23, like it was strictly calculated and justified to the last penny, like they been struggle to bring to you their best price possible but couldn’t make it any better because another .15 cents less would force them out of business.)))))) What a B.S. That’s why used it sells for a penny on a dollar, there are no real value in any of it."
So help me try to understand why you frequent A'gon and why you make the effort to post... If in fact, the whole thing is an overpriced farce, why even bother, really? Why trouble yourself? Why not just listen to tunes on your car radio and be done with all this? Or just pick up an honest and reasonable hobby like wittling? :) |
Mamboni,
"If a cable has significant resistance and reactance it will color the sound by interacting with the amplifier and loudspeaker. Using exotic cables to achieve a desired sound is not cost effective. Your money is better invested in monoblocks so that very short cable runs can be used. I use 4 foot runs of 18g solid core .999 silver Teflon coated wire. This cable has negligable resistance and reactance. I am most pleased with the sound. I run my signal straight with no equalization of any kind. Before I'd resort to cables to alter the sound i would use software to optimize the loudspeaker-room interaction. This is anathema to many purists. Yet they accept cable swapping with its numerous variables and unpredictable interactions. This is illogical."
To my ears and experience, why care to shorten the speaker cable path a few feet, only to send the source through a digital food processor (optimizing software), mincing and scrambling the source first?
AND monoblocks for the sake of short speaker cable runs? When in reality the isolation from crosstalk and doubling of power supplies make a far greater advantage.
Speak of illogic, you are kidding right?
I understand the repulsion to spending inordinate amounts of fortune on cabling to fine tune a kits sonic signature, yet signal wire is a must, everything has its own sonic signature, and unfortunately, much of the neutral to good sounding cabling is not cheap to produce.
Each of use must be in charge of our own sense of value and what we are willing to trade for it.
Perhaps you would benefit from more time here and in listening to discover a truly shorter and purer path to high fidelity. Only experience can reduce variables and increase predictably.
Happy Listening!
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Mapman, With all due respect, I don’t believe I misunderstood, I simply haven’t had the same experience at all in more than 40 years at this. And I too have a very solid reference in live acoustic performance. Perhaps this is a preference???
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Exactly what (dollars per foot) would be overpriced, snob appeal cabling???
I just want to make sure which camp I’m in! [|;^)> |
two more words,
or not?
Happy Listening!
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Maplegrovemusic, You obviously just don’t get it. You can’t disrespect someone and try to demean their POV and then expect to be respected for your opinion. We can disagree, that's fine but, we don't need the throwing of feces from cage to cage. Think about it. How about we get back on topic? |
This is not about differing opinions, civil folks can air an opinion or debate an idea without being trolls. Childish responses?... a product of Internet threads without moderators, anywhere else (off topic or not respectful? YOU'D BE TOAST!), or if someone tried to act that way at an audio club event they would soon clearly understand that no one cared to respect their view point or speak to them.
Too bad really. Happy Listening!
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Yes, I ask that earlier and would be interested to hear your opinion.
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Well, I just had friends over for a beer and some listening after swapping my entry level brand X cables ($400msrp) out from the monitors (tweeter/midrange) and replaced them with the same brand X extreme level ($1650) cable. I also replaced fuses (a slim wire on the mains) with Hi-Fi fuses in the preamp and phonostage.
The remarkable thing is I had noted a particular sweetening in upper frequencies and a much greater "humanness" and focus to the vocal bits, and a lose of edginess and slight grain to some upper frequency details. They noted the same and then we talked about the wire changes. It was more musical.
For me, this was a system upgrade worth the expense, especially since I bought the wire on A’gon used 9/10, already burned-in, and the fuses had a 30 day trial guarantee, of which I will not be taking advantage.
So, to my ears, (and wallet) this was a totally acceptable trade in treasure for performance. Whether or not this had anything to do with a "wire" purchase, I could not have cared less. It was a sound improvement. And this makes a case for feeling the need to buy expensive cables. Because they can work in the context of a "system". |
Caelin Gabriel has said a lot about the cabling industry and a lot about wire, including his own. A great article about mains cables, the sonic differences, and what can and can’t be measured, but still heard. I enjoy his closing comments (about the last five paragraphs of the interview). http://www.theaudiobeat.com/visits/shunyata_visit_interview.htm |
Nice piece of work Al. I agree on all points.
Happy Listening through better wire!
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maplegrovemusic, I'm happy for you too. Not trying to change your mind either... Just telling the truth about what I hear and what others have validated.
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maplegrovemusic, after reading your quote of James Tanners explanation about power cords "insignificant compared to the miles of wire it is connected to...blah, blah, blah" I’m confident I would never own a Bryston. Because apparently, he don’t listen to what happens in "real" world conditions with the last 3 feet. Mr. Tanners "scientific" theory sounds so logical and convincing if I didn’t know better but, it just doesn’t win out against what my ears have experienced for more than two decades. To bad Caelin Gabriel doesn’t make an amplifier... http://www.theaudiobeat.com/visits/shunyata_visit_interview.htmHappy Listening! |
chrshanl37, I would believe the burden is on you. For you are the one who needs some kind of irrefutable proof or evidence.
Many of the rest of us are satisfied with our first hand experience and poses little if any need to prove anything.
We have stated our experience and our opinions about that experience.
Perhaps you need to get away from the computer scene, go out of the house, listen, and discover for yourself what so many have experienced for decades.
Then, with first hand knowledge, you will be better equipped and perhaps happier about the audiophile experience.
Or if you would prefer, just continue to argue a baseless point.
In any case, I wish you happy listening! |
jl35, "I think your first point sums it up maple. We each determine what sounds best to us, and then decide what price we are willing to pay. Did a Stradivarius cost more to make? Can we prove it sounds better? Does it sound better? Tangential, I know..."
You sir, are spot on! |
