Where to go after Bel Canto Ref1000MKII

Mcintosh 1201 monoblocks, BAT VK-600se. The two SS amps I have heard with the B&Ws that I liked best(Mac 2301s for tubes)

Doggie,

THe BC ref1000m has very high damping factor, 1000, perhaps the highest of any amp I know of. That was a selling point for me in my application with my large OHM 5 speakers that are known to benefit from high damping.

Do you know damping factor of the NEmos? I am guessing it is significantly lower.

That would account for the perceived leanness in the bass with the BCs. It is a godsend with the right speakers that benefit from high damping, like the larger OHMs I use, but may result in perceived leanness with some others that do not require high damping. I suspect the Thiels might fall into the latter category but not sure, the B&Ws less so.

WHen I first heard my BC ref1000ms on my Dynaudio monitors, my first reaction was what happened to the bass? What happened is it was more highly damped yet correspondingly more articulate than ever before.

ANd yes, I agree that use of a tube pre-amp works very well to help balance things out.

I use the ref1000ms with both large OHMs and small Dynaudio and Triangle monitors. The Dynaudios draw me in every time, though some might still consider the bass to be towards the lean side. Even more so with the Triangles. With the large OHM 5s, pretty much close to perfection I would say.

SO bottom line system synergy top to bottom is important and damping factor of amps should be a major consideration.

Also consider that the EC Nemos list for almost $30K a pair from what I read. THe BCs go for $6K. That's a big difference in cost. One would expect the Nemos to hold an edge, however slight that might be. If a tube pre is all that is needed to bring the two closer in performance, that is still quite a trick for the BCs. Not to mention the huge differences in size, weight, and power consumption. Those are really the things that would lead one to go Class D over a high performence monster amp. I know it was in my case. It's truly a David versus Goliath type scenario! Pretty amazing!

Hi Doggiehowser,

Based on our correspondence and other opinions out there and my own experiences, I'm leaning towards the McIntosh MEN220 Room Perfect solution. My goal is to get the speed and lack of coloration one hears from live unamplified music. I've heard super systems that come so much closer to this ideal, that they make my current system sound positively entry level--same for 99% of the other high-end rigs I've ever heard. I love my C2300 pre--it's put many others to shame, I love my SME10/IV.Vi/Dynavector XV1s, the 800Ds are the best overall speakers that I've heard short of a couple of megabuck rigs. The amp could be standing in my way, but given your experience I think I better go after the room acoustics first. My in-room frequency response isn't flat, and sound is not in phase in the sweet spot. I'm thinking I better get that sorted out and see where things stand. It's a cheaper experiment than amps or speakers, by a lot. (And, I've heard the 22k Lyngdorf system--Room Perfect is it's claim to fame--and it's got a good deal of the sound quality I'm after.)

Your help has also reinforced my suspicion that adding two Bel Canto Ref1000mIIs would result in increased bass heft--and better clarity at high volumes, I'm sure. Not areas I feel are so wanting, but I'm curious. I am an audiophile, after all. ;)

Just FYI, the Nemo has a damping factor of 850. Not as much as the Bel Cantos but it is pretty high vs most amps.

I got a good deal on the Nemos used so it was a no brainer.

And I get to put my REF1000Ms now for a full 11 channel power amplification for my home theatre ;)

As for preamp, my friend moved from the 2 box McIntosh 500? preamp to the ARC 40th Anniversary. We all thought it was quite a good upgrade over the original and very close to the CJ GAT

Dhartwick, Good instincts, if you feel your room is off more than likely you're right. Having the same speakers as you I can tell you they have the potential to be FANTASTIC. OTOH because of their revealing nature, they can shine a spotlight on any shortcomings anywhere in the chain and sound mediocre. I have had to adjust speaker placement and further dampen the room with each upgrade. No doubt your room is important.