As for WC I asked in his thread and confirmed the Luxman should be my top choice so I will definitely be listening to that one and the Boulder. I believe the all the ones I listed except Pass Labs I can audition at Music Lovers Audio. |
It seems like the weak link in sound staging, speed, and definitely bass. Overall I don’t have anything against the sound out of the McIntosh, but it’s a little polite. |
Appreciate the feedback! My concern with the X350.8 is (1) WC didn’t like it much (2) no idea where I can audition one. Nonetheless you’re right that if I can find one to try, I should. I tend to not go much over 40-100W when playing loud but the 802s do drop to 4ohm at times. |
Good one, I’ll see if I can find the D’Ag. Room acoustics are quite good. Relatively small room, vaulted ceilings and lots of acoustic paneling and bass traps. |
I misidentified the Boulder. I meant to say the 1160.
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Thanks all for the suggestions. I’ve added them to my list to listen. I’ll need to research where I can hear the D’Agostino. As for why not the speakers.... no. And while appreciate the cheap Class D zealots, I’m not interested. I’m also not going to buy an amp that needs some ‘upgrade’. The McIntosh is quite good and sets the bar high. |
I’m in SoCal pretty regularly. Suggestion on a place to hear the D’Agostino? |
Simaudio 860A v2 might be interesting to try. As for the Arcam and Schiit, I’m assuming you’re just a troll. |
Thanks @gavman even a used 2160 is likely out of my price range, given they are around 60k new. Is that really true that the 1160 is 1/2 the 2160? There is little detail on the 1160 but it seemed like a class AB amp where the 2160 is class A? Another concern is that WC didn’t like Boulder (I think the 2050) and most of the magazines say it’s great if quite sterile. Either way, I will definitely listen to them both as they are carried by my shop of choice, Music Lovers Audio. I really appreciate everyone’s help. I’ve got until late November when I’ll have the funds.
ps can it be plugged into a regular wall socket? The rear of the amp appears to have a high amperage plug. |
I’m not sure about all of this chatter about how my speakers don’t work with tubes but maybe they will if I get the right amp or whatnot. I said I didn’t want a tube amp. I’ve got a tube line stage. That’s enough tube for me. Looking forward to trying several of the amps suggested here over the coming weeks. |
thanks, @mrc4u
You guys are a bad influence. I originally started thinking I was going to get the M900u which is only like 15k. Then, I started debating the Boulder 1160, at 27k. Now I've got the 2160 and Gryphon on my radar. I probably do need to keep it under 30k if I want to stay married though ;-) |
@ps where? I live in Campbell. I don’t know if many shops around that carry hifi equipment. |
Ishkabibil said he was mistaken. I’m not changing my speakers. I love them. |
I’ve got paternity leave coming up in a few weeks, so will hopefully have some time to visit shops. |
Will definitely find the D’Agostino to try. Also the ARC 160S, but still pretty sure I don’t want a tube amp. |
Re: cables. Open to changing but will settle on electronics first
Re: Innamorata or similar small shops. I’m not too interested in products that have 0 resale and aren’t supported by a company I expect to be around in 10 years. Nothing against those amps, but it’s just not a risk I feel like taking with so many better established companies making fine products. |
If going class d, I’d probably want to hear the Merrill 116 and 118, though I’m not sure where I can audition them except at WC’s house. |
@mrdecibel i just need to find a place to hear them. |
I received a wonderful note from Boulder on my question about the 1160. While I have not heard it yet, I suspect this one will be at the top of my list going in to listening sessions. I'm incredibly happy with the 508 Phono and the build quality is top notch. |
I do plan on auditioning in home... |
I don’t know where around here I could listen to pass. |
I didn’t. I did hear the new Spectral DMA 300 SV. It’s very nice. Didn’t hear a comparison so didn’t have a baseline. |
I may try to stretch my budget for the Boulder 2160. Seems like it has everything I am looking for. Speed, bass weight, accuracy while still being musical, solid state, fits in a rack, and loads of Class A power. |
Cables are Transparent Reference, specifically chosen to match the Boulder setup. I could get the Boulder pre-amp, but it's 55k and I quite like the little bit of character I get from the ARC Ref 6. The Boulder Phono is wonderfully neutral as well, and now have a Lyra Etna SL (just totally blows away the Koetsu Onyx Platinum). |
Man, I hope that’s Canada dollars for the 4S. I’ve got a 2019 RS and love it.
Sure, I’ll probably upgrade the preamp like everything else. Speakers would probably be next. Would rather not compromise on the amp though. |
I’ll try to get up there to hear the 860v2 but don’t love the idea that it’s only Class A up to 5W. The Boulder 1160 is 17W of Class A and the 2160 is 600! (1200W into 4ohm)
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I suspect the Lyra is closer to $3 per LP but the point is valid. No turbo in the RS. 520 naturally aspirated horses that rev to 9000. I do plan on trying the Ayre as well. From what I read, the Boulder 2160 might be tough to beat. That said, I don’t think it meets one of the major requirements. I just happened to look at the dimensions. It’s freaking gigantic. No way that thing is fitting in a rack.
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Tracking a car will give you a new appreciation for the cost of consumables. $700 for new tubes doesn’t seem so bad when brake pads are the same price and last just a half dozen days. |
@jackaro that’s a really great data point, thanks. I was eyeing a used set of 750 SE I had seen for a great price but I had this feeling in a back to back test, SS would really crush the tubes on clarity. It seems like I probably made the right choice with the tube preamp. Will definitely look in to the options you mentioned. Thanks! |
@douglas_schroeder I have not considered it
for a couple reasons. First, is that the Mytek seems to have this tendency to jump the volume around based on my computer’s settings and I just know I am going to blow out a speaker if I trust it. Second, when I do replace the Mytek with the Rossini, I’ll probably try it, but need a preamp regardless for the phono side which is, if anything, more important to me. I do appreciate the suggestion and will definitely try it with the dCS.
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@tomic601 thanks for pointing me towards that review. It confirms what I was hoping, that the Rossini is a DAC with nearly no peers. As for using it as a preamp, I’m not sold. I like the sound of the Ref 6 and can’t really picture myself going through the trouble of doing a pointless A2D and D2A for my TT, which is the thing I listen to the most, by a wide margin. |
Like everyone else, improvement in sound. Musicality, clarity, bass speed, and sound stage. With the Boulder phono and Amp with Transparent Reference cables, I think I will be set up pretty neutral for any other changes I would want to make in the future like cartridges and speakers. That said, I want to make sure I hear lots of options. |
As for price, it’s simply the most I can comfortably spend on it. The Boulders are 28k for the 1160 and 53k for the 2160. |
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@ps yes, lots of Gik Acoustics panels and bass traps |
Already have the highest quality vinyl and the Rossini is no slouch as a DAC. Expecting in home listening later this month. |
Hoping to pop up to Audio Vision soon |
I've heard several of the amps so far, but none in my system. That's going to be challenging, as no store is going to do a home trial for a new customer. Having listening to halo options from Air Tight, Plinius, Chord, Linn, SimAudio Moon 880M, Mac monos, and a few others, not sure I could make any judgement as they were in different systems.
That said, near the very top of my list was the Gryphon Antileon Evo Stereo. It splits the price difference between the Boulder 1160 and 2160 and provides a full 150W of Class A power.
So, I called a shop I had been meaning to check out for some time, Audio Vision SF. Wow. The person on the phone (name intentionally omitted) was dismissive from the very beginning, seemingly assumed I had no real interest in the amp, and couldn't afford it, even after telling him what else was already in my system. He was as unfriendly as I could have imagined - like a really bad used car salesman. Then, he topped it off with saying I need to pay HIM $250 for the honor of listening to the amp. Yes, you read that right. He wants me to pay $250 to shop in his store. LOL!
Anyway, back to Music Lovers. They have been the nicest, most welcoming audio shop I have ever been in, and really have gone above and beyond to help me out, from the very first phone call. I'd rather settle for not having tried every amp to get the sort of service I get with this shop. Highly recommended. (I have been going to the Berkeley location). |
I maybe would have understood for an in-home trial, yes! But this was literally for what he said was “an hour of their time in a dedicated room in their shop”. I was blown away. Why does anyone shop there? I read the Yelp reviews and it seems like I’m not the only one with this experience. Avoid! Not sure how else I would try out the Gryphon. Will stick to Luxman and Boulder for in-home.(less interested in the Ayre) |
@eziggy I am sure Music Lovers will take care of me on price and support. At the moment leaning towards the Boulder 1160 with the option to get the 1110 preamp down the road. Need to hear it in my system first to make sure it sounds good in my room. |
I’ve not personally auditioned anything substantially more expensive than another item and found it to be inferior. I’ve auditioned a lot of stuff, but not everything, so I’m sure it happens, especially with the more obscure stuff out there. I think it’s a safe to infer that substantially more money will get better performance. |
Agreed. I’ve discounted the 160S for just that reason and will also likely replace the Ref 6 with the Boulder 1110.
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Demoing then Boulder 1160 on Thursday in my system. If I like it, I’lol probably pull the trigger on the matching preamp too. |
scratching my head a bit on the integrated suggestions.... |
@varyat how? This has been my problem. There is only one shop that's willing to let me hear in my home, and they only carry a few brands. I'm not going to buy without hearing it. |
@georgehifi thabks! Very excited about it. |
Ordered the Boulder 1160. Likely getting a Boulder pre-amp as well to replace the Ref 6 (though it's a pretty great pre-amp already). That would leave me with Boulder Phono, Pre, and Power, and a dCS DAC. Am I done upgrading? Probably not. Speakers at some point. At least I'll know that I have a very neutral system, so pretty much any speakers should work. |
I did hear it at home, yes. I would say it sounds detailed and powerful. I will say, the McIntosh MC452 really held up well. I’ll be selling it, but I do mean it when I say that it’s the best amp I’ve heard in that price range. You can pick up a used one for under 5k. As for the Boulder, it’s 28k, so not fair, but it really just did everything better. It doesn’t really have a signature I could point to, but just felt like it was faithfully reproducing music and letting my other components shine. As will the Boulder preamp. |
I've had the Boulder 1160 (with 2110 preamp) for a while now and I really can't imagine a better setup for my Wilson Alexia 2s. All the amps mentioned are excellent, but the Boulder was for me. It's powerful, warm, and highly resolving.
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