2. amps-preamps
  3. 1206044020

Whats with the Watts ??

Hi everyone. I'm starting an audio system for the first time and I've been doing my homework -- reading and listening as much as I can. Sorry if I ask some dumb questions along the way...

One aspect I'm very confused over is how much power I need in an amp. So many highly rated amps seem to be in the 50 watt range, yet there are also those in the 100's of watts. My room is about 25 x 15 with a ceiling that slopes from 8 feet at one end to about 18 feet at the other end. The room has 3 walls but opens up into a foyer on one side. I listen to all types of music, but mostly blues, jazz, and some rock. I like to listen at low to medium volumes. Its rare that I would play very loud. If it's important to my question, I seem to prefer the sound of solid state amps.

Being uneducated on the subject, my initial thought is, get more watts. Better to have too much than too little. So my questions are; how many watts should I be looking for and is there something to be gained or lost with too much or too few watts? Thanks.
silver911

Showing 10 responses by rodman99999

rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
The idea that a doubling in volume takes twice the power is incorrect, but a common error. Our hearing is logarithmic, while the db or power scale is linear. It actual take 10X the power to produce what we hear as a doubling of volume. For more insight see: (http://www.audioholics.com/education/frequently-asked-questions/relationship-between-watts-and-dbs)
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
Since you mention a liking for solid state, and this is your first foray into high-end: You might look into the Plinius 8200 integrated (http://www.pliniusaudio.com/reviews/review01.asp). Good power, tranparency and accuracy(for SS). Magnepan will ship you a pair of MMg's to audition with no risk (http://www.magnepan.com/). If you like the way they convey the music- send them back and get a pair of the 1.6's(the MMg's will be bass shy). The 1.6's have more/better of everything. Place your system at the end of the room with the low ceiling and that will serve to eliminate reflections to your listening position. The room is ideal for planars as they need space between them and the back wall to sound their best. You should be able to recreate a really nice sound stage, with minimal room interaction, because your dimensions are uneven and the ceiling sloped. Planars would reduce room interaction further being more directional than most cone systems.
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
Montytx- And you stated that absolutely correctly. Given Silver911's admitted "tyro" audiophile status: I thought it would be good to head a possible mis-perception off at the pass. A large number of people have the idea that a 3db SPL increase at the ear will be HEARD as a doubling of sound(since 3db IS a linear doubling of the pressure level). Sorry if you thought I was attacking your knowledge base, but I'm certain you can see the possibility of a mis-understanding.
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
Silver911- It's always better to have more wattage available than what you need. Turning an under-powered amp up will only lead to distortion(never good, unless you're playing rock guitar live). You said this was going to be your first audio system. That's what I based the "tyro audiophile" comment on.
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
Your guitar amp only has to amplify one instrument, and that in a limited freq. range, a note or a chord at a time. Your audio system will have to reproduce all the instruments and voices, and in all the octaves that comprise music. That CAN use more power: again depending on the efficiency of the speakers you choose. Also- It requires more power to reproduce the lower frequencies(long wavelengths) than the higher(though most of the music is in the mid-range). Most people don't listen to music at actual live levels because most systems won't move that much air, but- it's possible. As you know- When driving your tube guitar amp hard: the resultant distortion is desirable and referred to as an "effect". Solid state amps will even have an effect button, or you can buy a pedal to simulate the effect of a distorting tube amp. No distortion is desirable during reproduction IF you want accuracy in your listening.
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
Silver911- Are you taking your own recordings with you to listen to, or relying on what the dealers have on hand? It's always best to have your own recordings, material that you know sounds good on a correctly set up system. Do you have a friend with a correctly set up system, and some well engineered CDs? Otherwise there is really no reference to compare the auditioned systems by. One may have lousy CDs, and the other excellent ones. that could also explain the Maggies sounding better on one type of music than another(one CD being better than the other).
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
Good move!! Did they sound equally good on anything you auditioned? Here's a short treatise on damping factor: ( http://www.crownaudio.com/pdf/amps/damping_factor.pdf) Some will tell you it's baloney. All I know is the amp I'm using to bi-amp my woofers with, has a very high damping factor(1000 to 1kHz) and a fairly fast slew rate(150V/ms). My bass is extremely articulated, even with the drivers in a transmission line(virtually no system damping). A treatise on "slew rate": (http://www.amplifier.cd/Tutorial/Slew_Rate/SlewRate.htm) PS: I'm not suggesting Crown in a home system. They just explained damping factor well.
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
Most SS amps have negligable output impedances, thus relatively high damping factors(Use the shortest cables possible and/or true bi-wire cables). Few will have the midrange liquidity or sound staging of tubes though. I'm using a Hafler TransNova 9505 for my woofers, and could live with it full range(if I had to: MOS-FET output). Bryston makes good stuff. Balanced Audio Technologies, Plinius, and Edge(excellent SS) are all available used on this website at reasonable prices(pay attention to feedback of seller). Moscode has a tube driver stage/MOS-FET outputs and they offer a risk free, in home audition: (http://www.moscode.com/) You can roll the tubes for even better midrange and sound stage with that option, and still have excellent bottom/high output(read the reviews). Here's another source for used/demo/new sealed stuff, either tube or SS: (http://www.upscaleaudio.com/view_category.asp?cat=31) Kevin is reliable/knowledgable.
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
More info on the Moscode:(http://www.stereophile.com/tubepoweramps/606moscode/index2.html) (http://www.avguide.com/products/product-3459/) Download the review on TAS page. If I were to go with a single amp system, I would probably audition this first(can't lose).
rodman99999
6,206 posts
 
What are you thinking about with regard to a preamp? An integrated would simplify the system/eliminate an interconnect. Musical Fidelity and Chord build some excellent units.
More to discover